MovieChat Forums > Prick Up Your Ears (1987) Discussion > How Accurate was this movie/Couple of ??...

How Accurate was this movie/Couple of ??s

posted 17 years ago by Catdubh
3 replies | jump to latest

I see there are quite a few Orton fans here and I have loved reading many of the posts. I gathered from the movie, and from many of the posts on this board, Orton was no less than a genius! I just am sorry I haven't read or seen any of his work.

While Orton may have been a genius, the movie also depicts him as an egotistically cruel man. Halliwell seems to have contributed a great deal to Orton's work and appears to have collaborated with him on more than one occasion. Orton and Halliwell are obviously partners. After the two have been together and Orton begins to become successful, he treats Halliwell worse and worse with each passing day, it seems! He is embarrassed by Halliwell and treats him with almost utter disgust. If the movie was accurate, it was no wonder Halliwell "lost it" with Orton's mal and underhanded treatment. Although, Halliwell appears to kill Orton out of jealously and not because he was tired of Orton’s bad behavior. I am in no way advocating Orton deserved to be killed or bludgeoned to death with anything, let alone, a hammer. Had Halliwell not taken his own life, a charge of Manslaughter with mitigating circumstances surely would have been fitting. Halliwell was clearly in love with Orton and treated him very good. Yes, he did have his problems, big ones, too. He was neurotic and paranoid but Orton definitely inflamed Halliwell's neurosis and paranoid tendencies!

Did Orton truly love Halliwell? If so, why was he so cruel to him? Anything else, too about their relationship would be enlightening.

See what a difficult situation you've created. Proud of yourself now are you?

[–] retrogal83 17 years ago

Joe didn't mean to be cruel - he was more of a self-indulgent hedonist than anything else.
Their sex life had dwindled and died long ago, and they lived together out of a rather dysfunctional need of each other, in their presence rather than for sex.
He said himself that he would never leave Kenneth - he really did love him in his way and recognised the fact that, when it boiled down to it, they needed each other.
Kenneth had his share of lovers as well - neither was "faithful" in the traditional sense of the word, sexually speaking.
It has been recorded that for some reason they physically couldn't have sex - due to problems between the two of them on emotional levels.
When living with someone with severe mental health problems (as I have experienced) you need to find release from the incredible strain you are put under. It does not mean you love them any less, but the pain of seeing someone you love dearly suffer in such an awful way leads you to escape somehow. Joe needed affection which he wasn't getting at home.
For all his patience and love, he was - very understandably - frustrated, troubled and somewhat angry. It is no wonder that this tragically sad relationship ended in the way it did.
Kenneth felt threatened, ultimately - and he finally snapped. Joe probably didn't comprehend the magnitude of Kenneth's problems - but it is impossible to get inside someone's mind completely. The psychology is far too complex - especially inside such a mind as Kenneth's.

I think even Joe's family didn't bear a grudge too much - after the two men died and were cremated, their ashes were mixed together. That really did happen, not just for the film. I also think that they should not be judged too harshly for the way they lived their lives - theirs is a terrible story, with a love that destroyed both of them.

***GET TO FECK!***

[–] Catdubh 17 years ago

I think even Joe's family didn't bear a grudge too much - after the two men died and were cremated, their ashes were mixed together. That really did happen, not just for the film. I also think that they should not be judged too harshly for the way they lived their lives - theirs is a terrible story, with a love that destroyed both of them.

Thank you for that wonderful explanation. I truly liked the movie and thought Molina and Oldman were FANTASTIC! I thought it was a heart-breaking, well, love-story. I found myself crying in a few parts (I did not want to admit that, earlier.). Too, after you explained the complicated facets involving Orton's inability to truly comprehend Halliwell's issues and the degree of Halliwell's deep rooted problems. (as many couples have this same problem, where one is effected by mental problems or illness, the other often simply can't understand what their partner or loved one is feeling or enduring.) (Sorry about the poor grammar!)
Oh no, I do not judge them or their lifestyle. LOL, believe it or not, their's was REALLY not that different from many, many other couple's lives. Many, many couples have complicated problems where one or both are struggling with addiction, mental problems, infidelity, abuse, and on and on. It is just our society in the US has been very good at covering up these problems and "not talking" about them, for decades. I assume the UK is and was very much the same. The British don't like to "loose face".

See what a difficult situation you've created. Proud of yourself now are you?

[–] retrogal83 17 years ago

You're very welcome :-)

I have been a fan of Joe Orton ever since I was about 16 (I am 24 now) and I always am astounded at the strength of love they had - even to the point of destruction. You are right in that mental health problems are very much a taboo in UK society (as you say it is the same in the US). I think that this is because it is a "hidden" illness, with no physical manifestations, just the effects of a tormented mind. It is so distressing to see and people are terrified by it.

I also cried at the film - it is a simple and straightforward premise with complications nobody can really understand. It is one of my favourite films of all time - it has far more feeling, pathos and insight than most of the high-budget, over-hyped nonsense that is churned out 10-a-penny by film companies, under the false illusion that "expensive = excellent".

I think modern relationships can learn a lot from Orton and Halliwell: a perfect example of how devotion and responsibility go hand in hand; the commitment shown is really very touching. So many relationships fall apart because some people panic when the going gets tough and scarper because they are frightened. Joe was scared and overwhelmed - but he stayed.

God Bless them both, I say :-)

P.S. I knew you personally weren't judging them - I just meant in a general sense :-)
P.P.S. Don't worry, your grammar was OK. Lol!

***GET TO FECK!***