MovieChat Forums > Carmen (1984) Discussion > Arias cut from films of Operas

Arias cut from films of Operas


I've just mentioned this on a thread about "Tales of Hoffman", why do directors/producers feel the urge to cut music from filmed versions of Operas? There's a wonderful trio in the third act that is supposed to come right after Carmen's aria about the cards... where was it? Not only was it light relief after a tense moment, but it's a good piece of music - at least in my opinion. Please, leave the music intact - or simply film an opera direct from the stage and keep your meddling fingers off the score!

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I do agree!

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In adapting a source for the screen, it is the director's prerogative to include or cut any portion of the original to fit his or her vision of the film. Operatic works are not sacrosanct or exempt from this process. If you wish, when you direct YOUR interpretation of Carmen you may leave everything in.

I don't think I want to go to the pictures. Oh?Why not? I've seen everything worth seeing.

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I don't know what version you were watching, but the Card Trio is in the film. Carmen realizes what the cards are saying while the trio is being sung.

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I was about to say the same, critic-2. I have the Blu-ray from the UK, and the trio is definitely included in the film.



You might very well think that. I couldn't possibly comment.

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The OP is referring to the ensemble that comes right after the card trio, the one that begins "Quant au douanier, c'est notre affaire." It's where Carmen and the other women boast about how they'll charm their way past the border guards.

It's one of my favorite parts of "Carmen," and I hate that the movie cut it out. (Tho I still rate the movie 10/10)

I like your HOC tagline!

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Ahh, thank you for the clarification, Writ. I clearly misunderstood, then.

(I don't think I'm familiar with the missing piece, at all. I'll have to do some research! Fact is, I'm not very knowledgeable about Opera per se, and I like Julia Migenes so much as Carmen that I haven't w3andered into other versions. My bad, then.)

Brownie points for recognising my tag — few people seem to. I've been attacked more often for being a "hypocrit" because I have that and yet post, than I've heard mention of HoC. The US remake hasn't made it to my country yet — have you seen it? Is it any good?



You might very well think that. I couldn't possibly comment.

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Here's the missing piece as sung by Elina Garanca: http://youtu.be/9G1DKL3LTaM

Julia's the greatest, but Garanca's very good too. There's a well-produced DVD of her "Carmen" at the Met that seems to be the full opera.

I've only seen the first four episodes of the American HoC, and may not be watching any more. It's hard to compare with the original because it looks like they took a totally different approach in adapting the books: that is, so far it's very solemn, "realistic," and rather sluggish, whereas the original was very witty and light on its feet. Ian Richardson lit up the screen whenever he was on, but Spacey plays FU ("Frank Underwood") as a dead-eyed, puffy-faced reptile. I can't see people lining up to vote for him. And without Richardson's charm (and Shakespearean voice), the direct-to-the-camera soliloquies don't quite come off, IMO. Mainly it just makes me want to watch the BBC series again.

It could get better, I suppose, but I'm not holding my breath.

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> Here's the missing piece as sung by Elina Garanca: http://youtu.be/9G1DKL3LTaM
Ahh, lovely — thanks for the link! ;-)

But ... I'll have to check the BD again, but isn't that piece also in the film? It's so familiar. I know it appears instrumentally in the Entr'acte and as incidental music between scenes, but I feel sure I've heard it actually sung, as in the clip you linked me to. I have the UK version of the Blu — I know there are some technical differences between that and the US release by Olive Films (the UK release has additional audio tracks and subtitle options on a 50GB disc, and the US release uses only a 25GB disc), but surely not to the extent of a different cut of the film? (Or maybe I'm just completely mistaken.) Hmmm, I have a mission now ...

> Julia's the greatest, but Garanca's very good too. [] There's a well-produced DVD of her "Carmen" at the Met that seems to be the full opera.
Certainly good enough to make me want to check out more, though she doesn't have that hispano carriage of her chest and swing of her hips that makes Julia so perfect for the role. I think Placido was a bit of a dud in the film, at least visually and as far as acting went, though I love his singing, and he's easily my preferred voice among "The Three".

>I've only seen the first four episodes of the American HoC, and may not be watching any more ... Mainly it just makes me want to watch the BBC series again.
Interesting comments, thank you. )Pardon my snips!) I did wonder when I read Spacey was doing it. I mean, I admire him enormously, and he's kinda the first of the "big names" to come to mind for manipulative blackhats, but I see him as too much of an overt viper on-screen, and not enough of a "pour honeyed poison in thine ear", for my image of FU. Ian Richardson is just exquisite (I mean that precisely, not hyperbolically) in the original production, the perfect blend of pulsing venom, towering self-belief and droll toxic humour. And I personally always loved Diane Fletcher as Elizabeth, his Lady Macbeth — I think she's an actress that often doesn't receive due credit.

Ah well, I'll check out the new one and see how it strikes me, though I appreciate hearing your thoughts, Writ. ;-)

And I need to sit and watch Carmen again. This missing scene thing has got me puzzled.



You might very well think that. I couldn't possibly comment.

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You're right: Domingo is a bit bovine in the role. (Tho maybe it works, in a way: he's like a sad-eyed bull lumbering after Carmen)

Please let me know if your DVD includes "Quant au douanier"! I notice that the new Olive DVD and Blu-Ray are listed as running 3 minutes longer than my Sony DVD.

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Well, it's taken me a bit of a time, but I've just managed to watch my Carmen Blu-ray again (don't you hate it when work gets in the way? ) and ... it's bad news.

I was wrong, and the quintet isn't there. It goes straight from the card trio where Carmen reads her fate, to a quick bit of dialogue about scarpering on the ponies, to Micaëla's "Lord give me courage" aria. (I applaud Faith Esham's singing, but jeez Micaëla's a drear!)

Anyway. The piece isn't there, sorry to say. Interestingly, the cut from the card-reading trio to Dancaire's dialogue is very abrupt, actually sounding like it's severing the trailing resonance of the final chord, so I wondered if the quintet was originally filmed (or at least recorded), but then cut during editing. Then, I remembered I have the Erato CD issue of the full stduio recordings for this film's soundtrack, and lo and behold, the quintet is on there! So at some point or another, it was recorded, and then before or after filming it Rosi decided not to use it.

The only artistic reason I can think of is because it does seem to undercut Carmen's sense of fatality, and does it at the very moment she's just discovered she's going to die. The piece is lovely, but dramatically it probably is a bit clunky in that spot of the narrative. In the film, Carmen becomes sombre and brooding from the moment she reads the cards, and the more Don José badgers her, the more she detests him, because she now knows where it's going to end. I think that makes a better dramatic line, and maybe that's why the quintet was cut. (Though there could have been all sorts of technical or performance issues, of course.)


You might very well think that. I couldn't possibly comment.

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I think that makes a better dramatic line, and maybe that's why the quintet was cut.

I didn't think of that: that's a really good insight. The tonal shift would probably be more jarring in a realistic setting than on stage. (Reminds me of how the movie version of "West Side Story" reshuffled the songs, moving the comedic "Officer Krupke" scene from its original spot right after the rumble to earlier). I guess Rosi understood that "Carmen" had to work as a movie as well as an opera.

I never knew that "Quant au douanier" was recorded as part of the soundtrack: I only have the "highlights" CD. Maybe you're right and they did film it; it might still be in some film vault. (Maybe someday it'll appear as an extra)

Anyway...thanks for following this up, puirt-a-beul!


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