Not the only time it's happened.
Nice message it sends.
And it's not a case of:
--she was too uneducated
--she had no choice
--the children losing both parants
--blaming others for not helping
Justice would be beating him to a pulp,not murder. If she knocked him blindsided with a baseball-bat,he would know who he was dealing with and wake-up.
Did it for the sake of her children? She did it for herself.
She did do jail time, she was in jail from the night of the fire up until the acquittal.
sharehow much time was that?
Anyway, Lorena Bobbit practically committed murder(attempted) and the same aquittal with her(the mental hospital was a cop-out) Another woman in the news severed her man's penis and told the police he deserved it
It sends a message to women that it's an option--however, subconsciously.
Nobody deserves to be maimed and tortured,and Francine's husband did die a
torture-like death. She should had just shot him, instead if making him suffer. There is no excuse. She should had gotten on a plane and flew as far way as she could if she was in fear of being stalked; he wouldn't know where she is. Did she ask her parents for help? She should has just stayed with her parents,then. What, her parents are going to refuse is she tells them he's going to kill her?
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Indeeeeed, it was no secret what was going on, the whole town knew it, Mickey would chase her into neighbors' homes in the night wielding a knife trying to kill her and STILL the cops would only put him in jail for a weekend, you can't say nobody saw anything, nobody knew what going on, nobody had the chance to offer help.
shareThe film didn't show all of that,nor,as I recall of her having been hospitalized from abuse(if that did occur)
share[deleted]
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SimplemindedSociety^
Agree with all your statements.
And, burning someone to death when they are asleep and aren't attacking you -- that should not be excused.
"We would have been fine, if there hadn't been any.....mess"
Right, she should've let him chase her out to the garage and pray she could get the gas can in time to set him on fire before he beat her to death instead.
share'Right, she should've let him chase her out to the garage and pray she could get the gas can in time to set him on fire before he beat her to death instead.'
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He wasn't beating her then, so what do you mean? That's an excuse.
How come the reverse does not apply to women who abuse men? That doesn't happen?
Anyway, it was PRE-meditated murder--not "stab him while he hit her, and he turned his back for a few seconds"
Temp insanity + premediated= do not go together. How would you feel if he was your brother,son,etc? It all changes then,hmm?
If my brother, son, etc., spent every day of 13 years beating his wife and beating his children, letting them starve so he could drink and buy drugs, chased his wife through the streets and into neighbors' homes with a knife, raped her, and let the pregnant dog freeze to death in a snowstorm while she was in labor with one pup halfway out of her, and the wife retaliated ONCE in all that time and killed him, I would put up the house for bail collateral. But long before that happened, *I* would step into the middle of it and do something about the mess myself. Like somebody SHOULD have done instead of everybody saying 'oh sorry, there's nothing we can do, our hands are tied'. She got divorced, she got a restraining order, he moved into her home anyway, the cops would only take him for a weekend, and everybody had the same story that they couldn't do anything with him, well then the family should've stepped in and done something instead of saying it was her fault for not making him happy.
shareFranice's husband do not BEAT his children. Did the film show that? The children's paternal grandmother was there for them. And who did he let 'starve'? I don't know what man you're speaking about.
Remember, the children are just as much part of him, as her. The children were not in danger of him, so she could had isolated herself from him and regained custody of her children later. What, that is not good enough? Her situation was not a normal situation and compromise is called for.
If it was you and everybody said "our hands our tied", you would just accept anything that comes along? Many women leave thier husbands without even being abused. You speak like people OWED her something. What if your roommate was abusing you? Would you stay in your apt, and just accept it instead of moving? She sounded very dumb to believe the problem was not making him happy,if that's what they told her.
Maybe instead of just blindly believing movies you should read the book with the actual details about the case and you would see yes he did beat his children, yes he did let them starve, he took ALL Francine's money to keep him in booze and drugs and he never worked. The children SAW the abuse every day, in fact during trial the defense called one child up to demonstrate how Mickey almost broke their mother's arm during the last attack, you would let YOUR children stay in a house with that man while you ran off to start a new life hoping maybe a court would let you have them later when everybody's making YOU out to be the one who IS a problem instead of the one WITH a problem? If you were going to get out you would take your children with you then and there, that's why she had to wait because she wanted to get all of the kids out with her when she left.
sharethen wny did the film lie? Or did Francine lie in her book? Which one?
You are making excuses for woman who stayed for the man for 13 yrs. Yes, Francine was just as much of the problem as he was. Instead of lighting him on fire and driving away, drive away without lighting him in fire. But she needs to move further away than the same town. Now, do we excuse..Roman Polanski or OJ Simpson for "temp insanity" for thier deeds? Of course not.
And you never answered me about if you had a roomate who abused you,naturally. All Francine did was set a bad example for other women who may not be so lucky when they try the same thing. Yeah..such a hero.
Do you see the laws that are in effect today for women who are battered and victims of domestic abuse? Yes, Francine is a hero because it was from HER case and her trial and the world finding out about what she had gone through and why she had to go to such an extreme to get away, that those laws are in effect today. There was NO help for women in her time, today they have options, BECAUSE of this case, because it got so much attention. It took a woman setting her husband on fire for people to wake up and realize they need to do something to help women like that.
And to answer, if you'd bother looking up anything you would find out that Francine Hughes didn't write The Burning Bed, Faith McNulty did. And if you really think movies never change details from true stories, then you have just further confirmed you are the biggest idiot who ever lived.
'It took a woman setting her husband on fire for people to wake up and realize they need to do something to help women like that.'
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Cop-out.
That would mean cutting off your husband's penis is a wake up call in the same manner. You are maginifying this specific case for more than it is. Were you abused, is that the crux of your undying empathy for cowardly Francine?
'And if you really think movies never change details from true stories, then you have just further confirmed you are the biggest idiot who ever lived'
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That's your problem. The film is what we are discussing and basing our threads on, not the book behind the film. We are not obligated to research a book before giving the film the benefit of a doubt. That makes you idiotic, and immature. Naturally, the book was juicer($$).
Cop-out.
That would mean cutting off your husband's penis is a wake up call in the same manner. You are maginifying this specific case for more than it is. Were you abused, is that the crux of your undying empathy for cowardly Francine?
I am not even getting into Yvette Cade and other crimes, because murder is an equally divided occurance.
Now, if a man put his hands on you, I doubt you would be strong enough to "beat the hell out of him". I assume you would just leave.
How do you know all battered feel they are not worth anything and have low self-esteem? You are making a blanket statement. There are likely just as many women who have low self-esttem who DO leave. What makes you assume some of these women don't wish to leave the comforts of thier 3 bedroom home?
Now, if it was a MAN who stayed instead of being strong and leaving, society would lable him a spineless coward. So much for the equality of the sexes. But of course, we are brainwashed to think men are less sensitive than women. She could had also checked herself into a mental hospital on the basis of having a nervous breakdown, but that too easy also I suppose.
The problem is that women like Francine sit around waiting for the man to change,which is not going to happen. Is that low self-esteem or stupidity? That is called enabling, as if she is going to be safer with him, than without him. If you burn your hand every time you place over a gas stove, that doesn't tell you anything?
Also, abused women/media(etc.) did not begin with the Francine Hughes' story.
If you're getting beaten every day for 13 years, there is no comfort in any home. AND you can note she got divorced, she moved to another house, she got a restraining order, all of which says she DID leave, but what happened? He moved in with her anyway, and nobody did anything about it. Now you're not married, you moved out and you have a piece of paper saying the POS isn't allowed in your home but he's there anyway, and the cops aren't going to take him, what are YOU going to do about it? Just like Yvette Cade, she got a restraining order, she moved out of the neighborhood, her husband tracked her down, was at their house all the time, calling them, harrassing her, and still beating her, she took the pictures of her bruises to a judge who was too much of a jackass to bother paying attention to her and told her 'just get a divorce' like it's that easy, and thus she was burnt over 60% of her body and has to wear a mask and body suit 23 hours of the day to keep scar tissue from forming on that 60% of her body, where she had to have 18 surgeries following being set on fire.
The bottom line is you can say Francine is a murderer all you want, but if people gave a damn about battered women in the first place, she wouldn't have had to resort to setting her ex-husband on fire for people to realize gee maybe they should do something and open safe houses and shelters for women like that so they had options. Those were NON-EXISTENT in her time, back then people thought if a woman was being beaten it was her fault for not trying hard enough to make the husband happy.
And you know what? You're the one who thinks you know everything about domestic violence and that the solution is SO easy to find, it's obvious you have never known a battered woman in your whole life. Maybe you should go down to one of the battered women's shelters and ask them why they didn't JUST leave, and risk having their children or families killed because maybe their boyfriends or husbands would make good on their threats. Incase you didn't notice, people like Mickey are bullies, they dominate people who they know they can dominate and if they ever show a sign of leaving they love to play the 'you leave and I'll kill you/the kids/your parents' card, and how many people are willing to call their bluff and see if they mean it or not? Oh I'm sure YOU would say 'go ahead and kill them, I don't care about them' but mothers do not do that, that's a large reason why they stay, a lot of them have to get the point they ARE willing to die to get their freedom. Some aren't willing to die though, instead they have to kill to get their freedom.
You are making excuses,either because you have an innate disdain for men, or saw your mother(or yourelf)get battered. You protest too much for somebody so young,lacking perspective and insight.
Your long essays convey some form of resentment,as you sidestep issues in that selective veiled manner. The other possiblity is that you are a lesbian,which in that case, you will generally find a man--or men--wrong by default.
I was in an abusive relationship.
At one point, my ex had our infant son hostage and it took armed police surrounding the apartment to get him out and to get him to relinquish my son.
I left him. He kept coming back, using visiting our son as the excuse.
When I left him, my son and I literally were on the street. I borrowed $50 from a friend, found a room a rent, got a two-bit job and just when everything was getting back in order, my ex started showing back up, long enough to continue his abuse and to steal my bank info and drain my bank accounts -- twice.
The second time, I had the 'goods' on him. I threatened to have him arrested if he didn't leave town AND I armed myself -- I slept on the couch with my hand on a 9 ml gun for weeks.
Then, I waited.
If he tried to break in again and get to me, I would have shot him. THAT would have been self-defense.
He ended up leaving town.
If I had waited for him to fall asleep one night and set him on fire, I would have deserved to be jailed for pre-meditated murder.
Low self-esteem is NO defense OR excuse for brutally killing another human being in his/her sleep, in my book, no matter how wretched that human being is.
Period.
11/16/12: The day the Twinkie died :(
She didn't wait to kill him in his sleep because of low self esteem, she waited because she wasn't going to let any of her children be in the house when it was on fire and one child still hadn't come home. That was the only reason why she waited.
shareSetting him on fire is too extreme IMO, shooting him or stabbing him I could understand; but burning someone alive! I don't care how much of a bastard he was, you don't do that.
Clark Kent + Lois Lane 4ever
DC Can Suck It
Well, it got attention, it opened people's eyes to the fact that something HAD to be done to help women in Francine's position instead of saying 'oh well, do this, do that, those options run out we can't help you'. Even today, if a woman shoots or stabs her husband, yeah that's bad, but it's still kind of 'oh well' because they're more common, it doesn't really draw people's attention to it because there are plenty more where that one came form. And the fact that that in itself can't do it, that people DO ignore cases which are more common because the details don't stand out, says a lot about our society that they DO have to be shocked into deciding to do something.
share'Setting him on fire is too extreme IMO, shooting him or stabbing him I could understand; but burning someone alive! I don't care how much of a bastard he was, you don't do that.'
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of course not. But that aspect is not explored
He didn't die of burns. He died of smoke inhalation.
share
Low self-esteem is NO defense OR excuse for brutally killing another human being in his/her sleep, in my book, no matter how wretched that human being is.
Period.