Gayness...

I quite agree. And I can add a few points. Sorry for the bad English.

I think Celliers, both in the book and the movie is quite an enigma both to his surroundings and sometimes even to himself. In the book he is a man who is imprisoned by the expectations that people, society has of him, also because of the looks that Yonoi is so fascinated of. The perfect son, student, lawer, soldier, potential husband. He tries to break out by going to war but he always remains aimless. In the book there is indeed some mutual attraction when Celliers and Yonoi see each other at court for the first time. Celliers describes it as "two birds of the same kind admiring each others beautiful feathers". The books also makes it quite clear (more than the movie, at least for non-Japanese who might not get the few hints Oshima is giving them about Yonoi's past) that Yonoi, too, is a prisoner of his society. He is supposed to be the perfect soldier, the prefect samurai, who acts without individuality and personal feelings. Both clearly have problems living up to these standards and both see something they admire in the other. But there is a misunderstanding.

Yonoi sees something as a God in Cellier and misunderstands his indifference towards his own life as courage and samurai spirit, at the same time he is drawn to Celliers acting so much as an individual. And these IS a homoerotic attraction both because of Celliers looks and the ideal he sees in him. The attraction might indeed me one-sided. You get the feeling that Celliers is too far away from life for something banal as romantic feeling toward anyone (it is strange that as a man of his status and looks he is not married). He is fully aware of Yonoi's though as it seems. There is a scene in the book where Celliers reads a novel and asks Lawrence why some of the pages are missing. Lawrence explains that the Japanese rip out all the pages that contain kissing scenes because "even the most chaste kiss on the cheek in public is regarded as the most perverse and sexual thing in their culture".

And now, knowing that, you can imagine that Celliers was fully aware of what he did to Yonoi with those "harmless" kisses. He could have raped Yonoi in public, it wouldn't have made much of a difference. And what made the scene even more revealing was that Yonoi didn't pull away. Celliers did what he had to do and he used Yonoi's weakness for him against him.

But since you were only talking about the movie.. Yonoi's character was based on Japanese author Yukio Mishima (The title song of the movie, 'Forbidden Colours' refers to Mishima's book of the same name. It is also a Japanese term for.. well, being homosexual), who was tortured by his homosexuality and flet into his obsession with the military and samurai. He committed public suicide with a sword. And having been raised in the strict codex of the samurai himself, Oshima seems to be fascinated by the topic of homosexuality in this environments. His later movie Gohatto can be seen as a sequel to the thought he developed in Mr Lawrence. How love or sexual desire can cause this strict and cold system to collaps just because it makes Yonoi, in that case, act on his very personal motives, because it turned him into an individual. Maybe he would have been even more explict than he already was but given this movie is almost 25 years old it is already quite bold.

Btw, in the book Yonoi survives. He works in a women's prison (degrading and meant as a punishment) after what happened at the camp with Celliers and gets accused of abusing the women because they find the lock of Cellier's hair at him and at first assume it is a woman's hair. Later he returnes home and desposites the lock of hair in the shrine of ancestors.

As for the Korean and Dutch soldier, I think they are some kind of a more extreme version of Yonoi and Celliers, just less controlled and such destroyed much quicker. They just gave in to their desires (the Dutch guy didn't even try to resist and later he bites off his tongue when the Korean soldier is executed. More than obvious the feeling were not one-sided).

I agree with a lot of your interpretations. I don't think the movie is really trying to send us a message about homosexuality, (and whether strong overtones are present or not is up to anyone's personal feelings on the film) but about the relationship between conquerors and the conquered and war. I think some people simply overlook the deep respect (and indeed, fascination) Captain Yonoi has for Celliers, even though he can't express it, because he is the enemy. Celliers does seem androgynous (I would use the term sexless) in the sense that he doesn't seem to care about the normal things men care about - like beautiful women and relationships, but that's because he is a 'soldier's soldier.' Like they said in the movie, he embraced war as an escape. Celliers was always trying to care for his own men, and he exploited his enemy's weakness to do so. He also did it without being violent and inhumane, and this shocked Yonoi. Yonoi's character realized how deeply this one man's strength and convictions affected him, despite the fact that they were on opposite sides. That's why they book is called The Seed and the Sower. Celliers planted a kernel of respect and humanity for all humans, despite race in the cold, steely Captain Yonoi. No sexual connotation intended.


Also, I don't see how the flowers were a particularly effeminate thing. They were to hide food and show respect for the dead.

sorry chav, i ve never been a p.o.w. and i hope i'll never be one.

what sense does it make to call me a "full blown homo" and a "homophobic" at the same time? is my sexual orientation of any interest for this thread? i guess not, because it's about the movie, not about my existing or non-existing gayness.

maybe you're homophobic? there's obviously more than one homoerotic innuendo in that film.

What the hell are you talking about? The director clearly said it has homoesexual as well as homoerotic themes, the actors did as well. It was regarded as such when the movie came out both in Europe and the states as well as in Japan. Funnily enough the filmmakers and actors could talk surprisingly open about the topic back then even though it was 25 years ago.

Bowie eating a flower and looking you straight in the eyes is ALWAYS going to be erotic!!!!! Come on guys, some things are very clear and this is one of those. There IS an homoerotic undertone to the film.