MovieChat Forums > The Thorn Birds (1983) Discussion > Ralph's knowledge of contraceptives?

Ralph's knowledge of contraceptives?

posted 16 years ago by kootiecat
24 replies | jump to latest

Ok, So Meggie and Ralph FINALLY do the deed, but whether Ralph was a virgin or not, he would have known what contraceptives are wouldn't he??
I am sure of it, so how could he not realise Meggie would become pregnant if they slept together!

I am going by the fact that a) Ralph's intentions were not to sleep with Meggie but to just see her and sort things out between them and as the book said 'sleep on the couch'. So this means he would not have gone out and bought condoms or anything as you would do if you were a guy, and well Meggie may or may not have been on the pill I don't know, but it just seems so hard to believe Ralph could not think of the possibility that sleeping with Meggie would not get her pregnant. And then when Dane shows up, I know he said that he couldnt believe she could go back to Luke but what did he honestly think sleeping with her unprotected most likely would do!

I wonder why this was not mentioned in the book or the series...

[–] Mrs-Misfit 16 years ago

My only thought on this was that he was not knowledgeable about all of this? Perhaps he was very sheltered when it came to these types of topics. ?????
Also, moreso in the book than in the series, Ralph was quite full of himself so perhaps didn't think something like that would happen. These are only speculations!!

Good points to ponder, though!

Certainty like this comes but once in a lifetime.

[–] kootiecat 16 years ago

Good point kstrunk, yeah Ralph may have not realised that Meggie would become pregnant because god may not will it as he was a priest, but I think maybe he was more sheltered to these types of topics like you said. Although in the movie he does explain to Meggie how people make babies when she first 'became a woman' so I don't really know :s!

[–] lindawinnett 16 years ago

I don't think it is that Ralph wasn't knowledgable of contraceptives...Catholics are taught that copulation is for the sole purpose of producing children. Fornication is for pleasure and an out and out SIN! Ralphs sole purpose to going to Matlock island was to have sex with Meggie!....Maybe he assumed that since Meggie had just given birth that she was unable to conceive at that point...of course this is just speculation on my part and we would have to ask Colleen McCullough what Ralphs true thoughts may have been...I also agree that Ralphs arrogance probably played a role, as well as his ambition...which caused him to be in a state of denial and refusing to even think it was a possibility that he was Danes father. We must also remember that it was several years after Matlock Island when Ralph and Meggie saw each other again...19 years I believe...Maybe it honestly just never entered Ralphs mind that Dane was possibly his son.

"Remember, your precious rose has nasty, hooky, thorns"

[–] kootiecat 16 years ago

True goddess, but do you remember in the book, Ralph thoughts were that he was not going to have sex with Meggie but to 'sleep on her couch'. I quote that because it is in there when Anne Mueler is telling him where Meggie is. So that implies he did not intentionally go there to have sex with her, does it not?

Then again book and movie can differ here so who knows!

[–] lindawinnett 16 years ago

But....In the Mini-series adaptation...Ralphs intentions are perfectly clear when he walks down the beach to Meggie, chases her and grabs her and kisses her...passionately!

"Remember, your precious rose has nasty, hooky, thorns"

[–] highpriestess32 12 years ago

I agree. Certainly in the film it was clear to me he had gone back for a full fling with Meggie to test his faith if nothing else and possibly get her out of his system which meant a proper love affair, not just long leisurely chats on the veranda and holding hands along the shore.

I don't think the contraceptive pill was around then, not by a long shot. But thinking about it, maybe Ralph did not want to appear presumptuous. If he suddenly whipped out a pack of condoms then Meggie may have been very offended by the fact that his true intentions would then have been revealed.

Initially she rebuffed him and said "NO MORE" even though once she realised he was prepared to give her his all, she was a willing participant. But I wonder how it might have looked had he already prepared for this eventuality?

Also, being a priest, it could have been hard to get condoms without being exposed and who could he ask to get them on his behalf? All that said, it was crucial to the story that Meggie got pregnant and bore his child so it's just a plot device.

It's rarely the people at war, it's the megalomaniac leaders at war.

[–] pittstate_sax_appeal 16 years ago

First of all, I am not 100% sure that they had birth control pills at that time. Plus, it does mention in the book that the 'french letters' as Luke calls them were extremely uncomfortable for Meggie, not that Ralph would've known this, but it does mention in the book that his intentions were not to sleep with her. The reason that he mentions that he couldn't believe that she went back to Luke after Dane was born was because Meggie lied about Dane's due date and said that he arrived early, but it was only Fee and Meggie who knew the truth because when Dane was born Fee could tell that Dane was actually born on time. Because Meggie had lied about when she became pregnant, it is not that he didn't think that his actions could have repercussions, it's just that he thought that Dane was Luke's son due to Meggie saying it was so.

[–] birdcrumbs 16 years ago

Noo, I don’t think he even thought this thing through this much. I think it just happened. Without further planning. I don’t really understand how they intended to be in the film, but at least he wasn’t planning anything in the book (silly him, lol), so if he did think anything about any conclusions, well that wouldn’t have been any more then like he didn’t want to believe that Dane was his son he simply didn’t want to believe that there would be any consequences either..
But I really don’t think his mind was engaged with that at all anyways.

And lol, he was obviously knowledgeable enough, it’s shown at few points in the series, he wasn’t that stupid to think that he’s unable to produce sequels or anything!

[–] thbryn 16 years ago

I'll have to go back to re-read the Matlock section but I'd bet there wasn't a word about protection from either R or M. I think it was safe to assume M wanted to get pregnant--even though she just had Jussy-- so she wasn't going to say anything anyway.

As for the film, it's not like it was just once, lol. Ralph was very busy and to say nothing--about birth control--was ignorance in the extreme, or just arrogance?

And, there was no pill! Ralph should have had a pack of rubbers even though they aren't allowed. What difference does that make, if your having illicit sex: Good God Ralph, you weren't going to a deserted beachfront to talk!

[–] luvmoviesandmusic 16 years ago

Ok, So Meggie and Ralph FINALLY do the deed, but whether Ralph was a virgin or not, he would have known what contraceptives are wouldn't he??

If I'm not mistaken, the Pill didn't come into use until the late 1960's, and being a Catholic Priest, he would not condone the use of condoms.

I am sure of it, so how could he not realise Meggie would become pregnant if they slept together!

Well, not all women become pregnant from unprotected sex.

All in all though, I don't think he had that much of a clue about female reproduction, apart from the obvious.

Music Eternal

[–] ariennye 16 years ago

I'm sure he knew about them. He was pretty worldly. On the other hand, he wasn't expecting to sleep with her.

Plus, he's Catholic. Some Catholics are pretty opposed to contraceptives in the modern day, so I would imagine the belief would have been more common in the 1930s.

---------
"My God, my country, my Harley Davidson. But not necessarily in that order.

[–] 16 years ago

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[–] alswindle 15 years ago

They have sex on Matlock Island in the 1920's when there was NO birth control pill yet. Condoms back then were obviously NOT made out of latex since latex was not invented yet either. They were called FRENCH LETTERS in Australia back in the 1920s. They were often made out of sheep intestines! Also- Ralph lived in the Vatican so obviously he couldn't get condoms there! He then is stationed in Australia when he gets Meggie's letter for help. He would be easily recognized if there even was a local pharmacy since he was the ONLY Australian Cardinal AND he was famous for being the inheritor of the massive Mary Carson estate.

[–] 15 years ago

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[–] ilahilda 12 years ago

I have not seen this movie in years, but didn't they stay on that island for two or three days. It is silly for Ralph to think pregnancy would not exist. Those two were pretty passionate! On his last day on the island, he was really concerned about Meggie's emotional state , even offering to write to her, I wondered if he was concerned about pregnancy resulting in the back of his mind then.

[–] amazon423 12 years ago

She was on Matlock for 6 weeks and he got there after her and left before she did. She told Ann that she was sure she was pregnant when she got back to the plantation. She would have had to stay there long enough to miss a period long enough to be sure of this. They were together longer than a few days. There was no female contraceptive device available other than a diaphragm. From what I read a long time ago those rubbers really were rubber and re-usable at some time or other if they were cleaned. In the book they did not see each other till Dane was around 7 years old. She told him that he belonged to her on Matlock and on Drogheda which was why they resumed their sexual relationship on Drogheda.

[–] elenaoddmod 9 years ago

This is what I mean by scenes that were cut. You say Meggie told Ann she was sure she was pregnant when she got back to the plantation. I just watched the DVD tonight and am sure that scene wasn't included.

[–] hodie 11 years ago

Father Ralph was there for Justine's birth (in the miniseries
, anyway). I am pretty sure he knew what was what.

"Joey, have you ever been in a Turkish prison?"

[–] pedalwatch 11 years ago

Most see here seem to have forgotten when Ralph made his final confession to Meggie before he died in the rose garden. He said that he must have known somewhere within him that Dane was his from the start. But he didn't WANT to know because he wanted to be Cardinal De Bricassart more than he wanted Dane and Meggie. He was too ambitious to even acknowledge the fact that Dane could be his. And his ambition was so strong that he didn't even WANT to know...so he didn't really think about it or come to terms with it. That was Ralph's great weakness. He was too blinded by his ambition to even think about contraception and all of that when he was with Meggie. It was purposely overlooked by him. He actually lied to himself or was not honest with himself, which was the core of Ralph's character and weakness to see the truth about things. Not until the end when Meggie flat-out told him the truth for the last time. Then he couldn't deny it any longer, and he realized the truth about himself finally. Thus the final confession to Meggie which released both him and Meggie from the truth of his true weakness before he died.

When he told her about the thorn bird again before he died, he added something that was the most truthful thing he said about himself, and about human weakness, which was that when the thorn pressed the thorn into his breast, "we know, we understand, but still we do it, STILL we do it." Wow! Powerful!

[–] 11 years ago

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[–] 11 years ago

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