MovieChat Forums > Excalibur (1981) Discussion > Not Enough Arthur Films

Not Enough Arthur Films


Look around at the threads here, I'm seeing a lot of people loving this movie and talking about the other Arthurian adaptations and, frankly, there are slim pickings. They get even slimmer when we're looking for good adaptations.

I'm assuming some of this has to do with Hollywood's general disinterest in doing any epic films any more. When they do make them, they often "subvert" or "deconstruct", and try to make it ironic or semi-funny or something like that. Sincerity isn't easy to come by anymore.

I love these myths. I'd love to see something straight-up and done to the hilt. But that would likely be a huge risk. Given the mythological storytelling in Arthurian legend, it would also be a big challenge. It's not easy to take Mallory or Tennyson and translate that stuff into the film medium.

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I agree, would be good to see another "straight" adaptation of Arthur. Ditto with the Greek myths. Agreed, sincerity is often hard to come by these days in movies (so is originality, but that's another story....). I quite liked Excalibur. I wonder if a straight version of The Sword in the Stone would work (the Disney film was not one of the studio's best efforts). Or a new version of Camelot where the leads could actually sing (not be dubbed or not so good)?

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I'd go for a new Sword in the Stone. I think TH White wrote four books on Arthur, compiled as "The Once And Future King", of which The Sword in the Stone is the first. Netflix, Amazon, and the other streaming services, are in perfect position to do a four film series and adapt the whole lot of 'em!

And, yes, Camelot would be nice.

Myth (Arthurian or Greek) is hard to do, I think, because it needs epic scope (large budgets), but they're kind of fundamental/primal stories, so they can risk simplicity. And then there's the irony problem that Hollywood has (too much of it).

If I strike it rich someday, maybe I'll fund some of this stuff. I'd likely go bankrupt, of course, but at least we'd all have some really great movies.

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I read the book once: "The Once and Future King"
I'm sure he turned into a mouse for a bit , or am i misremembering?
was that in any of these films ? :)

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I've only read the first part of that series - The Sword in the Stone - in which he does transform into various creatures, although I cannot remember if mouse was one of them. My memory says, "No," but it's also rather tied up in the Disney film's version in which he is transmogrified into a fish, a squirrel, and a bird, but not a mouse. I do recall that he is also (at some point) a snake in the book, but that's about it.

It's a lovely book, and a more faithful adaptation could be really great (and actually quite funny, too).

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I would definitely be down for more Arthurian material. I've never read Le Morte d'Arthur and am only familiar with the story through later sources, but I've always enjoyed it.

Surprisingly, one of the most entertaining takes I've seen on the Arthurian legend was the late-90s mini-series with Sam Neill, Merlin. It punched above its weight, I'd say.

On the other hand one of the worst takes was Guy Ritchie's film. I tried to watch it and couldn't even finish it. Just awful.

Then you have weird aberrations like that 2004 film King Arthur, which supposedly exposed the "true, historical" Arthur. It was basically Arthur with all the fun stuff cut out.

I guess Richard Gere's First Knight is similarly an aberration, but it's one I actually enjoy. I like it a little less now than I did when I was in my teens, but I still think it's an interesting and enjoyable movie.

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Le Morte d'Arthur is a long, long read. It's fun and full of knightly deeds, but it's definitely of a different era, and it's huge. Of course, I chose this as my summer beach reading material for a week of vacation one year. Everybody else was sprawled out with John Grisham, Nicholas Sparks, and EL James, and I'm powering through Mallory.

Merlin was amazing! I was rewatching it the other day and it holds up. Yes, the effects aren't great, but they never really were, and they were charming for what they were. So much of that series was handled impeccably. To this day, I will always think of Excalibur as that version's silver, flickering blade whose metallic ringing song was always playing through the sound design whenever it was unsheathed. Arthur has rarely been depicted better, too, on the battlefield offering his own head to his rival - a true act of brave, kingly sacrifice. Plus, it took its time to tell a deep story and got into a lot of the great Arthurian myths and legends. Merlin was amazing. It was the height of those made-for-TV mini series, along with the Alice in Wonderland one by the same producers. I also enjoyed Gulliver's Travels, 20,000 Leagues Under the Sea, Ivanhoe, and The Odyssey. Years later I saw a Hercules TV movie they made and it was awful. They'd really let themselves down with that one.

I didn't see Guy Ritchie's, but I heard awful things. Too bad. His slick take on Sherlock Holmes was fun (although not accurate to the source), and I was hoping that was what he'd given to Arthur. Then again, Holmes fits in to his Lock, Stock/ Snatch world of strange characters, wit, thriller sequences, and convoluted plotting, whereas Arthur is best done as epic myth, which Hollywood has had trouble with basically since Lord of the Rings. Probably a couple exceptions, but for the most part they forgot how to do them. Too bad, because Ben-Hur and Lawrence of Arabia are awesome, and if Hollywood approached Arthur with that sensibility, it would be an unstoppable force.

I liked First Knight, but I was never a big fan of Lancelot, and I always felt it fell short with the love triangle. Gwenivere should be more in love with Arthur so she is more torn between the two for that story to really work. The stage musical Camelot does this much better, in my opinion.

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The late-90s were something of a golden age for TV mini-series and movies, I think. This was also the time when TNT came out with Pirates of Silicon Valley and the Patrick Stewart version of A Christmas Carol, both of which I think still hold up quite well today. I may have to track down a few of the ones you mentioned that I haven't seen.

But I thought that Merlin was great. I revisted it a few years ago, after not seeing it for nearly two decades, and I had a lot of fun with it. Sure, the production values can't rival those of a $100 million Hollywood film, but it has heart and it also has a kind of sincerity that we just don't see much anymore. It's not cynical and not trying to subvert anyone's expectations. It's just good old fashioned entertainment.

Guy Ritchie's film is truly dire. It's probably worth watching just to see how badly he messed it up. At the end of the day, while there are many elements of the Arthurian legend in the story, I walked away feeling like it was very much Arthur in name only. It had the entirely wrong spirit, was boring, and the plot also felt like a mess.

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I have Stewart's Christmas Carol on my list, but I'll add Pirates of Silicon Valley, which I also haven't seen. Of the ones I mentioned, Alice and Ivanhoe are my favourites. There are loads of versions of each, but Alice has Tina Majorino in the title role, while the Ivanhoe is this one: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ivanhoe_(1997_TV_series)

I couldn't remember the lead actor's name, so I just found the link. It features James Cosmo as a Saxon lord in a role that continues to make me think this mighty Celt should have been Radagast in the Hobbit films, playing the role as a wild druid. As opposed to what we got: that crazy coot we all know who has too many pets and talks to his birds.

Your summation of Merlin is spot-on. It doesn't have top effects compared to theatre releases, but it doesn't need them because the movie is so much fun. Martin Short is a freakin' standout as a comic figure who gains so much pathos over the series, too. Whole cast is excellent, but there are gems throughout.

I'll probably watch Ritchie's film at some point, or at least give it fifteen-twenty minutes of "try". It's your evaluation of the spirit, the boring-ness, and the lack of plot that worries me most. I heard "Guy Ritchie" and wrote off "accurate" or "true to the legends". That's not what Ritchie does and I'm okay with that. But I do want him to be entertaining, and it sounds like his Arthur falls short of even that.

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Definitely check out A Christmas Carol and Pirates of Silicon Valley. They were some of the very first television films that I saw where I felt like they were genuinely GOOD movies, not just good for TV movies.

Let me also add the Joan of Arc miniseries from 1999 with Leelee Sobieski. That also was really good, I thought. In fact, I own it on DVD.

It looks like Ivanhoe is available on Prime right now. I will definitely check it out.

In regard to Ritchie's Arthur, who knows, you might like it. I just looked on RT and it has a 69% audience score and also has a 6.7 on IMDB, so perhaps your opinion will be more favorable than mine. I am more aligned with the critics' score though, which is 33%. If you do check it out, I'd be interested in hearing your opinion.

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I have seen the Joan of Arc series, and yeah, it's awesome! Sobieski's performance is marvellous.

I feel like if I go in with the assumption that I'm watching a Guy Ritchie fantasy film that's a brain-off flick I stand the best chance of enjoying it. "Lower the bar" is maybe not the best thing for a film, but some movies are just for fun. I'll let you know if I track it down and watch it.

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