Malcolm McLaren's influence?
How much did he really have?
"His sermon was a hail of bullets!"
How's that grab ya, Bob?
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Some?
You're probably right, Voo.
"His sermon was a hail of bullets!"
How's that grab ya, Bob? share
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Some? HA! Malcolm was totally in on this film, from start to finish! That was one of the main reasons that John Lydon (a.k.a. Johnny Rotten) did not agree to be a part of the filming process. If you'll notice, any "scene" with him in it is actually old footage.
Basically, this movie was a way for Malcolm to point out to the world how he had "invented" punk rock. It was a bunch of self-appreciating bull crap. I still love the film, don't get me wrong, but it's really only for a few of the more memorable scenes, particularly Sid singing the song "My Way". But everything in this film has to be taken with a grain of salt. Rather, a speck of dust.
Some of the dumbest statements:
1) SAYING THAT JOHNNY ROTTEN COULD NOT HOLD PITCH. If you've EVER heard the Pistols play live (particularly in one scene of the film, "Holidays in the Sun"), the first thing you notice is Sid's ABYSMAL guitar playing skills. He's completely off! I don't even think he's in the right bloody KEY! So sure, John may have hit a few sour notes, but he got the majority right! If anyone here has done any choral/solo performances, you know how hard it is to sing when your accompaniment is off.
2) MALCOLM SAYING THAT JOHN WAS FIRED FROM THE BAND. Very untrue. Research the subject for a mere five minutes, and you can disprove that statement....
3) MALCOLM SAYING THAT HE INVENTED PUNK. This is the worst statement of all! Was HE the one out there playing every night, getting beaten up for the way he dressed or the things he wrote about? Did HE have to endure as much as the band members did? NO! Sure, it was his idea to put the band together, I'll give him that. But everything else came about because of THE MEMBERS THEMSELVES. Last I knew, he wasn't telling John to dye his hair orange, or Steve to wear a swastika on his shirt. Stupid bloody git gives himself a LOT more credit than he truly deserves....
There are many, many, MANY other things about this film that are entirely untrue. I could write an entire book on the matter, should I choose to do so. Point is, Malcolm was (and still is) completely full of crap.
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Neither McClaren nor the Pistols invented punk.
The Ramones invented punk. And they were a huge influence on the Pistols, and many other New York bands had ideas stolen from them by McClaren and incorporated in the Sex Pistols.
"I dunno...burn stuff?"
"The Ramones invented punk."
No single band "invented" punk. The Ramones were preceded by the Stooges, MC5, and New York Dolls, all of whom laid down the foundations for punk rock.
And they were all preceded by the Velvet Underground.
Endy facking story.
"I dunno...burn stuff?"
Silly me, I thought The Kinks invented irreverant rock. Often imitated (Pretenders, VH, etc) never duplicated. Ray Davies was as rebellious as any of the punkers. Kinks couldn't even follow 'British Invasion' groups to the US, because they couldn't play by the rules. Sound familiar?
Love the Ramones, love the Pistols. Understand the influence of Stooges, NY Dolls and VU, but the Kinks laid the groundwork for antidisestablishmentarianism.
By the way, MC5 (Motor City 5) from Detroit, Iggy Pop - from Detroit. No wonder they call it "Detroit Rock City!"
Yup, and Lets not all forget the british band Cock sparrer, wich in fact was established in 1972 who today still exists, and still Considered an Oi Punk band. Roumeres out there from Drunk memebers of Cock sparrer, says that Malcom Actually Wanted them to be the Sex pistols, but they Did not want to talk to him cause he would't buy them beer. Its probally not true, but a funny story.
Actually, as far as I know the word "punk" came from a british rock (well, or punk rock) magazine from the late 70's by the same name, and somebody simply named the Genre within this magazine "punk music" Then bands Like the Ramones was interviewed in the magazine and theirfor name s punk band and then the Genre has shaped from that.
I know that I spell Like a 7 year old, I am Danish.
"It's only Rock n roll"
No the word punk was first coined to describe a music and attitude in a new york magazine, by legs mcneil and john holmstrom, PUNK! Magazine. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Legs_McNeil
shareI would say in actual fact, McLaren had no control over the Pistols as he would like you to believe. Sure, I guess it could be argued that he did to a certain extent, bring them together and get them a few shows, but according to the band, he wasn't even any good at doing that.
Basically this whole film project idea was Malcolm's idea and something the Pistols themselves had little enthusiasm for, and I think we all know by now that Sid, Steve and Paul all just went along with it for the money despite the band being history by the time filming began.
It really is a good thing that Julien Temple saw the error of his ways and made The Filth & The Fury twenty years later. That film is excellent and recomended to all, but in my opinion, Swindle is just trash and McLarens attempt to write himself into the history books, I mean, Johnny Rotten being fired from the group? How laughable is that? In actual fact, McLaren begged Rotten to come back to star in his "movie", but you know, Rotten, as we all know now, is an intelligent bloke and clearly had more sense.
It really does surprise me the cult status this film has gained among fans of the band, all it really is McLaren rubbishing the entire point and purpose of the punk scene and if you believe one thing mentioned in this film to be true, then you really should do some research into them and come to your senses.
And yes, in response to previous posters, the Sex Pistols did not invent punk. They popularised it. Yes, officially, as the experts say, The Ramones did start the idea of punk rock, but come on, could you even call the Ramones punk anymore after hearing one Sex Pistols song in that period of time? They were the group who defined punk as a genre and had the most influence over the bands that followed. It's the same argument with rock'n'roll in the 50s, Bill Haley and his Commets may have started it, but Elvis Presley popularised it and made it what it is remembered as today. In my opinion, its exactly the same story with the Ramones and the Sex Pistols twenty odd years later.
This is not exactly true, as the word had been put in circulation by Greg Shaw and Lenny Kaye with their Nuggets garage rock comps...
shareAs well as lester bangs.
sharemy mom told me she invented punk.
shareyour mum did invent punk. I believe you.
Who cares who invented it anyway. It was 30+ years ago.
Like it or not Malcolm & Vyvienne were instrumental in the emergence of punk in Britain. It was his idea to start the band for a start, and his Seditionary clothes along with the Pistols started the ball rolling. If it wasn't for his shop "SEX" none of it would have happened and we would have been left with the arty farty *beep* of Patti Smith & Richard Hell.
shareYour all wrong on all accounts. First off, The Sex Pistols weren't the brainchild of Malcolm McClaren. Steve Jones and Paul Cook had a band called The Strand with Wally Nightingale way before McClaren entered the picture. It was Steve Jones that pursued Malcolm, not the other way around. One the biggest insults to the Pistols legacy are these idiots who come on boards like these and post false information about the band, you guys really need to get your facts straight before you post.
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