MovieChat Forums > First Family (1980) Discussion > Newhart's treachery

Newhart's treachery

posted 21 years ago by zimbo_the_donkey_boy
17 replies | jump to latest

I agree with those who have commented on how bad this flick was and how surprising, considering who was involved in making it. I shall simply add a denunciation of Bob Newhart, who is generally a very funny fellow. He appeared on Johnny Carson plugging this movie. Ok, I understand that actors have to do that even when the film stinks. He didn't simply go on and talk to Johnny and allow his name to be attached to one more bad movie however. No, Newhart was effusive in his praise for how hilarious this monstrosity was and showed a clip without mentioning that the clip was edited. That's right, the clip did NOT appear in the actual movie the way it was shown on tv. A long, stupid scene had been edited down such that the tv version was actually funny, as amazing as that may sound to anyone who has suffered through this film. Well sure, First Family could have all been made funny, if it was chopped down to just a fifteen minute film. But it wasn't. And I'm sure that Newhart knew that he wasn't showing an actual scene from the movie, as he had after all been there when they filmed it in its original form. What jerkiness! Yeah, I'm still steamed about it. I think I should sue Newhart and the studio for false advertizing. Any lawyers out there reading this?

[–] Supertzar 18 years ago

Get over it!

Ich habe eine große schnabel
http://www.imdb.com/mymovies/list?l=12089049

[–] 18 years ago

[deleted]

[–] Supertzar 17 years ago

I did not defend the film, I haven't even seen it.

But it seems a little late to complain over a film that was made in 1980.
After all, the world goes on, and so does Hollywood.

http://stage6.divx.com/Film_Fanatic
http://www.imdb.com/mymovies/list?l=12089049

[–] preppy-3 16 years ago

Why are u telling people to "get over it" without actually seeing what a lousy movie this is yourself? U should get over yourself!

[–] JackRussellDog 16 years ago

I am not a lawyer but I think the staute of limitations has passed on what you deem as false advertising. I am sure the movie is bad, I always heard bad things about it throughout the years as I was growing up. I was a kid when this was in theaters and was years away from being allowed to see it without a guardian but I remember the bad reviews though. I am joking about the staute remark but why are you pissed off about Newhart plugging a crappy movie nearly thirty years ago? Why do we not go after Mike Meyers for The Love Guru?

[–] preppy-3 16 years ago

How about George Clooney saying how great "Batman and Robin" was and THEN tearing the film apart after it bombed? Actors and actresses have to plug their movies no matter how bad they are--that's just business. Anyways I think people watching these plugs realize that those not mean the movie is going to be good. I remember when Owen Wilson was plugging the movie version of "I Spy" on the Tonight Show. Then his co star Eddie Murphy just happened to show up! All I could think was, "Wow! The movie is THAT bad???":)

[–] WarpedRecord 13 years ago

Unfortunately, that's par for the course: Do the talk-show circuit to promote a film, then save face when it bombs by talking it down. I'd love to see honest opinions on late-night TV, but it's all one big infomercial.

I remember when Robert Blake appeared on Carson in 1980 and said his new film, "Coast to Coast," "sucks." And James Garner had a beef with his show and called it "The Rockford Flies." The studios have a whole system of checks and balances these days to keep that kind of frankness out of the airwaves.

But getting back to this film: I can't defend Bob Newhart showing a clip that wasn't in the film (if he even realized it wasn't), but I didn't mind this at all. As far as stupid comedies go, this is quite entertaining – like the "Police Academy" flicks, but with better writing.

[–] preppy-3 13 years ago

I can only think of one moment when an actor was honest about their movie being terrible. Bette Midler was on the Carson show to promote "Jinxed". Carson said, "I hear you're in a new movie." Midler sneered and said, "Oh yes. THAT!" and quickly changed the subject:)

[–] WarpedRecord 13 years ago

Oh yes, I remember that one too! It would be hard for Bette to praise "Jinxed" because its reputation preceded it for months before it was finally (barely) released.

The late-night chat shows were always pretty self-promotional, but they didn't used to be as bad as they are now, where probably three-fourths of the guest have a new product to promote.

[–] preppy-3 13 years ago

I sort of liked "Jinxed" but I know I'm def. in the minority:)

I stopped watching late-night shows after Carson left. Carson didn't have non-stop promotions on his show and, even when he did, he got his guests to talk about other things. Letterman and Leno can't do it as well as him.

[–] WarpedRecord 13 years ago

I like "Jinxed" as well! It's a lot of fun, and I have to say the uncomfortable chemistry between Bette Midler and Ken Wahl makes it weirdly watchable. And Rip Torn is also hilarious as the stiff.

I hardly ever listen to commentary tracks, but that would be wild if Bette and Ken would do one now (though they'd probably have to record it separately). Bette's career certainly didn't suffer because of it, and Ken would probably be wherever he is today regardless of that film.

I liked Letterman in the '80s, mainly for his comedy, but he just seems tired now. And reportedly, he's leaving in a few years. It's probably been more than a decade since I've watched his whole show.

[–] preppy-3 13 years ago

Well Wahl HATED Midler. When she first met him she said "Hello". He just glared at her and saidf, "I don't like fags and I don't like n*****s". (!!!) She never quite understood what he meant by that. He also likened kissing her as kissing a dog!!! Also the director couldn't stand her. Don't hold your breath waiting for any commentary. Wahl is no longer in the business and Midler never mentions the movie. But you're right--it WOULD be an interesting one:) Probably Rip Torn is the only one who would do it! LOL
Also I'm glad to find I'm not the only one who liked it:) I saw it opening night in Boston. It was me and (maybe) 7 people in the entire theatre! I DID hear people laughing at some of Midler's lines ("I'll never walk again") but mostly they sat there dead quiet.

Letterman--nothing against him but he's a bit TOO caustic at times. When Mitch Gaylord came on to promote that horrendous film "American Anthemn" Letterman laid into him. Granted the movie is dreadful but it's not Gaylord's fault! He also pulled out a huge poster of Gaylord with very little clothes on for some ad he did. Gaylord had nothing to be embarrassed about but the poor guy was!

[–] WarpedRecord 13 years ago

I was actually surprised that "Jinxed" was ever finished, much less released. There were so many horrible stories emanating from the set, and this was long before tabloid television and the Internet fed on this type of dysfunction. Rolling Stone magazine did a pretty in-depth story on the film's problems, and Bette Midler said Ken Wahl and director Don Siegel conspired against her. I don't think it even played near me when it was finally released, though I remember Siskel and Ebert panning it. Dog of the Week, maybe?

Hard to believe this was the same director that did "Dirty Harry," "Escape From Alcatraz," "Telefon" and the original "Invasion of the Body Snatchers." I suspect he was pretty much at the end of the line in his career (and his life). It was his last film.

As for Letterman, I've always found his interviews difficult to watch because they're so awkward. I wish he had just done a one-hour comedy show with his monologue and various bits and skits, or enlist celebs for "Will It Float" or whatnot instead of interviewing them. I started watching him when he was on the Starland Vocal Band's summer-replacement series in 1977 (I was about the only one who watched that), then he had his morning show where the set caught fire. So much of late-night TV patterned itself after the Carson show (monologue, skit, couch time with guests, musical act at the end) instead of playing on the strengths of the various hosts.

I actually finally saw "American Anthem" a few years ago on VHS, and yes, it's not very good at all, but rather entertaining and with a great soundtrack (which I've had for years). Definitely inspired by the MTV aesthetic of style over substance. It was heavily promoted there with a few videos, but it sank like a stone once it was released. But yes, Dave loved humiliating people who made him uncomfortable, and I suspect he felt awkward around Mitch Gaylord.

[–] preppy-3 13 years ago

Well "Jinxed" was a disaster cause Wahl and Siegel both hated her. They didn't like the fact that she was in command and went after her. Kinda sad actually but there are men like that. But look at now---Siegel is dead and Wahl can't get a job in the business and is effectively gone. Entertainment Weekly did a story and interview with him a few years ago and it was REALLY pretty horrible--but he dug his own grave. Siskel and Ebert hated a lot of movies I liked. "Jinxed" was no classic but it wasn't THAT bad!:)

"American Anthem" just proved that Miych Gaylord was VERY handsome, had a great body...but couldn't act. I also got a big kick out of the scene where he casually started smoking! I'm no gymnist but are they REALLY allowed to smoke???? Also the film was infamous for bombing so badly that it came out on VHS three MONTHS after it crashed and burned at theatres. Back then u had to wait a year.

[–] WarpedRecord 13 years ago

I just wonder how movies like "Jinxed" get to the point of being made when all signs point to disaster from the get-go. Bette Midler came off an Oscar nomination for "The Rose" and a successful concert tour and film with "Divine Madness" to make a "romantic" comedy with a co-star and director who despised her. At what point did anyone think this was a good idea for anyone? I'm sure money had a lot to do with it (I'm told it changes everything), but was the payoff really that great to endure all of this, and did anyone think this was a good career move?

I read the Entertainment Weekly story on Ken Wahl, about the "motorcycle accident" where he fell down the stairs. Very sad and strange, but I don't think he can blame anyone but himself. It's one of the more interesting career failures, right up there with Jan-Michael Vincent Mickey Rourke before the turnaround. Possibly even worse than the latter, if not the former.

As for gymnasts smoking: It certainly seems out of character, but I suspect a lot of them are neurotic dieters much like dancers so they take a puff for the nicotine fix instead of downing a doughnut. "American Anthem" also featured Michelle Phillips of the Mamas and the Papas (the only surviving member today, sadly), and an interesting soundtrack by the favorite flavors of the day: Mr. Mister, John Parr, Andy Taylor and INXS. Could a film with a Stevie Nicks song really be that bad? Sadly, yes it could.

[–] preppy-3 13 years ago

How did "Jinxed" get made and released? Easy. About two years before "Jinxed" there was a little film called "An Officer and a Gentleman" released. Debra Winger (the lead actress) HATED Richard Gere (the lead) and the director. They were fighting constantly and all agree that making that film was a living hell. Everyone predicted it was gonna be a big bomb. But it was a HUGE hit when it came out. So maybe the studio thought it could happen again.

Another probable reason is that Midler was very powerful (at that point) and a bit of a control freak (which killed her TV series). She might have pushed for it to be finished and released. Also Rip Torn says he had a huge amount of fun watching Wahl, Siegel and Midler go at it all the time. He (wisely) stayed out of it.

[–] tgibbs279 13 years ago

To get back to 'First Family' and Bob Newhart:

Movies can change -- a lot -- during the editing process. It's possible that when Newhart was on 'The Tonight Show,' he didn't know exactly how bad the movie was. Maybe he hadn't seen the finished product.
And he certainly didn't edit (and probably didn't pre-screen) the altered clip that aired on 'The Tonight Show.' He was an actor, appearing on a talk show, introducing a clip that the studio provided.

I once read an interview with Austin Pendleton, another actor who appeared in 'First Family.' He says the original script that he first read was completely different from the movie that ended up on the screen. He implied that the potential was there for a good movie, but somehow, the different elements just didn't gel.
Newhart did a newspaper interview, at the time, saying he and the cast had a wonderful time making the movie, and that as they made it, they thought they had a classic on their hands. Now maybe that's just "spin" to promote the movie, but it's also possible that Newhart and the others honestly believed it at the time.
In that interview, Newhart described a scene he especially liked -- that isn't in the movie. I have no doubt it was shot, but in the editing process, it was dropped. I doubt Newhart would have described the scene if he knew it wasn't in the film. It suggests to me he hadn't seen the final version. And it fits what Austin Pendleton said. The script, and the finished product, weren't the same.