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'Shaolin Challenges Ninja' Best Kung Fu film ever???


NO... not by a long shot.
But give this one a good ending, scratch that, any kind of coherent ending at all and its the best kung fu movie i've ever seen.

If you're a fan of Kung Fu films in general, do yourself a favor, see this and try to argue against any of the follwing:
a)that the concept of displaying Chinese martial arts vs Japanese martial arts is extremely interesting

b)that it's one of the best demonstrations of the use of Shaolin Kung Fu ever (or at least Shaolin Kung Fu in its stage/theatrical incarnation), courtesy of the extremely skilled Gordon Liu

c)The ending, namely the last 5 minutes nearly destroys your enjoyment of the first 100 minutes, but then you realize the first 100 were just too damn good... but yet you still quietly wonder what they were thinking, maybe something along the lines of: "hey i think we've actually got a masterpiece on our hands, quick better destroy it with the most putrid and convoluted ending in the history of cinema" Of course, being made in Hong Kong, its a little one-sided in favour of the Chinese martial arts, however they were fair and represented the equivalent Japanese martial arts reasonably well. I thought the story would have been better if they just ended at them declaring a draw, also poor Gordon had to take on all of them, why not get his uncle the Shuai Jiao expert come to his aid to face-off against the Judo expert, instead of him just pulling an Akiyama by greasing up.

Either way, the movie is great and needs a modern sequel or remake...

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this is my favorite classical Kung Fu flick so far.

The others that come close are
Shaolin Drunken Monk
5 Deadly Venoms

Gordon Liu is NOT extremely skilled in MA as it looks like.
the ending was awesome, I don't see the problem.

and style vs style is ALWAYS interesting for some reason.
It tickles the immature fantasy of what style is the best.


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Gordon Liu is NOT extremely skilled in MA as it looks like.


Gordon Liu (Lau Ka Fai) is not a street or cage fighter, no, but fighting ability and skill/knowledge of martial ARTS are two very different things. Of course the complete Martial Artist would have both, which I would contend he does to a certain extent.

When it comes to knowledge of the Arts, as mentioned by nonicetime Gordon was a senior student and eventual adopted son of Hung Gar (Hung Kuen) master Lau Charn, who has direct lineage to Lam Sai Wing, who of course inherited the style (known as one of Kung Fu's most practical for real fighting) from legendary Wong Fei Hung's own son. He also was part of the same Martial Arts troupes (Shaw Bros. & Chang Film Company) that graduated Jet Li, Jackie Chan, Sammo Hung and countless other accomplished stage Martial Artists into the mainstream; that fact alone without considering his Hung Gar lineage, in my mind, makes him "extremely skilled" (i.e. a skillset significantly greater than the average person with no knowledge or prior practice).

See: http://www.hkcinema.co.uk/Articles/Gordon_Liu_Biography.htm


the ending was awesome, I don't see the problem.


The ending was typical of most Kung Fu films China_doll1 said it best, should have been a submissive and apologetic Mizuno.

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I think its one of the better from that era. It doesnt have the typical you killed my borther and I will avenge him plot. Actually no one gets killed in the movie at all. The ending wasnt that bad I suppose. I dont expect great endings from Kung Fu movies though.


I am curious way you think Gordon Liu isnt as skilled as it seems. Its pretty apparent that he is quite fimilar with a variety of Chinese weapons. I also know he has studied with Lau Kar-Leung who is a master of Kung Fu and is a direct decendent of Wonf Fei Hong

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If Lau Kar-Leung is in Legend Of A Fighter, you've been seriously misinformed, since he said in an interview on the disc that he didn't know any martial arts at all.

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Lau Kar-Leung actually studies Hung Ga (Hong Kuen, Hung Fist). Gordon Liu (Lau Kar-Fei) is Lau Kar-Leung's real life adopted brother so he studies Hung Fist as well. In fact, in the Celestial Pictures DVD of this movie, Gordon Liu does talk about Hung Fist and his brother Lau Kar-Leung and his role in the "36th Chamber" movies.

Website for Lau Kar-Leung's school: http://www.laufamilyhunggar.com/

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Leung Kar Yan is in Legend of a Fighter... He was famous for not knowing any kung fu before he worked in films, but he had a natural talent for learning kung fu choreography.

Lau Kar Leung is a living legend. His father's master was Wong Fei Hung's top student.

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In the top 10, no doubt.

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The ending was really the most convolted i've seen!

What would tied the film perfectly was if Yuko Mizuno's character of the wife had some closure, riding into the sunset with her hubby Gordon liu. But no, we have the most contrived crap ever. Rumour has it that there was a female producer that was provoked with the casting of a strong woman like Mizuno's character so maybe that could have been the problem. I really like Yuko's role, too bad this was the only film she made according to imdb.

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this movie is so freakin bias, i mean all it says to me is that chinese martial arts are better, and guess what country made it, chinese people.

I mean u cant say that every chinese martial art is better than japanese
they need to give a little more proof

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"this movie is so freakin bias, i mean all it says to me is that chinese martial arts are better, and guess what country made it, chinese people."

I didn't see it that way at all. You have to keep in mind that the protagonist is Chinese, and if he were to lose, there goes the story right there. If anything, the movie's biased towards Gordon Liu - but again, being the main character, that's to be expected. Also, technically the judo guy should have won had they not cheated with the oil and all (hillarious stuff though). The nanchuku fighter also lost only because his weapon was shorter. Anyway, for its time this movie is actually pretty respectful to Japanese culture especially given the rough history between China and Japan. In fact, I don't think there's another movie like it (politically) out there except perhaps Fist of Legend and Fearless.

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true, i still say it would have to be proven in real life

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Great flick. I would have to say that this is in my top 5 of all time.

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Just saw this movie and all i can say is i agree on the bias with the Chinese kung fu being better than japanese martial arts, but the big picture was the main character was a better and SMARTER fighter and no matter what he didn't use it for evil, The point is both sides have the differences and each of them learn from there mistakes.

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Not really...
Just says that in the case of this "story" (yes a story, under the realm of which we have the likes of fairytale) that the Chinese style practitioner was capable of besting a series of Japanese martial art practitioner.

I think you're reading too much into it... Its like calling Rocky biased because it portrays a Philly tough guy as the best Boxer in the world, and that means that because it was shot in Philly it was biased towards Philadelphia-area boxers, I don't think so.

Its a story, and a damn good one IMHO, let's leave it at that

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Maybe if the entirety of Rocky involved Rocky insulting other boxing styles and regions you'd have a fair comparison.

Practically every scene of this film repeats the message that China is great and Japan is second-rate. "China's weapons are better, the fighting styles are better, the morals are better, the history is older, etc etc etc." It's actually a downer that such (yes) biased thinking is so omnipresent in a (yes) great film.

But hey, it was 35 years ago, so if its thinking is old fashioned, I think we can give it a pass.


Oh yes it's Laaarry Holmes/and the feeelin's right/Oh yes it's Laaarry Holmes/what a fight

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Going back to the bit about the film being biased, you also have to keep in mind that this came out during a time when bitterness and anti-Japanese sentiment was still at its peak in China. Most Chinese movies didn't just have the Chinese protagonist winning, but usually the Japanese antagonists would be sinister villains without a shred of honor. For its time, this movie really pushed past these things and the movie itself tries to establish an equilibrium between the two nations' martial arts. Bottom line is, if they didn't have Gordon Liu's character coming out on top, they'd probably get a lot of complaints from the general public.

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what could possibly be wrong with the ending?

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By the ending do you mean the very ending or the best fight scene ever filmed that precedes it?

black and white movies were better

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2 years later and just seeing this now... but by bad ending what I meant was the random shot at the very end, but I guess that's just typical Shaw Bros. The ninja surprise attack at the end was great but should have been filmed at night, and done in a more suspenseful location with lots of hiding places for the ninja to exploit. A narrow maze of alleyways for example, with a series or canopies or low roof tops would have been great.

I thought a cool ending would have been to show the Japanese learning Shaolin forms/techniques and vice versa, teaching Gordon Liu's character how to use Japanese weapons and different kata/fighting techniques.

In the very least, a proper apology from his wife for nearly getting him killed.


"An eye for an eye makes the whole world blind."
~Ghandi

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How exactly is the shot of him grabbing the sword random??


Oh yes it's Laaarry Holmes/and the feeelin's right/Oh yes it's Laaarry Holmes/what a fight

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8 Diagram Pole Fighter, Master of the Flying Guillotine and 36th Chamber of Shaolin are all much better than this.

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