MovieChat Forums > Hair (1979) Discussion > Berger and Bukowski trading places

Berger and Bukowski trading places

posted 12 years ago by angeles_st_ides
23 replies | jump to latest

I loved this movie as a teenager, and in many ways, I still do, but though as a kid, I could suspend my disbelief enough to buy that Berger winds up on the transport plane, in Vietnam, and then getting killed there, as an adult, I just can't get there!

There are just TOO many things that would have to go wrong for that to happen. One of his bunkmates would have recognized that it wasn't Bukowski, someone there for sure would have realized it, he himself would never have got on the transport, he'd have screamed "I'm not Bukowski!" and refused to go and damn the consequences. I mean, really, after all the illegal and crazy things he's done throughout the movie, he would worry about getting in trouble for pretending to be Bukowski (or worry about getting Bukowski in trouble for going AWOL?) No way!

If somehow none of the other soldiers recognized him AND he got on the transport, I'm sure it didn't go straight to Vietnam, it likely stopped in Hawaii or Japan or somewhere and THEN the truth would have come out. Or if it did go straight to Vietnam, there'd have been some sort of check in process where the truth would have come out.

It's simply unbelievable that at NO point did he ever say "uh, hey, I'm not the right guy" and the proceed to give the story of why he traded places and take the consequences. Even if the officers didn't believe him, they'd detain him and check out his story, not just send him out to battle.

I just can't suspend disbelief enough to accept this ludicrous scenario.

Other than that, I still very much enjoyed watching this again.

[–] gabby_bm 12 years ago

First, you have to accept the style of how the war was fashioned for the film. It was wanting to depict the war and the draft as a sort of "soldier mill" cranking out people in uniform as fast as they could make them. That Berger wasn't noticed by anyone augmented that perspective that he was just another uniform to get shot at.

Secondly, he DID burn his draft card so even if he could have gotten someone to listen, he was still drafted and still Vietnam-bound. I'm assuming that's what happened, as his name is on the headstone at the cemetery. So eventually all the kinks were ironed out and Berger still got screwed.

My "#3" key is broken so I'm putting one here so i can cut & paste with it.

[–] whjones79-1 12 years ago

It never would have happened in real life. His Bootcamp Company Commander would have taken one look at him and said: "Who the hell are you?"

K/H D

Re-Defeat Marxism. Vote wisely November 6th 2012!!!

[–] laurence01 12 years ago

It never would have happened in real life. His Bootcamp Company Commander would have taken one look at him and said: "Who the hell are you?"

Which is probably why it doesn't happen in the original stage version. In the stage version they discuss the possibility of swapping but don't go through with it.

Let Zygons Be Zygons.

[–] Forlorn_Rage 8 years ago

It never would have happened in real life. His Bootcamp Company Commander would have taken one look at him and said: "Who the hell are you?"

Bukowski's bunk was all the way at the end and the commander didn't bother to look to see whether it was Bukowski or not. Also, the solder who came in to announce their departure overseas didn't know him. So, that's how he was shipped out.

[–] AnneOnymous 12 years ago

I know this is a major plothole, but just think to the first time you ever watched the film: the shock twist at the end was so powerful, wasn't it? I think that's the important thing - it hammers home the tragedy of war in such a stark way, you only realise how unlikely it is when you have time to reflect afterwards.

However, if you are the kind of person (I know I am!) who wants to rationalize such an improbable scenario, I'd say that Berger has some kind of epiphany on the way to Vietnam and decides that serving in the army is the right thing to do in that situation, after all. And the line of the song, "I believe in God, and I believe that God believes in Claude, that's me" shows that he accepts that he's fulfilling some kind of higher purpose in taking Claude's place, so perhaps he goes out of his way to make sure he ends up serving.

[–] whjones79-1 12 years ago

That's entirely possible. Not likely but possible. I loved the ending. Especially when the kids were at Arlington and they had Burger's name correct on the headstone.

One thing I noticed there was that the date of death on the headstone indicated that he didn't last very long in Vietnam. I've got this thing on VHS somewhere but can't break it out right now.

What I noticed the FIRST time I saw this was that there was snow on the ground (with no indication of Christmas) in New York when they left for Nevada. The date on the stone was like March or April or something. Jeannie was ready to pop when they left. The baby they were holding couldn't have been a year old.

Regardless of a noble reason for his change of heart if there was one, his lack of proper military training was most likely what got him killed.

I did the bootcamp thing and I can honestly tell you that I wouldn't have wanted to find myself in a combat zone without it.

This is one of my top 10 movies of all time. It's for sure my favorite Musical. The music is great!!! Get the soundtrack if you can find it. You'll love it!

K/H D

Re-Defeat Marxism. Vote wisely November 6th 2012!!!

[–] crockett_john 7 years ago

The marker says April 6, 1968 which is in line with what you said.

Yeah, I don't think it would have taken long to figure out that Berger wasn't Bukoski. He would have been found out the first time Berger rendered a salute or didn't or wore his headgear in the wrong place or any number of things.

I think the marker on the grave with the correct name is just a plot convenience to show that it was actually Berger there. There's no way Berger came clean, got the mess straighened out, made it through training, then to Vietnam in that amount of time. Plus, Bukowski is there at the grave, too, so Bukowski dind't turn himself in, either.

---
I blame autocorrect.

You may all go to hell, and I will go to Texas.

[–] Forlorn_Rage 8 years ago

I know this is a major plothole, but just think to the first time you ever watched the film: the shock twist at the end was so powerful, wasn't it? I think that's the important thing - it hammers home the tragedy of war in such a stark way, you only realise how unlikely it is when you have time to reflect afterwards.

I completely agree.

However, if you are the kind of person (I know I am!) who wants to rationalize such an improbable scenario,

I still recognize that it is an improbable scenario, but the mise en scene (Bukowski's bunk being all the way at the end and not easily seen from the door) does make it more believable. Plus, surrounding bunkmates did give Berger looks when he answered for Bukowski. They just chose not to snitch on him.

I'd say that Berger has some kind of epiphany on the way to Vietnam and decides that serving in the army is the right thing to do in that situation, after all. And the line of the song, "I believe in God, and I believe that God believes in Claude, that's me" shows that he accepts that he's fulfilling some kind of higher purpose in taking Claude's place, so perhaps he goes out of his way to make sure he ends up serving.

I don't agree about serving, itself, being the "right thing." Even to this day, very few people would say that (thank goodness). I think he figured if one of them was going to go, it might as well be him.

[–] dawnantonis 12 years ago

I just rewatched this... and yes, I found it highly well, silly...

But then I do agree that he does become willing to replace Claude, when he is singing "I believe in God, and I believe that God believes in Claude, that's me"...

And all I could think was, wow, he has no military skills, no training.... he's not going to make it a day over there....

"We're gonna need a bigger boat"....

[–] 12 years ago

[deleted]

[–] jefgg 11 years ago

What if Berger decided he wanted to go into combat in place of Claude Bukowski? It's possible.

Wouldn't Claude have been court martialed then probably sent away to a prison like Leavenworth for a long time?

[–] whjones79-1 10 years ago

jefgg wrote: "Wouldn't Claude have been court martialed then probably sent away to a prison like Leavenworth for a long time?"

You can bet your best sister he would have been sent to prison. (or outright executed) Especially at war time.

K/H D

America got the Government it deserves!!! Welcome to the USSA!!!

[–] LaZedBoy 11 years ago

The guys you train with don't want to rely on some sudden random person who they don't know. Once it turns out Burger has had no training, they'd be even less interested to serve with him.

If he was killed in Viet Nam it was because died soon after arrival as a naive noob, or could be that he was hazed to death by his own squad who would see zero use in having him around.

Spock! Form an away team! You, me, Bones, Scotty and umm... Ensign Smith!

[–] godzillaprime 10 years ago

It's a musical.

[–] jillian.diamond 10 years ago

Initially wondered the same thing. But figured he had dodged the draft and coming clean with his identity would not have gotten him out of service or jail. He would have gotten training, but they likely both would have been sent to Nam. He would have been facing time on the stolen car as well.

[–] DeepFriedJello 10 years ago

Yea, what happened to Claude? Was he there at the end at Arlington? He'd have guilt the rest of his life knowing his friend died in his place.

[–] Quasi-Mofo 10 years ago

Greater love has no one than this, that one lay down his life for his friends.