MovieChat Forums > Die Ehe der Maria Braun (1979) Discussion > Question about the ending (HUGE SPOILERS...

Question about the ending (HUGE SPOILERS!)


So they both died. Seemed like that was accidental, but if so - that's just stupid! Forced bad ending is not any better then forced happy one (often seen in Hollywood movies). So why they died? Maybe Maria intentionally did it?

And another question: then Maria hears Oscar's will, she tells that she has a headache and retires to bathroom. Then we see her pouring water on her wrist... Here is the question: what does it mean? Is it some headache-calming technique? I had the feeling that she wants to commit suicide!

So what does it all mean? If their death was intentional, like, "we reached our goals, we don't have any other point to live, let's just die together" that's, well, unbelievable...

Any thoughts?

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Fasbinder's original ending had Maria driving herself and Hermann off a cliff to their deaths. Yes, she commits murder/suicide, but Fassbinder found the original method too obvious. No clue about the wrist-washing, though!

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But why did she want to kill herself AND her husband? That's very cruel. She doesn't want to live? Ok. But why commit murder?

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My view of the ending is as follows.

Maria worked hard to become a success and at great cost. It was all for her (idealized) marriage. She discovers that her husband and lover made a pact to share Oswald's wealth between Maria and Hermann as long as Hermann left Germany until Oswald died. It seems to me that she believed that Hermann only came back to share Oswald's legacy and that her marriage was a sham.

Hazel

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That's an interesting hypothesis! I guess, I should watch the film again.

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I think it's a great film so it's worth watching again anyway not just to see if my (hopefully right) hypothesis is correct.

Best,

Hazel

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That seemed to pretty obviously be the truth in the end...

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This is an incredible interpretation. I hope you don't mind, but I included your idea in film paper I have written on this film (credited, of course). If you would like to read it, you can email me at [email protected].

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Maria doesn't find out about the 'mad' testament before Senkenberg and the french notary come to tell her and her husband. Maybe that testament acts as a final trigger to make her decide to kill herself AND her husband at the same time (sic! a UNION they've only been able to perform once before - in their wedding night many years ago).
The story is very, very heartbreaking imho - because this movie is not only a perception of the general post-war west-german years, but also a very, very intense romance. I have no doubt that both characters never ceased to love each other truly - they simply had no chance to live that love due to 'the circumstances'. They had been robbed of their marriage after only one night of happiness, had to become other persons in the follwing ten years and are constantly trying to deny that.
There is also no proof that the notary ever made a 'pact' with her husband. I believe that only the accountant knew of the testament - he is also much more a human being than he usually shows, obvious at the moment when he tells Maria of Oswald's death.
I believe that Maria realized how she sold her soul to 'success', 'wealth' etc. in exchange for her true love (which she undoubtedly had before) and that she can't get it back. Hermann also always loved her but lost his self-respect while being imprisoned and therefore cannot match her as an equal.
I like the ending although it hurts me as well. What hurts is not the suicide - it is the fact that they die separately. So symbolic, though.

A man builds. A parasite asks "Where is my share?" - Andrew Ryan

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thanks for that. really helped me enjoy the film more, depressing as it was

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About the wrist-washing : it is indeed a headache soothing method.

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[deleted]

Yes, really, she "forgets" to turn off before... Damn, I really need to watch it again!

About your question: at the very beginning they marry under the explosions.

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[deleted]

Ok - maybe my hypothesis is dodgy but the ending is very confused - maybe she spotted she had accidently left it on and thought what a fab way of killing myself - but anyway - I can explain the beginning - Herman and Maria are getting married in a registry office when an air raid begins - despite the registrar's natural attempts to escape to safety they manage to persuade him to sign the marriage papers.

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the whole movie seemed very weird to me, not just the end.

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The ending might be more understandable if it is considered in the context of not only what Maria Braun was seeking to achieve in the years prior to that ending, but also what other Germans were seeking to achieve in the frantic rebuilding of the nation as they worked so hard. Bear in mind that in following the life of Maria Braun, the film is portraying her character as being representative of millions of German women in the years from 1945 to roughly 1970, and thereby the character (or, part of the character) of Germany during that time.

The ending may be considered to ask the question: "was it worth it? Sure, I succeeded in raising from the ruins of war a comfortable home in which we can live comfortable lives, but did I sacrifice too much to get here? Where do I go now? What do I do now? Has my purpose in life now been fulfilled, am I now no longer required?"

Maria Braun was not the sort of person who would have been satisfied with just plodding along in the comfortable life she had worked so hard to build for herself. With her motivation exhausted, what was left for her?

It remains questionable as to whether the suicide was intentional or accidental, but, either way, it makes sense in light of what the movie is about, of what Fassbinder was trying to say about German society during the years the film is based in. It was roughly 1970 (or, perhaps, a little earlier, the mid to late sixties) that men seriously started to reclaim their credibility and importance in German society. Therefore, Maria Braun's ending might also be considered to represent the end of the "women's era" in German society.

I thought it was a great film.

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The film ends in 1954 - the soccer game in the background is portrayed in "Das Wunder von Bern." It is at this time that Germany is being integrated into NATO through the Western European Union following the fiasco with the European Defense Community. 1954 in many ways marks the Bundesrepublik's reentry into the world as a sort of equal - with the German victory in Bern playing an important mental role as much as any of the political events that are occuring (note Konrad Adenauer's new-found acceptance of rearmament began earlier in the film because discussion started a couple of years before the ending is set). The men shown at the credits include Adenauer, Kurt Schumacher, and I believe Ludwig Erhard - I am not sure who the fourth is because I only watched the film once and didn't look closely enough. These are the major political actors in post-war Germany from 1945 until 1954 (Schumacher died in 1952).

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i think the fourth was Helmut Schmidt, a photo taken in the beginning of the 70's or somwhere around that..

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[deleted]

Quote:

And another question: then Maria hears Oscar's will, she tells that she has a headache and retires to bathroom. Then we see her pouring water on her wrist... Here is the question: what does it mean? Is it some headache-calming technique? I had the feeling that she wants to commit suicide!

/Quote

My understanding is that Maria realized that she had been essential prostituted out (Hermann agreed to leave until Oswald die in exchange for half of Oswald's money) and felt the need to cleanse herself of the filth.

Kind of contradictory since she uses herself to get so far in life.

Just my thoughts though. :)

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Don't know if it is worth replying as this is such an old thread BUT:

1) The ending is deliberately left more ambigious than in the original script (which was not by Fassbinder, but was amended by him for the final film). I think the point is that Maria, who up until this point has seemed very in control, has become careless. She has finally let herself go just slightly. The will essentially reveals that Maria has been labouring under an illusion - that she is a free individual - when she was an object of exchange between Oswald and Hermann. So she has been totally objectified basically and could not possibly go on living. She doesn't consciously acknoweldge this (it would be too painful) but Maria's unconscious won't let her live: hence the "mistake" of leaving the gas running (Freud said there is no such thing as a mistake, just an event for which we do not know our motivation).

2) the tap water is Maria's conscious way of trying to deaden the pain (remember she does the same when she hears of Hermann's death from Willi). She never sheds tears - the water becomes a substitute for tears (she only cries when singing a ridiculous song with Betti).

3) The very first shot is not of the marriage but a portrait of Hitler. Very important when you consider the final image is a portrait of Schmidt (German Chancellor in 1979 when Fassbinder made the film). There is more continuity between Hitler's Germany and Schmidt's Germany than was usually acknowledged (once again, acknowledgement remains at the level of the unconscious - conscious recognition being too painful)


Great film!

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I wish the subtitles would have done a better job of translating what was said in the will. If it indeed did have a catch that hermann couldn't come back until after his death then, yes she probably was killing both him and herself out of embarassment and anger. There is no doubt it was on purpose. She looked at her cigarette, and remembered she couldn't light it off the stove cause she blew out the pilot, and then asked for a light. Generally she like lighting it off the stove.

But I thought it could be a coincidence when he came back. And remember she left the stove on before the will was read. I got the feeling that she was planning on killing them cause she never really wanted a true relationship, and now that the situation was perfect she wanted to end it. She was trying to live a doll house life, but she wasn't a doll. She enjoyed her fleeting relationships and didn't seem so sad when they ended.

I thought this film really had an anti women's lib undertone to it also. Maybe she blew up the house because she was too much into the aggressive business like lifestyle, and this had killed her idealistic feelings of romance and love. Maybe he was saying women can't be truely feminine and intiment when they are involved in competition.

Like the other fassbinder movie I saw, it is much better for discussion than watching in my opinion. I feel he leaves holes in his movies on purpose though, I don't think there is a truely logical answer to the plot, but it does create a lot of questions about life in general that are fun to discuss with friends.

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I just saw the move on IFC. I think she forgot to turn the gas off. Getting headaches is the first sign of being poisoned by gas sometimes. I thought when she said she had a headache she would remember the gas. If she was going to commit suicide she sure would not try to help a headache. And that is a way of soothing a headache and cooling yourself off. I do it all of the time if it is a slight headache.
Also why would she ask for a light if she knew all she had to do is go into the kitchen and blow herself up? Suppose he had a light? I am sure there was not enough gas in the whole house because she opened a window and the couple just walked out of the door. I don't think she remembered she didn't turn the gas off when she asked for the light. Remember that couple came over and she got all dressed up for them. She even straightened her hair up. People who are going to kill themselves don't do that. She had no idea they were going to leave while she was in the bathroom. Gas is not oderless. That is not the way you commit suicide when there is people around. He could of detected it. Someone was going to smell it after a while. I am sure if she was going to commit suicide she would of turned the gas off as soon as they rang the door bell and she said she had forgot they were coming. Why answer the doorbell if you were going to kill yourself, he certainly didn't want her to answer it.
I just think the movie showed that just when a person thinks they made it, boom everything could end just like that. That's all. Things like that happen all of the time with gas stoves, before the safety features were added. I also think the football game and the annoucer cheering that the team had won for the first time was signifigant in someway. I don't think suicide had anything to do with it. But something that never happens happened..such as her not getting all of the the money. Remember this is a woman who got her way and stepped over people. Heck she got married during a air raid drill.

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I agree, Marbleann. I saw nothing that made me feel the explosion was planned. Maria clawed her way up in order to have something for herself (and her husband, assuming he survived the war). She did what she had to to survive. It would have been more logical (if logic has a place in Fassbinder's philosophy) for her to kill herself earlier in the movie.

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Same here - it certainly looked like an accident to me. The one thing that really bothers me, though, is the final shot before the explosion. Hermann looks into the kitchen, is horrified, and covers his face just before the blast. WTF is up with that? Regardless of accidental or intentional, how would he know that an explosion was imminent? If he did know there was a leak, why didn't he shut it off earlier?

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from what i understand about igniting gas, you can literally watch the flames spread.. so its possible that hermann saw the first ignition of the stove, before the whole gas system was triggered, causing the explosion..

as to the ending, from what i've read (and, as some of you have already posted), the original script had maria commit suicide, but fassbinder changed it. if you check out the commentary track on the criterion disc, it give some insight into what fassbinder had in mind when he shot the ending: the film can be seen as a parable for the rebuilding of germany (again, as someone else also said in an earlier post), but also how the germans were already forgetting their past in their attempts to rebuild and move on (maria forgets the gas). also, if you pay attention to the radio broadcast in the background, right before the explosion, you can hear the newsman say that germany is going to rearm and rebuild their army (an idea which was dismissed in an earlier radio broadcast in the film). so, the ending wasn't just thrown in to wrap up the film, but rather had some deeper implications.

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Thinking some more about this, I think the ending is metaphorical. It is of course very noticeable it is GAS that kills Maria. Gas, as someone posted, is odourless, can be left unnoticed -indeed is an ideal way to kill millions of people as secretly as possible. As the football announcer screams, that Germnay are masters of the world, so the gas sneaks out over Maria's house (symbol of New Germany). The gas still lingers in the air even though Germany wishes to forget it. He is talking about the Holocaust.

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Who is talking bout the holocaust???
I think the gas is symbol for the new rebuild Germany. Gas stoves were installed in houses where until then only were wood stoves. I know bout the gas chambers in the camps, but that doesn't explain anything.
I think that Maria kills herself (not her husband) because what she found out about her husband and her lover, but mainly because Germany is getting back on its feet. She learned to cope during the difficult years and now those are over. Her husband is back and so is a life of mediocracy, with football on tv. She sees no way to go on in this new situation...


+++ ies it safe? +++

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SO HERE IS HOW I FEEL:
I think she kills her husband accidentally because I feel that Fassbinder was trying to illustrate that German corruption and capitalism after WWII would destroy German nationalism and cultural identity. Her husband was a Nazi soldier who could represent the cultural nation of Germany. When her husband is gone, lost, missing, whatever you may call it Bill and Karl (her two lovers) could represent foriegn influences and capitalism after the war. She becomes corrupted by the foriegn influences and capitalism and in her blinded distraught after the revelation of sorts she destroys herself and her husband. It think it's rather symbolic.

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I think it was an accident, I think. In her excitement she blows out the flame as one would blow out a match. When she goes into the kitchen to light the last cigarette. . . . . the place is blown up. However, she must have smelled the gas. Gas in a stove is not scentless on purpose. . . . to alert people that there is a danger. Could she have been so distracted that she didn't even notice the gas? Did her husband cry out because he suddenly smelled the gas, and knew what would happen? Yes, very questionable ending.

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Maria forgetting that she forgot the gas was on is an allegory for post war German citizens. They tried to forget about the recent past, and even maybe to forget about forgetting it.

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Gas in a stove is not scentless now. But it's not a natural occurance, it's an additive. It's possible that in Germany just post WWII this additive had not yet been added? Just a thought.

ahhh, james taylor, the popular singer/songwriter/puzzle piece
-homer simpson

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I went to a screening of this two days ago where Juliane Lorenz, the movie's editor (and president of the Fassbinder Foundation) answered questions.

She confirmed that the original ending had Maria engineering a car crash but said Fassbinder wrote the new ending just before shooting it (1) in order to make it more ambiguous (2) to include the football commentary. She said the football match in question was a significant event in Germany (a little like England's World Cup win in 1966) and symbolised Germany's recovery as a nation for many people.

I think the point made before about Freud's theory of accident is spot on.



"I don’t like the term torture. I prefer to call it nastiness."

Donald Rumsfeld

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Thanks for this post. As I said in February, the film ends in 1954 and the soccer match in the background is (as of 2003) portrayed in "Das Wunder von Bern." It is at this time that Germany is being integrated into NATO through the Western European Union following the fiasco with the European Defense Community. It marks the moment when Germany is allowed by other continentals to rearm and become an equal. The football match itself was obviously a great milestone for Germans. To be honest, it was this article in the Neue Zuercher Zeitung (http://www.nzz.ch/2006/06/14/eng/article6795463.html) that reminded be to check this page -- it centers upon the win in Bern.

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many good ideas so far.

Just think that it is strange that people thought she *consciously* commited suicide.

She seemed to be at least very drunk when the guests arrive to read the will. To the point that she opens the door with her underwear on.

The whole atmosphere was that of a big party between her and her husband. A decadent one, but a party nonetheless.

Moreover, he realizes that the gas was on immediately before she ignites it.
So he was aware of it, probably in the same half-conscious way she was. They both just woke up to the fact when it was too late.

Very good movie. Just watched Lola today, even better. Recommend watching all three.

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Wow...this is a pretty interesting thread. I love seeing the ideas flow, I wonder what Fassbinder himself might say about it...

To me, there is no suicide..not at all. But maybe the awareness that Maria experiences (the movie is told through her after all, she's the important one) just before she is blown to kingdom come is the awareness that everything she has done, everything she has worked for leading up to this moment is worth very little. Because in leading her life the way she did, she ignored a lot of things that she should not have ignored.

Pretty crazy leap you might say. Ignored? What did she ignore? What are you talking about?

I watched this film because of a friend of mine in my History classes said to watch it. See, I'm a History guy, not a film guy, and usually, "arty" films like this elude me...but not this one. Because I know about German history, and I know when and where this director was born (in Germany, in 1945) and I know a little about what it must have been like growing up (in a country full of people all trying to come to grips with their recent past...or NOT coming to grips with it and instead focussing on whatever was handiest to help them not have to focus on it...which was making money and buying gadgets and immersing themselves in consumerism dreams, ANYTHING to avoid having to acknowledge anything more serious).

And that any young German person with some artistic sensibilities...like a renowned filmmaker like Fassbinder..growing up seeing this could be tough, and you might want to say something about it..like make a statement about "what the hell are you all doing? don't you realize what we've been through? don't you understand that not ackowledging it is insane?".

looking at it through THOSE glasses...this movie is a breathtaking and bitter condemnation of what Germany was and where it was going. All wrapped up in that final scene! And maybe a cry to stop heading that direction. Which maybe only someone like FAssbinder..someone born in 1945 and with no real traces of guilt themselves...could even give voice to in that country. A really truly magnificient piece of art, I don't think i ever enjoyed a movie as much. Bravo.

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[deleted]

My contribution to this question.......

The film is shot through with interweaving symbols that work to awaken an awareness of
the point of view of ordinary Germans during the second world war. This was ground breaking
in it's time, because the shock of the second world war had effectivly placed a taboo on seeing
Germans as human in cultural representation. The play of symbolism is ambiguous, therein which
lies it's intelligence. Rather than being a metaphor for something concrete, the story alludes to
German experience during that historical period with ambiguous but constant presence.

So Maria's series of shocks, of loss of the same man, reflect the birth throws of the German nation,
which for the ordinary person were a series of devestating blows, From the Loss of the First World
War & subsequent humiliation under the Versailles Treaty's - to the rise of Facism & the utter defeat
at the end of the second world war. All these, to someone like Maria, where just a series of kicks in
the stomach.

This is primarily a love story. It's about the extremes people will go for love and it's also about
ordinary people. But through that epic theme Fassbinder constantly raises the spector of history. For
example the 'collaboration' between French & German in the business Maria joins alludes to that issue
in Facist France. That theme of betrayal, so close to the theme of love & war.

Seen from this perspective, the gesture of leaving on the gas makes sense. Inhabit all the
possibilities of why has this happened, as does Maria. It's the culmination of the play of allusion
that's at work throughout the whole film. In fact, it could be said, it's the only moment that Maria
conciously deals with the dispair she lives with, despite the whole film being about this subject.
As soon as that moment is over, she & we fall back into the reality where things just happen and we
accept them because we have no power. The moment is a question for everyone, why did Germany
commit suicide? why do we go on? why is this happening to me? Do i want what is happening ? It's
also a seizing of life. Maria sees in a flash a way of keeping him, of controling him, of controling
destiny and perhaps of punishing him. An ultimate act of love.



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one way to look at the film is in a german historical and "what if" context. a professor of mine claims that one level of this film is about the reunification of east and west germany, and that doing so would end in the destruction of germany as a whole... or something, so that's what the whole explosion at the end is about (on one level). the two halves of germany finally unite (maria and hermann are finally about to consumate their marriage), and then boom, it's WWIII. or at least, that's kind of how my professor put it.

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If thinking about cutting ones wrist, one may hold the wrist under very cold water for a while then the pain is numbed, after the cut is made one should submerge the wrists in warm water, as that aids the flow of blood. This was a method used by Lee Harvey Oswald when he attempted suicide after defecting to the USSR and learning they were going to send him back to the US.

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I studied the film at university nearly 20 years ago.

It all has to be seen in historical context.

When Maria and Oswald are getting to know one another, there is a speech in the background of Konrad Adenauer, stating that Germany wants peace and not rearmament.

When she is dining alone after his death, the speech turns to one that says Germany needs to rearm to defend itself.

The football is crucial. At the very end, Germany is the world football champion, and is literally on top of the world. The gas explosion, which is accidental, is used by Fassbinder to show that Germany supremacy in any field is inextricable linked to tragedy. The explosion is linked also to the beginning, and the images of Hitler and successive German Chancellors in negative (Adenauer, Erhard, Kiesinger, Schmidt - Brandt was not used as Fassbinder considered him to be an exception).

The whole leitmotif was that even though Germany had lost a war and was gradually rebuilding and being a successful economy, nothing much else had changed, particularly in the light of the repressive SPD regime of the 1970s in the time of the Baader-Meinhoff attacks, the kidnap and murder of Hans Martin Schleyer and the rest.

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Thanks for this post and for this whole thread. Now it makes a lot more sense to me. I really enjoyed the movie though mainly because it had some very peculiar jokes in it. Now I like it even more.

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At the end, when she went upstairs to dress, I was struck that she appeared to wear her wedding dress.
I think it's a significant element that appears to have been missed here.

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It didn't seem like an accident to me. Herman saw something off screen (he yelled, "no, no") and his appearance suggested he knew he was about to be murdered. I think a foreboding of what was to come occurred when Maria stated, in response to another character stating "consciousness lags behind reality," "for me reality lags behind consciousness." Maybe she did it because she couldn't live with the fact that she didn't see it, the conspiracy between Herman and Karl, coming or maybe she did it because she had an epiphany that revealed a future bleaker than the past, so she took matters into her own hands, as she always did.

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