Does anyone feel sorry for Bill Hayes after seeing the movie? - Midnight Express (1978) Discussion

[–] 16 years ago

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[–] 16 years ago

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[–] frana43 16 years ago

I, for one, felt sorry for Hayes because he was not meant to get arrested -
he happened to be ending his trip on a day when there was a military scare
and had more of a misfortune in being caught, than trying to smuggle drugs.

But I also wish the film had stuck to the book, and not been 'racist'.

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[–] kellymariekitty 8 years ago

Not meant to get arrested???? He was a drug smuggler!!!
And this was his 4th trip...not 1st but FORTH!!!!!

He is low life scum bag - all drug dealers / smugglers etc are drug dealers who deserve to be banged up. If the guards treated him badly, ok that's not nice but hes in a Turkish prison for crying out loud - what did he expect, nice treatment???

He deserved what he got - I disagree with the life sentence though - that's way to harsh - he didn't murder anybody but I guess a smuggling charge is more accurate than possession.

I agree that the 3-4 years & then WHAM!! straight to 30 years was really harsh. He paid his debt to society & I think that should have been enough. He didn't deserve life and - even though he deserved jail cos hes a smuggler - this film made me realise, im never going to turkey ever!!!

Not in a million years & I have never, nor would I ever break the law & do something like this - way to scary but Turkey as a holiday destination?? Errrr nope.
No now, not ever!!

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[–] bugaloos 14 years ago

We are supposed to feel sorry for him because he had already served 3.5 years, was beaten, tortured and then given 30 years just for hashish possession/smuggling. It was a ridiculous, cruel conviction! I felt very sorry for him. Yes, it was stupid smuggling hashish, but 2-3 years is enough!

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[–] intangible103 16 years ago

The question is not guilt or innocence, but of justice.

If you believe his sentence and brutal treatment were unjust, then sympathizing with him is completely understandable.

You may think he deserved punishment but do you believe he received JUSTICE?

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[–] rojman 16 years ago

well said

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[–] Michael_Essien 16 years ago

definitley. Who could survive in a *beep* when youre told its a 4 year sentence then they extend it to thirty? I dont know much about the law, but i would think the sentence should be more than 4 years primarily, but its ridiculous to prolong a sentence more than its orignial length without any real reason.

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[–] lomd 12 years ago

There is a comment in the Wikipedia talk page about the movie stating that actually his sentence was almost over by the time he fled (in real life, that is). Extending his nominal sentence is certainly a shocking notion for those used to western courts, but paying too much attention to that is missing the point.

In all honesty, I am sorry that the movie glosses over the seriousness of the reason why he was arrested in the first place and then goes on to put him in a largely fictional nightmare scenario. The movie is basically a fantasy thriller in the tradition of, say, Stephen King stories. It just happens that it is disguised as a political statement movie, when in fact it is anything but; the only political statement that is does is "I don't care about responsibility, I want to complain and get away with it".

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[–] Elmware 13 years ago

I believe that he broke the law on someone else land and therefore should take what they dish out to him irregardless. Even if it was the death sentence, like in China.

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[–] bmodica 16 years ago

Even when I saw the movie in 1978, I wasn't at all sorry for this idiot. He's breaking the law in a foreign country known for its harsh treatment. He got what he deserved. If you can't do the time, don't do the crime.

Billy the Kid

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[–] novastar_6 15 years ago

At the time though WAS it known for doing what it did? I don't think so otherwise probably nobody would ever go there. Sure I feel sorry for him after seeing the movie, I really feel sorry for him after reading the factual book, and if there's one thing I know it's that I ain't EVER going to Turkey, even if I didn't do anything I wouldn't trust them not to try and arrest me anyway.

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[–] ramsfan 15 years ago

Mixed feelings about Billy Hayes. I think as a human being, one can't help but feel sympathy for the horrific conditions he had to endure- surely the punishment didn't fit the crime here, and he also suffered the indignity of having his sentence lengthened shortly before he was due to be released.

On the flip side, I have little tolerance for drug users, and it is typical American thinking that other countries should think as we do in terms of punishment for certain crimes.

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[–] 15 years ago

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[–] just_a_guy 12 years ago

"...I have little tolerance for drug users..."

And how about abusers of alcohol? OK to treat them the same way?

____
Love the Christian, Hate the Dogma

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[–] gribfritz2 11 years ago

Abusing a legal substance is not good. Abusing an illegal substance is obviously doubly bad. How about trafficking an illegal substance in a foreign country. That's idiocy times ten.

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[–] kellymariekitty 8 years ago

I agree with that - even though he deserved it cos hes a smuggler - im never going to turkey ever!!! Not in a million years & I have never, nor would I ever break the law & do something like this - way to scary but Turkey as a holiday destination?? Errrr nope.
No now, not ever!!

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[–] Elmware 15 years ago

Exactly.

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[–] 15 years ago

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[–] bmodica 14 years ago

Gee, DLY. How so very pithy. What's wrong with my assessment? He knew he was breaking the law, and he knew of the conditions of incarceration. Do I enjoy what happened to him? Of course not. But he did it to himself. No one forced him into smuggling. So, he got caught in a barbaric country, and paid the price those peoples felt was justified.

Billy the Kid

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[–] 14 years ago

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[–] bmodica 14 years ago

I stand by my statement, DLY. He did it, he knew what he was doing, he went ahead and did it anyway. Should I feel sorry for a family man of 4 kids, who holds up a 7-11, and gets 15 years? Not at all.

Billy the Kid

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[–] 14 years ago

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[–] lem15 14 years ago

You're a real tough guy, Billy.

You'd be servicing every guy in your section of the Turkish prison if they locked you up for even one night for jaywalking. You'd hand over your own daughter if they looked at you sideways.

Punk.

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[–] bmodica 14 years ago

Gee, Lem. So cogent. So precise. What insight!

Billy the Kid

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[–] 14 years ago

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[–] lambiepie-2 15 years ago

I don't think you are to feel sorry for him about the crime he committed, you are to feel sorry for him as they way he (etc) were treated in jail and the backwards justice that was handed down to him and others.

He tried to smuggle Hash into to America back in the day. That is a crime in Turkey. (America too if he got caught on the other side, think about that?) He should have served time? Possibly. Point is, he did...then they tacked on 30 more years...and, life? For what? Was it because they could? Because he was an American? Was justice fair to THIS man's crimes? That's the point. And it shed light to how others were being treated in the prision/court systems as well.

"Whoever is bitten by a werewolf, becomes one himself!"

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[–] mük 15 years ago

well are you talking about fictional billy hayes or the real billy hayes? the fictional one obviously went through a lot, but it is not the true experience of billy hayes...

in his interview, he says that besides being locked up he did not have any problems at all in jail..

part1 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pHjLMnGkedU&feature=related
part2 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_JTRs8e-FRk&feature=related

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[–] 15 years ago

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[–] WatchAnythingOnce 12 years ago

From Midnight Express Truth Revealed - Part 2 (0:39 seconds in)

"Once I learned how to acclimate, how to move within the world of the Turkish prison, I got along...I didn't have too many problems, other than the fact that I'm in jail and you miss the life, you miss women, you miss the fact that life is going on outside and it's not happening for you and even...the worst for me is, I miss my parents..."

He makes it clear that he experienced the expected difficulties that would be found in any prison, but he did not suffer the unrelenting brutality depicted in the film.

I think you would have to have a heart of stone not to feel some sympathy for the film version of Billy Hayes because what he suffered was out of all proportion to the crime he committed. The real-life Billy Hayes? Not as much - the extension of his sentence is the only aspect of the story that prompts a little sympathy in me. Otherwise, he committed a crime, he went to jail. That's what happens...

The real-life Billy Hayes is much more likeable than the film version, though.

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[–] kellymariekitty 8 years ago

I believe the 30 years extra was a charge for smuggling. Originally he was caught for possession - but the prosecutor wanted a smuggling charge because of how much he had. And considering Billy himself confessed this was his 4th time - smuggling is accurate!

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[–] marktayloruk (2375) 2 years ago

It's not fair to.add extra time like that. The Turks should legalise soft drugs and tax them.

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[–] ManicMuse 15 years ago

I didn't feel bad, but I think that is because of how the movie was made. It is skewed toward american's being good guys regardless of what they do (especially white males), and I felt it through the whole film. it really turned me off. i liked the very beginning then it was all down hill.

maybe if it was a less sensationalized and prejudiced portrayal of the situation, i could have focused on the idea of a short sentence being extended to the extreme, and a young guy being used as a pawn in that political game. of course he should serve time, but extending it that long had nothing to do with billy's crime, it was about politics. this is something that goes on in america too.

i also think all the characters were to one-dimensional, including billy, which makes them hard to care about.

"WHO'S ON TOP & WHO'S ON BOTTOM NOW, huh?! WHO'S ON TOP & WHO'S ON BOTTOM NOW!"

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[–] sonofbeach-sheet 15 years ago

I personally couldn't stand the Billy in this movie and thought he was too whiny. The real Billy Hayes took it much better and owned up to what he did. And the Turks were portrayed as dumb or monstrous for the most part. There was no alien warden in the book, like the one in the movie; he was just based on several of the guards in the book, including one that was shot to death by a former prisoner

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[–] helenelisechat 15 years ago

Of course I felt sorry for him. That's the whole point of the film!

He's taking the knife out of the Cheese!
Do you think he wants some cheese?

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[–] 15 years ago

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[–] stevenackerman69 14 years ago

You know, that is a good point. He broke the law. Wouldn't you love to see Judge Joe Brown say something about this? He'd probably say, 'You ain't being a man, I'll tell you that, son.' As for thanking Turkey, I think our relations then were pretty bad, which was why it was so hard for Billy to get out to begin with. We might've said, "Well, you let him escape. Tough titty."

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[–] EdsDiner 14 years ago

I read in a interview with John Hurt (dont ask me where , cos i forgot) that the reason the exteneded the sentence to life was cos the turkish court did some research on Billy Hayes and found he had previously did some crime in the US such as robbery, John Hurt basically said that the real Billy Hayes was no innocent.

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[–] 14 years ago

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[–] estratton422 14 years ago

No, the Turkish authorities added the time because they wanted to charge him with smuggling instead of possession, four years after the fact. Up until this point, I don't see a lot to sympathize with Hayes as he pretty much received the punishment he deserved. However, the 30 years was completely excessive and vindictive, so I do feel sorry for him in this regard.

Anyway, the real Billy Hayes is a much more interesting person than the movie character. He's very honest and forthright about what he did, so I have no criticisms for him. Let's not forget, this was 40 years ago and he was just a young kid. He's obviously grown and matured, earning the second chance he took by escaping.

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[–] lobotomyboy63 14 years ago

The first time I saw the film, I couldn't figure out why I should feel sorry for him. Tonight, Nat Geo TV has him telling his story on the Locked Up Abroad show. Turns out he had smuggled hashish like 3x before that, thought he'd never get caught, etc. He says it was the Palestinians blowing up planes that heightened airport security etc.

Still don't feel sorry for him, no. Had he not been caught that time, I bet he would have gone back and done it again.

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[–] 14 years ago

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