MovieChat Forums > Halloween (1978) Discussion > Minimal at best.

Minimal at best.

posted 6 years ago by artguylarry (498)
14 replies | jump to latest

There's a certain loyalty that goes with loving this film. And I am loyal to it like that. But I have to admit to really liking Zombie's version just a little more. After all, it tells us everything about Michael we need to know. Carpenter's version expects us to piece it together for ourselves. And maybe some do, but some don't. In the 2007 version, we know who and what Michael is and why he is what he is. We knew more about Michael from the reboot than we EVER did from the original.

But...the original is still a classic we have to love. Just because it is the source on which everything was built.

[–] AdamWaldron96-2 (178) 6 years ago

I can see why you would prefer the Rob Zombie version better than the original. On its own, the Rob Zombie version does give us a raw, inside look at what makes a killer (bullying, domestic abuse, poor family background, shitty institution with people who are scummier than you). For those reasons, I love the Rob Zombie film.

But I can also see why others hate the Rob Zombie film as well, because some prefer Michael Myers to not be answered, to remain a mystery. He's a force of nature in the original film, he cannot be explained logically, he knows things that he shouldn't like driving a car. Whereas in the remake he's a result of nurture, his family background, growing up in the shady institution, his psychiatrist writes a book about him to profit off the blood of his family, and then leaves him.

I like the original film just fine, but I point out flaws it has on the technical level, like the palm trees in the background where its supposed to be Illinois, the inside of the Wallace house and the Doyle house does not match with their exteriors. But yet despite the flaws, everyone seems to not notice them or forget about them, and that's how much of a powerful impact the original film has that people can just forget those little technical details.

[–] sslssg (27398) 6 years ago

My problem with knowing the Michael's background is that I can understand him. I can empathize with him. That's not scary to me. For me it's not so much the logical explanation, it's the sympathetic circumstances that Zombie puts him in. Michael didn't have to be pure evil to be scary, but I don't want to feel sorry for him either.

[–] LeWildPlatypus (765) 6 years ago

But...the original is still a classic we have to love. Just because it is the source on which everything was built.

I get what you're saying and I don't always agree the original should always be hailed the best. But the minimalism plays a large part in the genius of 'Halloween', it's not a dialogue/plot heavy film yet it's atmospheric and intriguing enough to make it instantly re-watchable. Not everyone will agree of course.

[–] Stratego (29178) 6 years ago

No way. The remake is like a trailer trash version of Halloween. The original is highly sophisticated in comparison.

[–] spurtle467 (1498) 6 years ago

The remake is bloody awful. I thought the point was that we're not meant to know why Michael Myers is this way inclined. It's supposed to be a mystery to us and that's the way I prefer it. I have no care for knowing what his upbringing was like when he was a child.

[–] ShogunofYonkers (71429) 6 years ago

I really enjoyed the remake...ive seen it a few times and it holds up well

But as you stated, the mystery of what or who Michael is keeps bringing me back to the original
I remember my first viewing when Dr. Loomis empties his pistol into Meyers and he falls over the railing into the yard below
When Laurie peers over the edge Michael simply isnt there!
That scared the hell out of me

[–] spurtle467 (1498) 6 years ago

Yes. The less you know the more scary it is I find. To go into detail about why he's the way he is takes away the illusion and the imagination we attribute to it.

I understand if they wanted to make the remake different to the original so as not to be a scene by scene retread, but they should have found something else to do differently. To try and explain Michael Myers and give us an insight into his background is sacrilege in my opinion.

[–] ShogunofYonkers (71429) 6 years ago

The background stuff in the remake was a tad cheesy...i grew up with a few neighbor kids who arguably had it way worse and none of them grew up to be a supernatural serial killer...
The mystery of the original was a key to its success

[–] bigbadwolf666 (4707) 6 years ago

Yea Rob Zombie was probably doin' coke when he was makin' that shit. What in the hell does that have to do with the original? and supposedly he wanted to make the mask look scarier it looked dumber like some trash that hadnt been washed. The white glow in the original was a lot more scary and unique. Also the original was more like a sister-brother hate theme. Where this was just white washed hick trash. Goes to show when you compare the directors who's the Master.

[–] replicant4 (219) 6 years ago

Rob Zombie completely missed the point, and the mystique....of Halloween, and what makes Carpenter's version such a masterpiece. For starters, as others have said, the less we know about MM, the better. When I first saw the original as a kid, I was mystified by Michael Myers. He didn't seem human. Just an unstoppable force, looming in the shadows. And the brief glimpses of his background that we get are just enough. For example, Dr. Loomis' monologue:

"I met him, 15 years ago; I was told there was nothing left; no reason, no conscience, no understanding in even the most rudimentary sense of life or death, of good or evil, right or wrong. I met this... six-year-old child with this blank, pale, emotionless face, and... the blackest eyes - the Devil's eyes. I spent eight years trying to reach him, and then another seven trying to keep him locked up, because I realized that what was living behind that boy's eyes was purely and simply... evil."

That's all the backstory we need on MM. I think Zombie blew it in so many ways with his remake. Especially by humanizing MM and showing him as a kid. To me, MM is a faceless, soulless demon. Not some kid with a bad, trailor trash childhood. Zombie also didn't understand how impactful and artful the minimalist approach was in the original. There was almost no blood at all in Carpenter's film. Whereas in the remake, Zombie gets off on the blood and gore, which makes the movie no better than any other cookie-cutter gorefest.

"Was that the boogeyman?"

"As a matter of fact, it was."

Cue the music.
Masterpiece.

[–] Costumer (1785) 5 years ago

I great part of the mystique and horror of Michael Myers is that there is no reason for his evil. From what we can tell he was born into a loving family and suffered no abuse, but decided to murder his sister. I find that far more terrifying than a typical and cliched story of a badly abused child becoming a killer.

[–] hurricane (1907) 5 years ago

^ This.

I never really liked horror movies that showed too much backstory, or that made you feel sorry for the killer. In a way it's more disturbing if the killer came from an affluent background, born to loving parents, got good grades and had a lot of friends at high school, was dating the prettiest, nicest girl. Then suddenly goes off on a killing spree. No reason. No justification. No blaming his background. He just revels in the torture of others. That's scarier in a way, then some guy you feel sorry for and don't blame.

[–] DracTarashV2 (4474) 5 years ago

Sarcasm by any chance? Preferring the horrid remake because it explains almost everything you need to know about Michael? I say to each each his own but... it’s still funny to hear that. Getting an explanation to Michael’ evil is a major reason why even the more open minded fans of the original detest that movie. I guess I can understand what Zombie was going for, but there’s absolutely no mystery to Michael, so what makes him standout compared to many other movie serial killers? (Sure, dude’s appearance itself was smoother than most heh). Plus his backstory was, to put it mildly, not the best.

What made “The Shape” the, well, Shape in Carpenter’s film was the mystery surrounding his character; since his motives are so mysterious, I just don’t see him as another mindless killer (note: I’ve always been a fan of the brother-sister angle in the sequels).

Irregardless, fan of the original movie or not, Zombie’s flick is poorly executed. And yes the original is minimal...istic. As it was intended to be.

[–] hurricane (1907) 5 years ago

Have you ever seen the original Black Christmas? That tells you even less about the killer.