Margaret's Antonia
I love this performance! One of the only female characters not to be characterized as a monster, she brings a chilling sense of duty and patriotrism to the role. I can't get enough of it.
shareWhile she's maybe not as evil as Livia and Messalina, I still can't like Antonia. She was unable to love Claudius, her own son, because he wasn't "normal", and she made Livilla, her own daughter, die a terrible death.
The only likable female character in this TV series is Calpurnia, and maybe Julia and Cesonia.
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I'm with you on Calpurnia, but I don't find Julia all that sympathetic. She did meet a very grim fate, but she was quite spoiled and self-absorbed.
Julia's first daughter, Julia the Younger, seems to be completely missing from the series. Julia's other daughter, Agrippina (Claudius's sister-in-law) could have been a sympathetic character, if not for Fiona Walker's sometimes over-the-top performance.
As to Caesonia, I'm on the fence. She seems to have had a good heart, but was a little too weepy for me. Hard to believe the actress who played her is now 80 years old!
I very much like Margaret Tyzack's performance. Such a distinctive voice. Some time back I was watching the Woody Allen film "Match Point." There was an elderly landlady in it who seemed very familiar, but I couldn't place her. But then that voice! It was Antonia!!
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Okay, maybe Julia wasn't as likable as Calpurnia and Ceasnonia. But I believe she was nicer to Claudius than most of his other relatives (including his mother) were, and she didn't deserve to be treated like she was.
But of course, Margareth Tyzack was great as Antonia, even if I don't like the character. I think every actor in this series was brilliant in his or her role.
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Is it strange that I find the wicked ladies like Livia more comfortable than the 'good' ones? Antonia's flaw is her treatment of Claudius. I can't stand those scenes where she lashes out at him (I tend to FF those scenes). At least Livia apologizes to Claudius. Antonia was never a good mother, seeing how her 'normal' daughter Livilla turned out. One can assume that Germanicus, like his father Drusus, would turn out good no matter whose parents he had!
Julia is a mixed bag. On one hand she actually likes Claudius and is one of the few to tell Livia where to stick it. On the other, she does seem shallow about the loss of several of her loved ones. There's no grief about Gaius. Despite her hysterics about Marcellus' death, she later treats the subject about Livia's intrigue in that situation more like gossip than some personal grudge to her stepmother-in-law.
Agrippina is also a bit of a witch, with her holier-than-thou attitude and lack of tact (her historical counterpart was also arrogant and lacking in tact, pretty much bringing out her own fall because she couldn't keep her mouth shut).
Calpurnia and Bresies the servant get my vote for good-and-likable ladies. I wish Pulman adapted Claudius' 1st fiancee (the one who died on the day of betrothal) to the series.
Yes, that was another good thing about Julia. She actually saw Livia for who she was. Unfortunately, her father never did.
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Augustus wizens up to Livia in the later episodes, but behaves with extreme caution toward her and seems suspended between belief and uncertainty.
Antonia was just playing her role as an uptight, upright Roman matron--physical and mental defects were shunned in the ancient world. It's nice that she ended by kissing him on the forehead and admitting to her dead husband as she passed that she was "sorry." Briseis the maid interprets this as "sorry she kept him waiting so long," but the audience is meant to realize it refers to her treatment of Claudius. It's a powerful scene left out in the American cut--in it, Briseis cuts off the hand for separate burial because Antonia thought Claudius would forget.
>Augustus wizens up to Livia in the later episodes, but behaves with extreme caution toward her and seems suspended between belief and uncertainty.
Early on, when Augustus is visiting Agrippa, he gets Livia's letter about the death of Marcellus, and this look passes over his face like HE KNOWS what's up. But he doesn't do anything about it, it's like he suppresses his suspicions. Later, when Augustus visits the banished Postumus (after learning the truth from Claudius), and Postumus tells Augustus to believe the allegations about Livia, Augustus says, "I do. I do." But again, his relationship with Livia is so close (and presumably Livia has powerful friends in her own right) that he can't kick her out of his life. "Suspended between belief and uncertainty" sounds about right...I also think that in the end he didn't really think that she would outsmart him or hurt him, but (at least in the series) she did!!
I was going to mention Antonia's last scene with Claudius as well.
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Augustus could have used a little of Henry VIII's follow through in dealing with an inconvenient wife. Not that it would have been a good idea to take Livia's head off, but couldn't she have met with an unfortunate accident? Where are your balls, Augustus?
shareHe loved her, and trusted in her as one of his closest advisors. Between all of Julia's sons, he had plenty of male grandchildren without needing to groom a boy of his own.
shareYes, spgrclaudius. I too believe that Antonia's death apology was about her treatment to her son. It doesn't completely resolve the situation, but it did give me some satisfaction. Did you notice how motherly Briseis is to Claudius?
Also of note: In 'Family Affairs' (or the 2nd half of 'A Touch of Murder'), Antonia is disappointed that Drusus died before seeing infant Claudius. In 'Waiting in the Wings' Antonia wonders what Drusus would have done with Claudius. It gives the implication that Drusus was very close to his baby son, and had he lived, Claudius might have become his favorite child.
Of what American cut are you referring to? My 1996 Foxvideo VHS edition has the Briseis sequence. Are you referring to the recent 'Remastered' DVD edition? If so, please answer me this OT question: Does the Remastered edition have the Nero-Agrippinilla seduction sequence in 'Old King Log'? (Not solely a 'just about to kiss then cut!' scene, but Agrippinilla kissing her son's hand and Nero getting on top of her, then cut!)
Back to topic: Does anyone think Claudius ever told Antonia about Livia's treachery? 'Reign of Terror' suggests he might have.
I do think Claudius told his mother about Livia's misdeeds in "Reign of Terror," at least when it came to Postumus. And it would have been fun to see Drusus and Claudius as a father/son pairing--I wonder if he would have preferred the clever, sickly child to the lordly Germanicus.
I have seen the British cut and American cuts, and these are the four big differences:
1. Episodes one and two are combined in the British cut. The American cut's division is more natural considering the other episodes.
2. Extended scene in British cut: Antonia's hand and "I'm sorry" with Briseis, referenced above.
3. Extended scene in British cut: Cassius Chaerea describes how to ambush Caligula after saying "Here's the tricky part."
4. Extended scene in British cut: Agrippinilla and Nero seduction scene, longer and more explicit than American cut (referenced above).
I believe there might be a:
5. Extended scene in American cut: Extended footage of the topless African dancing girls in Episode 1
Antonia's world has been shattered in 'Reign of Terror.' Her daughter's a murderess, and her mother-in-law- whom she defended against Julia's accusations- a scheming manipulator. Noble Rome is never the same. Then again, considering her father's reputation with a certain Alexandrian Greek, perhaps Rome "never was, what it was."
My American VHS cut has the Episode one and two division (with ending and opening), and the suicide aftermath scene with Briseis, but not the other two. It might as well be said that a complete I,CLAUDIUS cut doesn't exist!
The reason I asked was that I intend to give the series for a friend's birthday present. I plan to give her the 2000 Image DVD edition (which I suppose is the most complete version available, unless it cut the Briseis scene), but I might also give her the recent 'Remastered' edition IF it has the extended sequence of Agrippinilla getting her freak on with Nero. Give her the best of both worlds. I posted a thread about the question, with zilch response.
I agree that the omission of the Nero scene is unfortunate in the American cut. I have not seen the newly "remastered" edition, but I would bet money the scene is NOT there--it is just a remastered version of the I, Claudius video set, including the Epic that Never Was documentary and none of the great cast interviews and BAFTA footage allegedly on the British DVD. The best buy by a mile would be the British version, if there's a multi-national DVD player on hand.
In other news, Margaret said that being "Mark Antony's daughter" probably helped to make Antonia a stronger woman--a Roman in the old, severe sense of the word.
PS Funny that we agree the "I'm sorry" to Drusus was for how she treated her son, when she deliberately starved her bratty daughter to death!
Livia may be a you know what. But she saw Claudius in the end, as he really wasn't stuttering or twitching like he used to when he was younger. Only playing the fool in order to survive the madness.
shareIn the version I've seen, Briseis does tell Claudius that she cut off Antonia's hand because Claudius might have forgotten to do it.
"Qui conduisait la voiture?"
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