MovieChat Forums > Chinatown (1974) Discussion > Is this the greatest "throwback" film of...

Is this the greatest "throwback" film of all time?

posted 9 years ago by chrysalis1814
21 replies | jump to latest

As a homage to the hardboiled film-noir genre of the 40s this film, for me, not only pays that homage immaculately but actually outdid some of the very classics it was imitating. I love a good 40s noir, The Big Sleep is clearly a perfect film but I'd take Chinatown over The Big Sleep or Maltese Falcon any day of the week. Is this the most perfect throwback film ever made?

P.S. Please don't think I'm implying thats ALL Chinatown was: a throwback or a homage etc. It's much more than that obviously but it IS the nucleus of where this film started.

[–] rogerscorpion 9 years ago

No offense taken.

I just went to see it on a big screen last night, again, @ a midnight movie.

It is my favorite film.

Carpe Noctem!

[–] 9 years ago

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[–] LetThemEatCake01 9 years ago

I don't think it was an homage at all. It's also not a noir film. Where is the narrator?? It doesn't have a lot of the staples of the noir genre.

[–] 9 years ago

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[–] LetThemEatCake01 9 years ago

That's fine, it still doesn't fit the criteria to be a noir film, the lack of narrator, it doesn't have low key lighting, in fact it's quite bright, etc.

[–] chrysalis1814 9 years ago

You have a very narrow view of what constitutes a noir. Plenty of noir films don't have the detective narrating, there are plenty of other noir characteristics that this film clearly replicates.

[–] LetThemEatCake01 9 years ago

It's just not a noir movie.

[–] chrysalis1814 9 years ago

Yeah it is. All you have said so far is different lighting and lack of voice over narration.

You haven't acknowledged the:

*Convoluted mystery plot full of characters with different motives, releationships, secrets that the viewer has to keep straight as the plot unfolds/thickens. This is arguably the biggest thing making it a Raymond Chandler type homage.

*Abrasive, hard-nosed P.I. who gets in over his head.

*Dame with a troubled past/existence.

*the fact that it's a 1940s set detective story set in L.A. period..... Come on seriously?

*The seamy, cynical tapestry of corruption, sleaze, lies etc. that come forward.

*Jerry Goldsmiths score.

*The downbeat ending/message.

Do I have to go on?

[–] LetThemEatCake01 9 years ago

It still lacks the most defining noir characteristics, like a narrator and expressionistic lighting, composition.

[–] chrysalis1814 9 years ago

Yeah you said that already

[–] 9 years ago

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[–] The_White_Hotel 9 years ago

It's a neo-noir. It is clearly aware of and references the conventions of film noir (for which, incidentally, no narrator is required) from the first line but does not necessarily attempt to stick to those conventions. It is also made in the wrong period to be considered film noir, which is a term that carries historical context.

Reality is the new fiction they say, truth is truer these days, truth is man-made

[–] edlitz36 9 years ago

You are clearly not aware of the term neo-noir. Perhaps you need to read up on it first then get back to us.

Religion should be made fun of. If I believed that stuff, I'd keep it to myself. -Larry David

[–] wylierichardson-966-922691 8 years ago

Since the film noir of the past were almost entirely shot in B&W, it's hard to compare then to "Chinatown" in terms of the cinematography. You would have to broaden your definition of the genre, when analyzing this movie.

I would argue that since Nicholson is in every single scene, and it's essentially told from his point of view, a narration was basically un-necessary. It's worth noting that the ending was changed. The orginal ending, as scripted, had Nicholson and Dunaway happily driving off to Mexico together, with her daughter in tow. Polanski insisted on the darker, more violent ending, to give it more of a 'noir' feeling.

[–] chninlp 8 years ago

It should be pointed out that upon re-watch, his point of view is unarguably riddled with defects and misinterpretation that lead to numerous mistakes.

This is key when it comes to his past as a police officer and makes changed ending "narratively" consistent with the rest film, given his own last words.

I will say though that although the tragic ending is consistent with the spirit of film noir, an unpunished villain is divergent with classic film noir.

[–] successor13326 9 years ago

Chinatown is set in 1937, not the 40's.

[–] atiq1969 9 years ago

Although there is no clear-cut definition of the genre, I believe that most scholars would agree that it was brought out of post World War 2 cynicism. A femme fatale, complex plot, cigarettes(lol), daughter in peril, so on and so forth. I think neo noir is more than an apt description for this film.

[–] Vega_Lyra 8 years ago

I agree with you that this is a wonderful film, but I disagree with you regarding the Maltese Falcon and especially the Big Sleep. Of course, everyone has their own tastes...

Conquer your fear, and I promise you, you will conquer death.

[–] chninlp 8 years ago

Upon re-watch, a very blatant difference between Chinatown and The Maltese Falcon and The Big Sleep is that Jake Gittes' most consequential attribute is that he misreads evidence and clues that dooms innocent people.

So whatever superficial traits he tries to present, the flashy clothes, the witty dialogue, the chauvinist self-assurance, they're all undermined by his own persistent misconstruction. Just as important is the fact that the crime(s) against the city and Jake Gittes are mutually exclusive; he has no effect impact on the water scheme at any time during the duration of the film.

These are not even close to attributes of Sam Spade or Phillip Marlowe. Doesn't make them worse nor Chinatown better a film at all. It's just a clear difference that cannot be overlooked.

For instance, Sam Spade and Phillip Marlowe confronting their antagonists are constructive occurrences, yet for Jake Gittes, BOTH occurrences are mistakes that have negative results.

So which film people prefer are a matter of taste but there's no doubt that no classic film noir has a film score that is as unique and diverse as Chinatown. Not even close.

[–] CalibMcBolts 7 years ago

This is NOT a film-noir.

It lacks the biggest component of a film-noir which is:

Most of the runtime being either filmed indoors, or in the night, all darkly lit & beautifully compositioned.

Chinatown's large part of its runtime is filmed in the scorching sun, in bright rooms, deserts, etc. All extremely bright locations.

That said, the style and plot are very noir-ish, but it lacks the main component

Favorite films of all time list
http://www.imdb.com/list/ls031708001

[–] TwoThousandOneMark 7 years ago

I used to assume this was made in the 50's or 60's.

...my essential 50 http://www.imdb.com/list/ls056413299/