MovieChat Forums > Live and Let Die (1973) Discussion > Rape by deception

Rape by deception

posted 12 years ago by DavidTL
50 replies | jump to latest

I really don't like the way Bond in Live and Let Die convinces Solitaire, the Tarot Cards expert, to sleep with him by tricking her into believing that seduction is in her future with the fake tarot cards, that unknowingly to her all show "The Lovers". Yes, she pulled out the same card earlier on, but it would be acceptable if it happened naturally. But Bond bought a stack of the same cards to trick her into having sex with him.
It's quite disturbing and a really sleazy conquest of Bond, and could be classed as rape by deception. Can't believe it didn't cause any controversy.

[–] 12 years ago

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[–] 12 years ago

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[–] porfle 12 years ago

There's no such thing as "rape by deception." She willingly had sex with Bond, period.

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[–] ellandroad_allstars 11 years ago

He still took advantage of her and for no other reason than to get his leg over. I always found this the most questionable act by any incarnation of bond. It seemed a bit like him breaking into a nunnery and tricking an innocent young nun into having sex with him by making her believe god wanted her to.

[–] 11 years ago

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[–] Hot_Karl 11 years ago

You must not like seeing girls at the bar then. All those evil men taking advantage of them. The most questionable act by Bond is him trying to get laid? Seriously? Not him murdering people in cold blood when they are unarmed or the horrible property destruction or all the women he gets killed by using them on missions.

No it was him trying to get laid lol

[–] ellandroad_allstars 11 years ago

The thing is, Bond kills and uses people as part of his job/missions. Property destruction, considering everything is not all that bad. Bond tricking Solitaire into bed had nothing to do with his mission, he could just have escaped with her there and then.

I have no problem with men hitting on girls in bars but it's not the same situation as Bond and Solitaire. I recently saw an interview with Jane Seymour who also said that scene was questionable.

[–] old-skool101 8 years ago

The thing is, Bond kills and uses people as part of his job/missions. Property destruction, considering everything is not all that bad. Bond tricking Solitaire into bed had nothing to do with his mission, he could just have escaped with her there and then.

...But solitaire already picked the 'lovers' card when bond first arrived on the island.

[–] jlcmfw 11 years ago

You found it more questionable than the scene in Thunderball where Bond actually blackmails the nurse?

[–] dailyshampoo48 10 years ago

sean connery's bond raped a lot of women. thank god oss117 came along; I needed to get that putrid taste out of my mouth. bleagh.

forgot what the big deal was with him anyhow then I rewatched dr no. sean connery in his prime, mostly shirtless. doing manly sh!t, and, most importantly, not talking. oh hells yes.

[–] marktayloruk (2375) 3 years ago

Since they had an affair afterwards .. .
All's fair in love and war!

[–] Superunknovvn 11 years ago

I think Connery's "seduction" of Pussy Galore in "Goldfinger" is even more questionable.

Anyway, did Bond buy 50-something stacks of card and picked out The Lovers from each of those to come up with a stack of only Lovers.

It comes across as *a bit* desperate.

But at this point, Bond has become more sleazy than charming anyway, seeing how Felix Leiter suggests girls to swallow cyanite if 007 gets too creepy on them.

"We learned more from a three minute record than we ever learned in school"

[–] 11 years ago

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[–] londomollari 11 years ago

I totally agree that the scene is disturbing and questionable. However, this was a different era with less enlightened perceptions of what was acceptable - though aren't we glad to have moved on, even just a little bit?

With that in mind, it appears to me (and probably appeared that way when I first saw the film at 14 years old) that it is just a gag, now badly dated, which fits in well with the whole Moore era Bond and the attitudes of its time.

Besides - when was Bond ever a morally upstanding character?

[–] marktayloruk (2375) 3 years ago

I think attitudes have changed for the worse!

[–] rwalton999 10 years ago

Since 'Cyanite' is a particularly awkward rock formation, swallowing it would be impossible unless you could swallow something akin to shards of dulled glass.

[–] raiders_887 11 years ago

I actually thought it was pretty funny and a clever idea on his part.

[–] 11 years ago

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[–] RugGuy 11 years ago

do you have a problem with Connery's Bond raping lesbian Pussy Galore and turning her in a heterosexual?

[–] joe_538 10 years ago

It's an old movie chiche; kiss the woman until she likes it.

[–] PatrickS77 10 years ago

It's an old movie chiche; kiss the woman until she likes it.

Ah, kinda like the indian police officer, who said something like "If you can't prevent rape, you might as well enjoy it"!?

[–] joe_538 10 years ago

I don't know what goes on in the character's head; but I've seen it in more than a few old westerns.

[–] danzeisen 11 years ago

Deception yes, rape, no. There is a massive difference, involving choice, between the two.

[–] Mr_Blonde3 11 years ago

Here's my take. The lovers card came up twice BEFORE Bond pulled the all lovers deck. Once when she first meets him, and once when she's reporting to Kananga when he's on the island with Rosie Carver.

I think if Moore's Bond hadn't rigged the deck, the card still would have come up.

As for rape by deception? No. You apparently missed the next scene. He tells her the "Deck was slightly stacked in my favor." She tells him it makes no difference.

Honestly, I think she was just tired of being used by Kananga, knew that sex with Moore Bond would spoil her use for Kananga, and assumed (Rightly so) That Bond was the only person who could get her out of Kanganga's hand and into a life of her own.

I love to love my Lisa.

[–] anikkane 11 years ago

The real question is, where did Bond get all those "Lovers" tarot cards. Guess he planned it all along, after meeting Solitaire. Creepy fellow.

[–] ActualSighs 11 years ago

The real question is, where did Bond get all those "Lovers" tarot cards. Guess he planned it all along, after meeting Solitaire. Creepy fellow.

There is a quick scene a few minutes earlier of Bond entering a Tarot shop, with no explanation of what he was doing there.

[–] psychocosmic-1 11 years ago

Some people here mentioned Bond raping Pussy Galore and the health clinic woman in Thunderball! Do these people really know what rape actually means? The clinic woman obviously didnt throw herself on Bond because it was against the regulations for her as a professional. She seemed to reject Bond very little before they entered the shower. And Pussy Galore embraces and kisses Bond before the scene dissolves into the front of a plane. superficial watching of films make very stupid posts!