MovieChat Forums > Jingi naki tatakai (1973) Discussion > Good series, not on par with The Godfath...

Good series, not on par with The Godfather...

posted 17 years ago by JimLoneWolf
9 replies | jump to latest

Well, maybe its on par with The Godfather Part III...better even. But within the first few minutes of the first film in this nevertheless entertaining and engrossing epic, it become apparent that this film's reputation as the "Japanese Godfather" is unjustified...it simply can't compete with the first two chapters of Coppola's saga.

Look, for example, at the clumsy way in which the characters are introduced in this film. Rather than meeting the characters through a poetic introductory device like the wedding in The Godfather, this films' director (I can't write his name because it is too close to the F-word and will be *bleeped*) simply throws text up on the screen, introducing upwards of ten characters in the first 10 minutes of the film with little elegance. Hell, there isn't even enough time to read the names before we're off to meet the next "important" character.

Are we supposed to keep up with this? Thank God for the "rewind" button (not to mention a pen and paper)!!

But seriously, there is such a thing as requiring TOO MUCH work of the viewer, and this film meets the criteria for that charge to a T. We shouldn't be required to write down the names of the characters (and possibly sketch out their physical characteristics) just to have a prayer of following the story. Coppola didn't require this, why does this film?

I don't want to make this film seem unappealing. If you know what you're getting, you WILL be satisfied. This is an excellent yakuza film, unquestionably one of the best of the 1970's. However, it is not a classic on par with the greatest and most legendary gangster film ever made...not by a long shot.

Rather, the film bears a stronger resemblance to the bloody samurai films of the era, namely Lone Wolf and Cub and Lady Snowblood. They are not samurai films, of course, but the cinematography and approach to violence bears a stronger resemblance to these films than American mafia films. Since I'm a fan of LW&C, I enjoyed The Yakuza Papers, but while I felt the distinctly "Japanese" approach to the violence enhanced those films, here it makes the violence seem a bit on the cartoony side.

On last thing, I've heard this film called "much more violent" than The Godafather. That may be true in terms of blood, but in terms of the horrific repercussions of violence, The Godfather is more than its equal. For my money, there is no more nightmarish image of mafia violence than the garroting of Luca Brasi during The Godfather. The scene features little blood (only a small stab wound on Brasi's hand produces the "red stuff"), but the image of his face slowly disappearing beneath the bar as he loses consciousnes is still etched firmly in my memory.

All the gauze-wrapped severed fingers and fire-hydrant-pressured, blood-spurting dismemberments in the world can't come close to topping THAT truly shocking moment. See this film, but keep your expectations reasonable...you'll be glad you did.

http://profile.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=user.viewprofile&friendid=29663098

[–] JonathanWellington 17 years ago

I never wrote down the names of characters and I got through the series just fine. And there was actually a few weeks between each viewing.

I must say also that why the Godfather is considered one of, if not the, best movies ever made eludes me. Really, what's so great about it? I found it to be dry, honestly, and I never cared about any of the characters. Not to mention that a good deal of it could be seen coming a mile away. I found the Yakuza Papers films infinitely more engrossing -- they always kept me on my toes, while I found myself stifling yawns while watching the Godfather films.

[–] Ottilia 17 years ago

I guess I'll never understand the Godfather thing. Just WHY? Battles without Honor is more like a popcorn film if you ask me..

Hmm and the best organized crime movies in history were probably the two Election films by Johnnie To.

[–] aradhope 17 years ago

the comparison to the godfather movies probably refers to the scope and the multigenerational timeline of the yakuza papers and also the inside look into how a criminal organization functions.

[–] yoyodamoose3 16 years ago

The name pop ups are really more of a style thing that an introduction as you learn all the information on the pop ups as the film progresses, you can completely ignore the pop ups if you really feel like it. Also I disagree about the violence The Yazkuza Papers being done in a similar way to Lone Wolf and Cub or Lady Snowblood (although i see where you probably got this - the arm cuting off scene at the beginning), it is not cartoony and is more realistic and brutal.

The Godfather films are great but I go with The Yazuka Papers for best gangster series

[–] gorebago 16 years ago

the godfather isn't a bad movie - it more or less serves as a good representation of an even better book, its just that its over-hyped.

its not as great as apocalypse now if you ask me or chinatown for that matter either.

i await these series of films from netflix as they are coming this weekend.

[–] spacezero 15 years ago

I empathize with your perspective in your comparison of elements of this film with elements that you find in the godfather. Nevertheless, I feel that it is irrational to make comparisons between two naturally distinct films made on opposite poles of the earth. I think it is best to watch and absorb yakuza papers in its original entirety, as its own distinct entity. You can't be basing judgements of asian films, which were made by asians and display asian issues and cultures on western standards. It's like taking a centimeter ruler and trying to measure in inches.

When you watch and absorb yakuza papers as its own distinct entity, that's when the art comes out. I am not saying that films should disregard technical film-making aspects altogether (such as character introduction and violence-depicting effects) but yakuza papers certainly has a distinct set of standards that, whether agreeable with the western film-making standards or not, entrance and engross many many people. The bottom line is, after watching this film people feel like they have watched an excellent, intruiging film.

[–] yoyodamoose3 9 years ago

I was about to comment on this post but I noticed that I already commented on it 6 years ago, I wish this board was more active......

[–] activista 9 years ago

I liked all the Battles Without Honor and Humanity films---the whole box set is worth getting if you really love '70s Japanese gangster films (or just '70s films,period.) Like another poster said, I've never thought the Godfather was all that---and yeah it is over-hyped, to some extent. It's a well-made film,but I've never really felt it like everyone else seems to. I also thought it was BS that these characters were talking about honor and respect in The Godfather, yet when it all boiled down to it they were just hit men who offed each other at the drop of a hat. Battles without Honor (the whole series) was more realistic, and more fun to watch, even though it's pretty violent and downbeat, with some sprinkles of dark humor throughout.

[–] henrimaine 8 years ago

I just watched Battles Without Honor and Humanity. I have not watched the sequels and, frankly, I don't see much point in watching them. The movie works well as a curiosity piece to help you learn about Japanese crime world. It can also be viewed as a stylish action flick full of non-stop violence and one-dimensional characters. But surely, it cannot be compared to the first two Godfather movies, which were rich dramas with fully developed characters.