What did you think of Gene and Finny's relationship while reading? - A Separate Peace (1972) Discussion

[–] twosidedcube 17 years ago

I think that are kinda gay. I mean, not like extremely gay. They are more like two young men who are coming out of the closet for the first time. It's like in that movie Big Daddy with those two gay guys. In the movie, it said they were always friends when they were younger, but in law school, they became gay. I think that it's the same way with Gene and Finny. If Finny were still alive in the future, I think that they might become gay. However, I think that the book in general was written very gayly, like the time when the author described Brinker's "rump" with great detail.

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[–] PsychlOps 17 years ago

U R a dumbass.

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[–] JewFroJoey 17 years ago

I think that are kinda gay. I mean, not like extremely gay. They are more like two young men who are coming out of the closet for the first time. It's like in that movie Big Daddy with those two gay guys. In the movie, it said they were always friends when they were younger, but in law school, they became gay. I think that it's the same way with Gene and Finny. If Finny were still alive in the future, I think that they might become gay. However, I think that the book in general was written very gayly, like the time when the author described Brinker's "rump" with great detail.

that's exactly what i thought in high school. our english teacher, who was 93 at the time, did not agree and i never did get good grades after i brought it up.

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[–] 17 years ago

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[–] strikingsunset 17 years ago

I thought that there was serious jealousy on Gene's part, and that Finny was just a good-hearted person overall. After finishing the book (last night), I told my mum that I am going to name my son Phineas if I have one haha.

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[–] elementalmania 17 years ago

I think there is no homosexuality here at all, and to say there is means that you are placing it there. These are innocents growing up. It is a short moment in life, written in reflection and detail. The book does take the time to note that Gene is noticing things about other boys (at an all male school by the way) that is ultimately a reflection on his own changes and developments (or insecurities in himself). There is nothing homosexual about it.

Idiots.

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[–] mmalcolm_98 17 years ago

I do believe you need to reread the novel and do it well. If you are a teenager read the book again in ten years time. There I do say, that you will see a grat deal more in the subtle undertones of Gene's and Finny's relationship.

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[–] bwaybabydoll 17 years ago

I think there is no homosexuality here at all, and to say there is means that you are placing it there. These are innocents growing up. It is a short moment in life, written in reflection and detail. The book does take the time to note that Gene is noticing things about other boys (at an all male school by the way) that is ultimately a reflection on his own changes and developments (or insecurities in himself). There is nothing homosexual about it.

Idiots.

You took the words right out of my post.

~Darling, I'll be yours forever cause I never wanna be without love!

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[–] elementalmania 17 years ago

Actually, I am an English teacher. My guess is you studied it at some point in some classroom where one of your teachers said, "Yes, there is some wonderful intimations of a homosexual relationship. Excellent point!" and then puffed his pipe blowing delicious smoke-rings throughout the room.

Is that it?

Try re-reading from the standpoint I am suggesting.

And, I think the author knows best. A writer is always intentional about his work, down to the spelling of a character's name and the color of his shoestrings. If he wanted to have a homosexual subtext, there would be no debate about it. It would be blatantly obvious.

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[–] mmalcolm_98 17 years ago

Dear Elementalmania,

Referring to your last comment on Gene and Finny's relationship while reading Mr. Knowles' modern American classic I did, when I was at two all boys prep schools in New England, hold your view that there was no sexual subtext to John Knowles' writings. I held that view when I studied, A Separate Peace, at school in english class at my junior prep school at 15 and again at 18 in AP English.

At this time I will comment, knowing from my own experiances of boarding school life, sexual experimentation at the age that Finny and Gene are (16/17 yrs old)did and I assume still does occur at boarding institutions.

I then again read the novel ten years later for my old boy, alumni weekend at 28 to realize that this novel of adolecent fear, jealously and rivalry was indeed a love story.

It was then, when I saw again my former AP english school master and commented on the book expressing my new view that as you so put it "Yes, there is some wonderful intimations of a homosexual relationship. Excellent point!" His opinion was "Well off course it was a love story!" He also made a point that I was at the time 18 years old and too young to see this subtext; only to see the flow of sentences at face value.

I am now 38 and I have done a good deal of research and have reread many on my old school reading list. Yes, my favourite being A Seperate Peace.

So try rereading it from my point of view; that is of course if you are opened minded enough to do so. Was it a platonic love; or a love that dare not say its name?

To close, your comment that "An author knows best. A writer is always intentional about his work ....If he wanted to have a homosexual subtext, there would be no debate about it. It would be blatantly obvious", John Knowles attended Exeter Academy in the 1940's and wrote this classic in the late 1950's in which, at that time, the subject matter we are discussing was rarely addressed and if it was, subtlety, was the watch word. I would, if I where you, take that into consideration. John Knowles died at 71. He was never married.

So put that into your pipe and smoke it...

Malcolm McKay,
Nassau, The Bahamas

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[–] elementalmania 17 years ago

Thank you!

Some intelligent banter at last.

In truth, I see it there (I've been difficult more for my own humor), though I don't think it was intended to be necessarily "homosexual" in nature. In truth, it was a brotherly love, I would hesitate to say anything further than that.

You could argue for a homosexual relationship from the text, but I personally would refrain from doing so as I think we would have to lift it outside of itself to make the case better than inside it. Does that make sense?

I suppose it depends on your means of criticism and your purpose in it. There is substantial evidence for both, but I do not contend it was the means of his book. There are too many other more important and well-developed themes in the book besides this one. It's more of an aside really.

That's just my take on it.

Thanks for a good response chap, and perhaps in another country we could sit to coffee and other debates. I am through with this one as there are others more fit and willing to argue this case, and I am bored with it now.

Carry on.

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[–] fordraff 13 years ago

Whoa, there! Knowles married Beth Anne Dyment Hughes at the age of 19.

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[–] Facuhenest (1) 3 years ago

I think the same as you. At chapter 4 the beach chapter, I start seeing the relationship of this two boys thinking one of them would come out and say that he is gay. But my idea started changing when Finny start training Gene. I really didn't know why, I didn't know the reason till now, they are just kids in a innocent period of their lifes.
Talking about why I think there is no homosexuality in their realtionship is because of:
1- what Gene feels for Finny is a mixture of aprecation and jelouceness.
2- In the whole story Gene never says something about him beeing homosexual.
Also when they start training together you can see how their frindship changes so much.

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