One of the most chilling endings ever! * minor spoiler* - Cabaret (1972) Discussion

[–] lalalei2001 18 years ago

You think that's shocking? The play's even scarier! Hre's the ending from me to you for the play... (spoilers)

Cliff (Brian in the movie, Cliff in the play) just left on a train to Paris, escaping the Nazis. Then the Emcee came onstage, still imploring us to forget everything bad.

"In here, life... is beautiful," he said, painfully whispering the 'beautiful.'

"The girls...are beautiful. Even the orchestra is beautiful."

And he gestured; the lights focused on where the band should have been. But there wasn't any. Yet the music continued, the wall in front of the set fell away.

The set disappeared; the cast stood, shadowy and dim.
And then there was light. Not ordinary light, but a stark white light, one so pure yet so alone that you couldn't tell if it was a heaven or another place that you were seeing.

The increasingly discordant music built to a terrifying roar; the only sounds were an ominous rumbling that seemed to crawl inside you and a violin shrieking.

The violin stopped. All you could see was shadows and white light. All you could hear was the rumbling.

Then there was silence.

"Auf weidersehen," the Emcee said.

"A bientot....."

Then, slowly, he took off his coat. He was wearing the clothes of a prisoner, a concentration camp prisoner.

The drumroll sounded. The cymbals clashed. And then there was darkness.

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[–] wellesradio 18 years ago

Damn, you're right.
That is scary. I would LOVE to see the stage version. Still, this movie's not an adaptation of the musical so I can understand why there would be some changes. Plus, the subtlety of the movie's ending would never work onstage and the stage ending wouldn't work in the movie. The stage ending sounds very theatrical and on film it might come off as very corny. Meanwhile the movie ending just sort of leaves you hanging and thinking - wait, did I just see what I think I saw? I know a lot of people might not get it (they've told me so) and it does hurt it a bit when you have to explain it. But it's great food for thought.

Wow - I get goosebumps just imagining what you described!
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[–] partnerfrance 18 years ago

When they did the stage version in Paris, there was a wonderful -- and shocking -- stage effect they used.

At one point early in the play, the Emcee pins a small swastika on his elbow and makes it twirl like a top. Of course, everyone in the audience laughs.

Towards the end, he pulls a rope and a swastika the size of the entire theatre curtain comes down. Everyone in the audience gasped loudly.

The effect, of course, was to parallel the rise of Nazism -- first it seems like a small fringe movement that is so silly that it makes you laugh. The next time you see it, it has become the domineering force that makes you gasp out loud. It was stunning!

The Paris version also had the wonderful Ute Lemper playing Sally.

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[–] andyp1986 18 years ago

Yes I saw the stage version when it was playing at Studio 54 a couple years ago. I agree that the ending was very chilling, but I do like the subtlety of the movie's ending. I actually prefer the movie version for the cast, story, and songs.

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[–] Va-Jane-a 18 years ago

I haven't seen the movie for a few years, and although I used to quote it frequently and I absolutely loved the movie, I can't for the life of me remember how it ended... Could someone please refresh me?

By the way the stage production sounds fantastic... very moving I would imagine!

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[–] BlueKid16 18 years ago

The play version very scary, however can someone tell me the movie ending?

"SLEEP ON IT!"

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[–] dc-wayne 18 years ago

The movie ends with Brian going back to England by himself, since he and Sally both know their relationship has no future, a point brought home by her reasons for aborting the baby. Viewers are led to believe that Sally will remain in Berlin, more determined than ever to live life to its fullest after all the complexity & heartache she'd just been through. What happens to her 2 years later when the Nazis are in full power is anyone's guess; I would surmise that she either becomes a powerful Nazi's mistress or gets deported to a death camp just for being an American. I'd like to think she gets the hell outta there & returns to the States, but that doesn't seem likely since she has no ties or family there anymore.

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[–] marktayloruk (2378) 2 years ago

She'd have left Germany and continued with her career/dream.

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[–] shieldsdraeger 7 years ago

The movie ends with the Emcee taking a bow. Then the camera pans across the distorted
mirror image that opened the film backed again by a drum roll showing Nazis in the
audience and stops(cymbol crash) with the image of a Nazi in the center of the image.

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[–] dth1212 18 years ago

Just to clarify things.... That was the ending as rewritten and directed in the '90s B'way revival, and it was somewhat influenced by the ending of the play "Bent", in my opinion. The finale in the original '66 version is similar to the movie, in the sense that the writer leaves Berlin, Sally goes back to the Cabaret, and the Emcee quickly "disappears" from the stage after his final song. Afterward, there is a drum roll and the mirror above the cabaret stage lowers to reflect the real audience. The revival took us down an entirely different path than previous versions, and it was quite chilling to see.

I always had the feeling that that Joel Grey's Emcee already had his bags packed and a car waiting outside for his departure from the stage. (The hell with everyone else!) I got the impression that Alan Cumming's Emcee, on the other hand, was probably too drugged out and crazed to make any attempt at escape. Grey seemed to be a bit detached from, or above, it all; whereas, Alan Cumming seemed to get caught up in everything. Both attempted to manipulate the goings on around them, but with two very different outcomes.

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[–] InsomniacJack 18 years ago

"I always had the feeling that that Joel Grey's Emcee already had his bags packed and a car waiting outside for his departure from the stage. (The hell with everyone else!) I got the impression that Alan Cumming's Emcee, on the other hand, was probably too drugged out and crazed to make any attempt at escape."

Probably true, dth1212, probably true. That is, of course, assuming that Grey's Emcee was even human to begin with (as I know it has as been hotly debated on these boards in the past).

Both are undeniable affecting endings, and though I have never seen the staged version, I have heard it described to me in enough detial to picture it for myself. Brrrr.

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[–] pryingdelilah 18 years ago

Just a question that's been rolling around in my head, I've seen the movie and heard the revival soundtrack, but how do we know the emcee is on drugs in the revival?

"Why does a rose symbolize love if a rose always dies?"

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[–] loreleib 18 years ago

We don't know that, but having seen it, it seemed to me that the emcee was on drugs.

*I love that the movies I like get horrible reviews. It makes them come out on DVD earlier.*

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[–] gothduo 18 years ago

Going on my admittedly sketchy memory of the revival - you can see it in the way he acts and dresses as the show progresses. At the beginning he's very "together" and witty, but as things get darker and darker he starts deteriorating. By the time he introduces "Cabaret" he's pretty out of it and dressed unusually sleazy (even for him).

I wouldn't say it's as simple as him being on drugs, though - more like a combination of drugs, drink, hard living and the general darkness of the time catching up with him. It was one of the more frightening things about the show for me.

~ I wonder if there's beer on the sun? ~

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[–] dth1212 17 years ago

As I recall, in the revival, Alan Cumming - and all the actors who followed him - were made up to look like they had track marks on their arms. Also, the behavior in his interpretation made it pretty clear, especially when singing "I Don't Care Much", the tile of which pretty much summed it all up. (Also, this would contribute to his not be able to escape the Nazis at the end of the show.) As for Sally, the revival included stage business with her snorting cocaine; so, if Sally is taking drugs, you know the our friend the Emcee is up to no good.

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[–] sevenof9fl 13 years ago

I would have given a lot to see Alan Cumming's version - in fact, the only reason I ever wanted to see this film remade was to see him in the Emcee roll - he was the only person, quite frankly, I could ever see in the part besides Joel Grey.

"As the Philosopher Jagger said, you can't always get what you want."

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[–] MovieMusings 9 years ago

Ah, interesting.

I just played in a live orchestra for the stage version directed by Paul Gelineau. In his vision, the emcee follows up "A bientot" with...suicide (a gun in the mouth).

Either way, this is indeed a dark story.

------------------------------------------
I'm trying real hard to be the shepherd.

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[–] dth1212 18 years ago

And let's not forget the influence of expressionist artist George Grosz, as well as all the Nazi propaganda posters from that era, especially those of the Hitler Youth Movement. It was like all those images came to life! Fosse later did a similar thing in his film of "Lenny", the look of which he based on b/w photos and film footage of Lenny Bruce's life and career.

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[–] hedgehogdog 18 years ago

"The song with the monkey was aother total shock."

That was the one part of the movie that got the biggest emotional reaction from me. I'd been thinking all through the song: "that's just so cute, I'll have to remember it" and then it got to the end and I thought "well, sh*t." I kind of felt betrayed.

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[–] InsomniacJack 18 years ago

Really? How so, hedgehogdog?

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[–] hedgehogdog 18 years ago

It was cute and sweet and all that, and then I was hit with the brick of Anti-Semitism. I probably should have expected it, though.

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[–] Mo_Anam 18 years ago

I saw a community theatre production of Cabaret that ended with the scrim
coming in, and Max and Ludwig goose-stepping/coralling everyone into the centre of the stage, a fog machine came on, and Sally started singing the Finale. It was
very effective.

"If You Could See Her" is my favourite song in the whole show. If the Emcee is
played right, that song hits you right in the heart, it's just so powerful.
One thing that annoyed me was that when I saw the show, when he says "...she wouldn't look Jewish at all" a lot of the audience laughed. It was so inapporopriate. Then again, I had heard the song before, so I suppose if you were
getting it for the first time, it might be somewhat different.

*In the Eyes of a Young Girl, the Soul of a Young Man*

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[–] justoldbill 18 years ago

Everyone uses "Bob Fosse" and "genius" in the same sentence, and no one mentions Harold Prince. Why is that?

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[–] marilyn_glamor 18 years ago

I was really impressed by the play ending, although I agree that the movie ending was well done too. The play's ending though just stuck w/me for awhile...it was so powerful and sad all at the same time. It's one of my favorite dramatic endings ever.

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[–] ravenszabo 17 years ago

I loved both the movie and musical...I agree the musical's ending was much more haunting. I saw the musical in 1999 with the touring company, Teri Hatcher played Sally Bowles! Good singer but her dancing!-not so good. The emcee for this show was Norbert Leo Butz (watch on you tube) and he was awesome and the ending when he takes off the trenchcoat and reveals the Star of David and a gray uniform! It still gives me the chills!

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[–] valjeanlover 18 years ago

Hal Prince is a genius in everything he does. I think people don't mention him as often because he didn't direct the movie, which is how most people know Cabaret, Bob Fosse did and he choreographed it.

The more he bleeds, the more her lives
He never forgets and he never forgives

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[–] Hecate-3 17 years ago

I don't know who gets mentioned more often in general, but IMDB is a website for Movies, not stage plays; that's why Fosse gets mentioned more often here.

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[–] shieldsdraeger 7 years ago

Harold Prince was very influential in the development of the modern Broadway musical.
As far as Cabaret is concerned his direction was innovative, but the rest of the show
was pretty standard. Ron Field's choreography was old school Broadway.

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[–] TheConsigliere 17 years ago

Don't get me wrong, i loved the movie and it provides a bitingly clever social commentary of the times, but I'm kind of surprised so many viewers were surprised by the Monkey - Jewish link. As soon as the song started I instantly thought that it was making a comment on anti-semitism. I felt that was rather obvious, especially since every song in the movie coincides with scenes that parallel in meaning.

You're nothing to me now, you're not a brother, you're not a friend, I don't want to know you or what you do

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[–] theunderstudy1610 15 years ago

Don't get me wrong, i loved the movie and it provides a bitingly clever social commentary of the times, but I'm kind of surprised so many viewers were surprised by the Monkey - Jewish link. As soon as the song started I instantly thought that it was making a comment on anti-semitism. I felt that was rather obvious, especially since every song in the movie coincides with scenes that parallel in meaning.

That'd what I always took from it. I know that the cabaret hosts of the thirties often used to parody the Nazi anti-semitic propaganda, I remember reading an extract of one such speach which I guess when taken out of context did look genunine. The song wasn't anti-semitic, it was making fun of it.

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[–] Hecate-3 17 years ago

I can see how the number might be interpreted as anti-Semitic, but when I saw it, I thought it was an indirect way of pointing out the ridiculousness of anti-Semitism and other forms of prejudice.

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[–] TheConsigliere 17 years ago

I'm not saying it was anti-semitic, I'm saying it was making a comment on anti-semitism - that comment essentially being exactly what you said Hecate.

You're nothing to me now, you're not a brother, you're not a friend, I don't want to know you or what you do

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[–] shieldsdraeger 7 years ago

It starts out as if it's about love overcoming differences, but the twist at the end
turns the message on its head. The emcee's glee after the last line clearly indicates
to me that it's anti-Semitic not a parody. And it gives the gorilla costume a whole
different meaning. Not just comically different, but sub-human.

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[–] Mathias_Wyllie 18 years ago

The ending for our Local Production is good.

Cliff is standing alone, center stage. He's joined by the Train Officer. The scene happens. Cliff begins to sing and then the Train Officer turns around, He's actually the EmCee in the Train Officer's jacekt. After the first verse, Cliff leaves out the back.

The EmCee says "Where are your troubles now? Forgotten? I Told you so! In Here, We Have No Troubles. In Here, Life is beautiful, The Girls are Beautiful, Even the Orchestra is Beautiful."
The Orchestra plays, but it sounds completely out of whack, as The Rest of the Cast, minus Herr Shultz and Cliff, Files onto the stage behind The Emcee. They sing "Wilkommen, Bienvenue, Welcome. Fremde, Etrange, Stranger." Orchestra plays even more out of whack notes. Then they step back slowly, splitting in the middle likedoors opening. Then, during the small reprise of So What? in the Finale, A Projection plays showing clips of the Liberation of Auschwitz. It stops, Everyone freezes.

The EmCee steps forward "Auf Wiedersein." He takes off his coat, Reveiling Concentration Camp uniform beneath. "Au Bien...Tot." And He turns, walks to the back of the stage, The Actors turning their backs to him as he passes them. The Back curtain lifts up to reveal a blinding white light and fog, signifying a Gas Chamber.

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[–] jpar0308 18 years ago

Our community theatre did this a few years ago, and this is the way ours ended:

During the finale, they played videos of people being tortured and slaughtered in Concetration Camps. And not only was it on a screen on the stage, they played it on the walls of the theatre, so even if you tried to look away, you still saw it. Then, at the very end, the Emcee sat Indian-style in front of the screen on stage, and they flashed a quote from Dante which read "The hottest places in Hell are reserved for those who, in times of great moral crisis, maintain their neutrality."

I'll tell you, I was silent all the way home!

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[–] shieldsdraeger 7 years ago

A university production I saw ended with the emcee in concentration camp garb(I don't
remember the specifics) and white lights above the stage came on and scanned the
audience, as if saying you could be next.

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[–] movieghoul 7 years ago

That ending was actually conceived for a professional production, but I don't recall when or where. Does sound chilling.

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[–] xhonkytonkangelx 18 years ago

At the risk of sounding thick i didn't really get the ending i get the thing about the nazis, tho i admit mu history is fuzzy, but why the mirror?

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[–] jpar0308 18 years ago

Well, I've never seen it done with mirrors before, but here's my theory.

One of the main points of the show is that if don't agree with something, or more specifically, if we know something's wrong, and we don't do anything about it, there are definite consequences. Sally and Cliff live a life of decadence, and they don't give much thought to the possible consequences, and their story ends unhappily.

As far as the mirror, I think it's meant to "reflect" things back on the audience. It's like saying, "this isn't just about these characters, this can happen to you." Or maybe it was just a cool design idea that the design team came up with.

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[–] xhonkytonkangelx 18 years ago

cool, the reflection thing was a theory i had too, but wasn't really 100%

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[–] ali-babble 18 years ago

Very chilling, I must agree. And also quite abrupt to me. The DVD I was watching skipped during the scene where Sally admits she's had an abortion so I didn't get her reasons for doing it. So before I knew it Brian was leaving, Sally sang the title song and it was the final scene. And it mirrored the first one so much I wondered had something gone wrong with the DVD again causing it to skip back to the start (it was a free DVD, what else did I expect?). The emcee left so quickly at the end, I though they were going to do another number, but they didn't. So maybe he was trying to make a getaway. Who knows?

And then you could see several nazis in the audience, which shows how powerful they've become, because earlier on in the film a nazi was thrown out of the club. There is such an extreme sense of foreboding. And then the credits roll and everything's silent. I think it's the only set of credits I've ever seen without music. And I find that the most haunting thing. Usually at the end of a film, especially a musical you'll have one of the songs repeated, or maybe even a quick montage of all the previous songs. But not in Cabaret. Because you're not supposed to forget about what's just happen and sway to the music. You're suppsed to remember. That, I find, was a brilliant choice by the production team.

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[–] angelofmusic181 18 years ago

Yes the stage ending it even more haunting as Lalalei mentioned. It gave me the chills and it was a high school performance. The guys I watched as the Master of Ceremonies was amazing. When he said "-she would looked Jewish at all!" it stuck with me so much. I can't even explain it. The whole play is just haunting.

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[–] 18 years ago

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[–] PrincessRhea 17 years ago

Not sure how the movie ended... but the stage musical's ending was the best I've seen in my life! I've never seen a better production than my school's production of Cabaret, and I've seen pleanty of Broadway-quality shows...

"What if it be a poison that the friar subtley hath ministered to have me dead?"
-Juliet Capulet

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[–] halflife7 17 years ago

The ending for our Local Production was odd.

The EmCee says "Where are your troubles now? Forgotten? I Told you so! In Here, We Have No Troubles. In Here, Life is beautiful, The Girls are Beautiful, Even the Orchestra is Beautiful."
The of the Cast, minus Herr Shultz and Cliff, Files onto the stage behind The Emcee , then the they turn off all the light . They sing "Wilkommen, Bienvenue, Welcome. Fremde, Etrange, Stranger.". Then they step back slowly, splitting in the middle likedoors opening , after the mirror scene , there is a blackout in the theatre and when the lights come back , the theatre is full of big NAZI flags and you can see that in the public there are som guys dress like NAZIs.

I did like our local production , but it was how i can say Pro Nazi if i compare it to other versions

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[–] movieghoul 17 years ago

The mirror imagery of the original stage production extended to the structure of the play itself. Every scene in the first act was repeated in the second act in reverse (mirror) order. So while the show opened with the emcee leaping out of the darkness into a bare spotlight, it ended with him jumping back into the darkness.

I'm not so sure I like the idea of all the blatant Holocaust imagery which various productions have used. I don't think you need to hit the audience over the head with it.

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[–] me254065 17 years ago

thanks for this guys! Really helped me understand the film. Sounds dumb but have only just realised about the nazi being kicked out and at the end there are loads in audience. I realized there were but did not link it to the original Nazi being kicked out! wow guys! thanks for helping!

I've always seen the Cabaret as trying to paint a pretty picture of life but the end slow sequence shows the beautiful orchestra and dancers to be sweaty women etc etc etc...I swear Joel Grey gets younger looking as the film goes on...In Wilkommen, he looks much older than in Money Money etc etc...but definately thought provoking ending. I love his quick exit, as if even he's fiannly realised there is nothing to be done and there is no applause, because his usual audience is now filled with Nazis etc etc

brilliant film!!!

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[–] dth1212 17 years ago

>>I'm not so sure I like the idea of all the blatant Holocaust imagery which various productions have used. I don't think you need to hit the audience over the head with it.

I see your point, zgran. It was very effective in '97, I have to say, but most people forget that that particular ending was added for the revival and was not in the original version, on which the film was based. I was, however, amused with what one reviewer said of the recent London revival, "These days, the only way to shock an audience is to stage CABARET with subtlety." (Or something close to those words.)

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[–] pigmode 16 years ago

The story begins with the Cabaret as a world of it own, a refuge from the troubles on the "outside". The finale shows that asylum to have been breached, corrupted,--but not beyond recognition. Evil is portrayed to have invaded the organism not unlike an incipient tumour, leaving much of the bodies outward form intact. Simply brilliant.

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[–] karenaviles 16 years ago

You're right! It is the most chilling ending I've ever seen! The 1st time I watched it was at night, and I felt an incredible urge to scream and cry. They really made the Nazis look scarier than all the monsters from the horror movies. And the ending from the play stayed in my mind for quite a while. And the song with the monkey was just eerie. I was over here enjoying it, then all of a sudden he made that remark about the Jews and I just sat there shocked. I was also surprised when the German guys killed the little dog. I expected them to vandalize the house, but I didn't see the dog's murder coming.
The Nazis in the movie were like parasites, they grew in numbers as the movie progressed, and it was very disturbing to see it. I couldn't sleep for weeks.
Truly disturbing.

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[–] 16 years ago

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[–] jschillig 15 years ago

With everyone sharing their local productions' stories, I thought I'd give my two cents.

First, the revival...I'm not so sure I like the idea of the Emcee showing up at the end in a concentration camp uniform. On the one hand, it's chilling and effective...on the other, I'd always considered the Emcee to be a SYMBOL of the evil that was poisoning Germany, not a VICTIM of it. I do like the 1998 revival model (R.I.P., Natasha) but I think I prefer to have the Emcee as a sinister, menacing figure throughout.

My old high school did a production in 1997, a year before the revival hit Broadway. (They actually had Joe Masteroff come to the school and talk with the cast! They broadcast the discussion on the local cable-access channel.)

Throughout the show, they'd had occasional slides on the side walls for effect. Throughout the show as well, the Emcee's makeup was subtly changing to look more and more like a skull.

They didn't cut ANYTHING from this. Not the abortion, not "she wouldn't look Jewish at all."

And the ending...GOD, the ending. After the characters did all their little reprises, the entire cast went into a robotic reprise of "Tomorrow Belongs to Me." The backdrop flew up to reveal a huge swastika. Smoke poured in from the wings. It was around now that I started to notice yellow Stars of David and pink triangles on some of the characters, including Herr Schultz. The sounds of flames and gunfire took over the stage, while slides of Holocaust scenes and victims were projected onto the wings...finally dissolving into the words "NEVER FORGET" and "NEVER AGAIN". The marked characters walked into the smoke, and the stage went dark--except for a pin spot on the maniacally grinning Emcee...who only now said, "Meine Dammen und Herren...where are your troubles now? Forgotten? I told you so! Here we have no troubles...here life is beautiful!" Then he sang, "Auf Wiedersehen...a bientot...(spoken ominously)and I wish you all a very good night!" As the drum rolled, he snapped a "Sieg Heil", which turned into a stage bow.

I had nightmares about the Emcee that night.

Some other little touches in other local productions...a small theater did a very good one that basically followed the revival model. One little detail that threw me for a loop...the published script for the revival still has Cliff shouting at Sally that "the only way you got this or any other job was by sleeping with someone!" Well...in this production, he didn't exactly say "sleeping with," if you get my drift.

And another local theatre had a nifty touch of having the words "I am a camera" and "Goodbye to Berlin" stenciled on the set in English and German...a nice shout-out to the show's roots. In this, the Emcee started the show by unlocking the Kit Kat Klub's door. At the end, wearing a dark trenchcoat, he locked the door again and simply turned to the audience with a darkly ironic smile.

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[–] mdonln 8 years ago

karenaviles says > They really made the Nazis look scarier than all the monsters from the horror movies.

By 'they' I assume you're referring to the filmmakers. Well, 'they' didn't make the Nazis look scary; the Nazis did that all by themselves. The way the Nazis are portrayed in this movie can't compare to what they really were or what they actually did.

I don't speak from personal experience. I was no where close to being born during that time and, fortunately, my family was not directly effected but, like most of us, am a student of history. I have read the stories and seen the images. The things they did were horrendous and appalling. In my opinion, the Nazis were scarier than all horror movie monsters combined; especially since the movie monsters usually weren't real.

The things the Nazis did not only affected their millions of victims, they affected many generations hence. They affected the German people themselves and every human being born since that time as we are all forced to face the absolute worst our race, the human race, can be capable of doing. We all have within us the capacity to do evil. It's up to us to keep it in check.

Woman, man! That's the way it should be Tarzan. [Tarzan and his mate]

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[–] steven_torrey 14 years ago

Too me the key to the ending lay in the drum roll; a drum roll is what would be played for someone about to be executed. The viewer--long after the actual event--would know that Nazi Germany executed 6 million Jews. Yes, the ending is chilling because we can project the conclusion to the Nazi state.

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[–] ejs8882000 13 years ago

I just saw this film again recently and it STILL has the same effect on me, the ending just gives me the Willy's.

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[–] Knoxvicious 13 years ago

Wow...these are just great posts!
I didn't like the movie, and I didn't get it too well, which is why I came onto here, and now reading all these posts about the ending, it just scares me to think back about it. I never realized what has happened in the ending and what it meant...

Just thinking back about Joel Grey's character is very haunting and mysterious...and reading one post questioning his very existence is incredible. This is what a good movie does...make you think and WANT to re-watch and look out for all those things you missed...

I didn't like the movie, but now I seem to have great respect for it...
(Jesus, I'm a weirdo...)

www.simplydustinhoffman.com
-#1 site for Dustin Hoffman fans-

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[–] Helena727 9 years ago

I didn't like the movie, but now I seem to have great respect for it...
(Jesus, I'm a weirdo...)

In my book, being able to respect / see the value in something that you didn't like suggests an admirable amount of open-mindedness and insight. Kudos.

"All you need to start an asylum is an empty room and the right kind of people."

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