First post! - Persuasion (1971) Discussion

[–] jazinegrrrl 18 years ago

I'll be happy to join in. I too am surprised there has not been a discussion board regarding this mini-series until now. I watched this version last year when I purchased the Jane Austen DVD collection, which I highly recommend. It has all of the old BBC adaptations. With that being said, I was curious to see how this version compared to the later 1995 movie. I have to say I was disappointed in this version but I did like that they stayed truer to the book.

My biggest complaint is that the performances seemed so prosaic. I didn't see too much range from any of the actors. I'm afraid watching the 1995 version made me get my hopes up too high. In that adaptation I thought the actors were excellent (especially the actor who played Charles Musgrove). In the 71 version I didn't see the tension between Ann and Captain Wentworth. I love the storyline so much that I still watch it frequently despite my complaints.

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[–] randommovies2002 18 years ago

That is very much how I feel about the adaptation.

I think the performance style somewhat matches the other production values. It was customary back then to interpret costumes, hairstyles, make-up, etc. through the aesthetic lens of the times, basing the art direction on what was prevalent at the time.

The ages of the performers is another thing that I find jarring about this production. Anne appears nearly twice the age she is supposed to be! The actress is very attractive, and has some obvious abilities, but it's simply impossible to think that she could carry off 27! (What were they thinking?!)

However, I still find many things to enjoy in this series. Like you, I have the complete Jane Austen Collection DVD boxed set; this production stands out among them (not in a good way), which perhaps may be partially attributed to its not being produced by the BBC. I believe this one was done by ITV. Since the BBC did not make their own adaptation of Persuasion during that era, they purchased the rights to distribute the dvd so that their set would be complete.

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[–] jazinegrrrl 18 years ago

You're so right about the age factor. Anne did look like a middle-aged woman instead of woman who is in her late twenties. When you mentioned the recycling of costumes and locations I smiled. Now that explains why things looked similiar.

Have you seen the new Pride & Prejudice? I think it's worth seeing.

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[–] randommovies2002 18 years ago

Yes, I agree about the new P&P film. There are many delights to savour in this film! That's the wonderful thing about having more choices now; nearly everyone can find an adaptation that they like/prefer, and some of us enjoy parts of them all!

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[–] maytloo 15 years ago

I'm on the waiting list to borrow this from a local library, but I have watched the 1971 version of Emma, and found its production values lacking. So far I've only watched the more recent Persuasion with Peter Penry-Jones (from MI5/Spooks)so I'm looking forward to seeing this version. By the way, which JAC collection do you have? I'm in western Canada but when I talked to a local HMV, the only Jane Austen they had was the 2005 Pride and Prejudice (which I already have).

PS One thing I found kind of funny about the earlier adaptations was the tendency of the female characters to wear those lacy caps.

Update:
I just watched the 1995 movie, and it was superior to this and the 2007 adaptations. That said, if I could buy only one adaptation of the book, this is the one I would spend money on. Now, if I could find another adaptation of Mansfield Park besides the 2007 movie...

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[–] jazinegrrrl 15 years ago

Thanks for the tidbit regrading the distribution rights. I naturally assumed the BBC did the 1971 Persuasion, although I did notice the Granada Television credits in the DVD without giving it much thought.

Too bad there's no surviving copies of the Persuasion from 1960. I wonder if that adaptation did the novel any justice.

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[–] randommovies2002 15 years ago

Too bad there's no surviving copies of the Persuasion from 1960. I wonder if that adaptation did the novel any justice.

Wouldn't it be great to see it? I'd love to. I'd also love to see the 1967 Pride and Prejudice. I've seen clips of it online (archive footage used in documentary). It looks pretty good. What I saw was in black and white, though, and not color as is stated in teh trivia section on the IMDb listing for 1967 P&P.

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[–] Julie-30 15 years ago

Married ladies and spinsters wore caps during that period. Austen herself wrote in a letter that one of the things she enjoyed about being a spinster is that she could just put a cap on over her hair without bothering to do her hair.

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[–] randommovies2002 18 years ago

My reaction the first time I viewed it was very much like yours. But I have to say it grew on me after a while. I like that it includes more scenes from the book. A fault of the 1995 version is that it leaves so much out and even changes some rather important facts of the story.

I've learned to look beyond the bad hairdos and ugly fabrics to see more of the positive aspects of the series -- just as I have learned to look beyond the faults of the 1995 version. While the 1971 series is not nearly as aesthetically pleasing as the later adaptation, it still has some good qualities that can be appreciated. (And fast forward can be very useful, too!)

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[–] jazinegrrrl 18 years ago

I can relate to both points. Like randommovies said, I really was disappointed in the 1971 version initally. I decided to watch it again and being it was the more faithful adapation to Austen's novel is what made this less than stellar version more appealing. I still prefer the 1995 film though.

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[–] randommovies2002 18 years ago

Me too! (Who can resist those uniforms?) :o)

All kidding aside, though, it's such a lovely film. Austen's minor characters are exquisitely played by such an amazing cast...not to mention how wonderful are the portrayals of the principle roles?! :-)

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[–] hhartling 17 years ago

The Anne and Frederick in this version are nice people and you root for them to get together again. I enjoyed the little boys in this version -- great naughtiness. But the "depth of feeling" in P95 just sweeps me away. Think of the different interpretations regarding Anne's "I'm no card player." In P71, Frederick dredges up a distant recollection, something like "Oh, yeah, I seem to remember you said that once." In P95, Frederick and Anne share a very tender moment. The knowing, loving look he gives her, "No, you never were, were you?"

Every adaptation of Jane Austen has its merits and I am so grateful that I can own these films and watch them whenever I choose.

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[–] gracie-of-rvale 17 years ago

does anybody know any links to clips and music videos made with this adaption?

you bleed just to know your alive

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[–] sleepy_angel 17 years ago

I couldn't agree with you more, Jazinegrrl and Randommovies. I had the same first impression of the film as you did and now find it somewhat watchable, although I still find the actress portrayal of Louisa excruciatingly annoying.

http://fathersloveletter.com/fllpreviewlarge.html

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[–] hhartling 17 years ago

I think Frederick's burgundy velvet attire at the concert ranks right up there with Anne's green plaid gown.

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[–] berryloda 17 years ago

I really enjoyed this version, and overall prefer it to the 1995 version.

The 1995 version had Elizabeth shouting instead of speaking, and I didn't like that.

Mary was much prettier in this version. Still self centered, and whiney, but not mean.

We see Elizabeth's shock after Mrs. Clay ran off.

I do wish this version had included Anne nursing little Charles. It makes more sense as to why Charles is so insistant that Anne nurse Louisua in Lyme.

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[–] randommovies2002 17 years ago

I'm currently rewatching the older Austen adaptations. I only watch about 20-30 minutes each evening, so it's going to take me a little while before I get through them all again. Right now I watching the 1972 Emma. I've just about finished it, so perhaps I should watch this one next! :-)

We see Elizabeth's shock after Mrs. Clay ran off.

Yes, I like that this version gives more information about Mr. Elliot and Mrs. Clay-- and that we see Elizabeth's (and Sir Walter's, too?) reactions. It's an important catharsis, imo. Very satisfying!

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[–] berryloda 17 years ago

Oh, yes. Sir Walter's reaction also.

I just love how Jane Austen set that sub plot up!!! Both Anne and Lady Russel tried to warn Elizabeth and Sir Walter about Mrs. Clay, but neither would listen. Then they were acutally shocked when they discovered for themselves what Mrs. Clay was capable of.

It is one of the best "I TOLD YOU SO's" without anyone actually saying "I TOLD YOU SO".

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[–] berryloda 17 years ago

I really enjoy all of the Jane Austen adaptations for different reasons.

The BBC versions are longer and have time to show sub plots. The big screen versions have bigger budgets and have amazing settings and costumes.

Sometimes my mother and I will have an "Emma", "Persuasion", etc, day and watch all of the versions in a row. The rest of our family thinks we are nuts, and just leave us be.

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[–] jazinegrrrl 15 years ago

Haven't been here in a while but I enjoy reading the posts. I wonder what everyone feels about the 2007 adaptation of Persuasion.

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[–] Julie-30 15 years ago

There is a separate board for Persuasion 2007, and several of us have posted there.

Personally, I can't stand the new version. I was really looking forward to it because Persuasion is my favorite novel and P95 is one of my favorite movies of all time, but I just don't like the new version at all. And I tried -- I watched it 3 times in an attempt to find something to like. And I failed.

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[–] jazinegrrrl 15 years ago

I have to agree with you Julie. The newer version is lacking in comparison to the 1995 adaptation. I'm still holding out for an adaptation that mixes in the accuracy of the 1971 film with the brilliant acting that came with the 1995 one.

I felt Sally Hawkins and Rupert Penry-Jones were very miscast as Anne Elliot and Captain Wenthworth. There were only a few credible performances like Anthony Head as Sir Walter.

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[–] rizdek 15 years ago

I find the 2007 the most interesting. The extent to which it captures fails to capture the book (or at least other peoples interpretation) aside, I found the portrayals of Anne and Capt Wentworth by SH and RPJ to be more interesting than either of the other two version I have. I have this one and the one with Cirian Hinds and Amanda Root. Among the three, I like the 2007 version best, then the 1995 version, then this one. None are bad, but those are my preferences.

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[–] Dovasary 14 years ago

Is this version available on region 2 DVD at all? I'd love to see it, since I finally got around to watching both movies (I liked them both, but I think I prefer the 1995 one, because Ciaran Hinds appeals more to me in that role than the other guy, Lady Russel's hair distracted me a little, though, and Elizabeth and Sir Walter worked better for me in the new version...) and would love to see a version that includes more side plots - I haven't read the book in a while, but I am sure there's more to at least Mrs Smith's story (isn't it Mr Elliot's fault that she's pretty much destitute?) and probably a lot of minor plot points that were left out of both movies.

Keep an open mind, but not so open that your brains fall out.

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[–] weaselfrance 14 years ago

No, it's not available for Region 2. I ordered a copy from the USA which I can watch on my laptop or an old DVD player I'd 'hacked' to make it multi-region. This version has a good Elizabeth and Mary, a very good Wentworth and some of the scenes after Anne has accepted Wentworth, which are lovely.

There is a lot more to Mrs Smith's story and you get it all here. It also addresses the Mrs Clay subplot fully. But I don't want to spoil it for you, if you haven't picked up the book for a while....

He looks like what happens when you punch a cow!

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[–] iamweaver 14 years ago

I doubt that anyone is still reading this board - but I am *so* glad for Netflix and the opportunity to see this gem of an adaptation.

Though this mini-series starts out with a few heavy-handed monologues from Anne and there are a few weak moments between the couple, overall this adaptation does an excellent job of displaying the two characters' reactions to each other without words - I really appreciated that.

There are several times in Bath (and when Wentworth first fully sees Anne there on The Cobb) when Anne simply glows - its a wonderful transformation (but I am not so thrilled with the actresses' "Frederick, Frederick, Frederick"s).

I shall have to mug an old lady or two in the near future, so that I can add this well done version to my collection. For me, it ranks well above the recent 2007 adaptation, but a little bit below the 1995 version.

As a male, I really appreciated Mary in this version - she was by far the sexiest of the actresses physically, and the dissonance between that and her personality was very well played (poor Charles!). Frederick's sensitivity was nicely developed, more obvious than the Ciaran Hinds' 1995 performance, but without the extraneous dialogue added in the newest 2007 version. I particularly liked the exchange between the eager Luisa Musgrove and the contemplative Captain while nut-picking - with us seeing what he was really thinking, while observing Anne's reaction to his *words*, rather than his body language, which she could not see. Outstanding.

I thought that the entire "romantic setup" scene (with the conversation between Anne and Captain Hargrove whilst Captain Wentworth is furiously thinking and writing in the background) was very well played - even sublime - and made the entire scene very understandable by someone who hasn't read the book way too many times, as I have ;). It was my favorite scene in the movie, and as the high point of the book, I still complain about its treatment in the 2007 version.

I thought the conversations between Mr. Elliot and Anne quite well done as well. In general, the supporting cast put in a good performance, though I found Elizabeth a bit weak, and Sir Elliot will, in my eyes, always be Sir Anthony Head (in the 2007 adaptation).

My only real complaint about this version is that Anne Elliot looks quite a bit older than her older sister (and Wentworth) - in fact, she looks the age of the actress; nearing 40. This is a little jarring, since I have the ages of the novel's characters rather fixed in my mind.

And a quick "Hullo!" to my fellow IMDB JA fans, ably represented in this thread!

Edit: Holy smokes. I just did a "shout out" to Jane Austen "peeps". How sad :)

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[–] randommovies2002 14 years ago

Right back @ ya!

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[–] darroughlaw 14 years ago

Once I get past some of the characters' ages, I think I love this version every bit as much as the '95 Persuasion movie. I think that Mary and Charles have a good chemistry in this version and I actually like this Captain Wentworth better than the '95 one.

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[–] randommovies2002 14 years ago

Thanks for posting.

Yes, I think these older adaptations have their own charm. And because I have come to love the older Austen adaptations, I've become curious about other older literary tv adaptations from the 70s. There are some really wonderful miniseries out there. They all have the same production values (stagey style, raw lighting, video indoors with film for outdoor scenes, sparse background score music [if any], etc.), but there is always something of value I can take away from the viewing experience.

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[–] Julie-30 14 years ago

Have you seen the books that have been published about the various adaptations that include descriptions (and often pictures) of adaptations from the 1950s and 1960s?

There are 2 that I personally own and like:

1) Jane Austen in Hollywood, by Linda Troost and Sayre Greenfield
2) Jane Austen on Film and Television, by Sue Parrill

http://currentscene.wordpress.com/tag/jane-austen-odyssey/

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[–] bellestrange 12 years ago

I rather enjoyed this version, despite some of the obvious flaws that have been pointed out. The costumes, sets and hairdos were all really not quite right, but beyond that it was the most faithful adaptation I have seen of Persuasion, and not badly acted either (although I may have been influenced by having just watched the 1980 version of Pride and Prejudice where the acting was so ghastly that it would make anything else look superior). I was even able to forgive the age of the actress who played Anne because she made up for it in beauty and elegance fitting the character. I think her sometimes rather booming and loud voice bothered me more than her age, but all in all she was not a bad Anne.

I think the 1995 version will remain the definitive one for me, but this was enjoyable enough to watch as well.

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