MovieChat Forums > Nevada Smith (1966) Discussion > Biggest problem with the film

Biggest problem with the film


Of all the implausablites of the film, the one I have the most problem with is when Tom Finch (Karl Malden) realizes that Nevada Smith is Max Sands and lets him live. Why not just shoot him? He wasn't in town with a mix of people who could be a witness, he was with his own gang in the wilderness. Also, Tom Finch knows the lengths that Max Sands will exact revenge, and Fitch has already established himself as a ruthless sadistic killer, so why let him live when Brian Keith blows his cover? To me this is the biggest flaw in the film.

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He didn't know he was max sands until the very end. There was no implication at all that Finch knew who he really was even after Jonas calls his name. Max was a good liar.

So for you, I'm sorry but the problem you have with this movie isn't even existant. It's a misunderstanding on your part and if you still think its a problem then sorry.

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There was plenty of implication that Finch heavily suspected that Smith was Max Sands, and that would have been compounded after Jonas calls him Max-repeatedly. 2 minutes later, Finch himself calls him "Max Sands" The logic of the character of Finch in the film and his ruthlessness established with the torture killings of Smith's parents, along with Finch being "spooked" by Max Sands suggest that he would have not taken any chances with Smith after Jonas calls him out, and would have executed him.

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He didn't know!!!
Go watch it again, he has all his men kneeled down to brief them or give them a pep talk and in closing he says something along the lines of "ill get you max sands" and looks at each man as if he had no clue. Why would he do that if he KNEW that it was steve mcqueen? and he wasn't doing what max was doing by lying and covering the truth up, he was scared and confused. He really did not know which one of his men was sands.

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Sorry for you but he did have a major clue and acted like it when Brian Keith's character called out "Max!" several times. It is a problem with the movie. "He didn't know which one of his men was Sands." Really? You know that? OK, if that works for you.

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wheelz is correct.
But that doesn't explain why Fitch is so suspicious and tried to bait Max in revealing his true identity when they first got to his house. Not sure about that. I don't think Fitch or his men knew Max was trying extremely hard to find him in that town.
That might me a plot hole. But there may be a scene that was cut that would explain it.

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That part confused me also, as it seemed like he highly suspected McQueen was Max Sands - he had several clues anyway, and I'd have thought he'd shoot him if he even suspected it, considering what a cold-blooded killer he was.

"Are you going to your grave with unlived lives in your veins?" ~ The Good Girl

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I figured this was because Sam had a rep. for tearing into the other killers the 1st moment he found them. Max played it very cool this time and gave no indication that he was a rabid killer who wouldn't waste a second cutting his throat.Also,Fitch was pre occupied with the robbery about to go down.Max seemed like cool headed, competent and ready for anything - just the kinda pro Fitch could depend on during the robbery.Max had become 'seasoned' and no longer like the wild 'half breed savage' Fitch had been expecting. I think McQueen did an excellent job of slowly rolling out the changes in Maxs character over time, as he became more confident,cool headed and 'professional'(as a killer). Somewhat like Pacinos 'Michael Corleone' over the course of TGF I ('Joe College' war hero to 'GF'). Besides, back in those days, pre photos, I'd imagine one could drive them self crazy with suspicion as the drawings on 'Wanted' posters looked like every other guy that walked down the street !

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I'm watching the movie right now. When Jonas Cord calls out twice to Max, Fitch knows Max Sand is among his men, but he has no idea which one he is. It's not until Fitch looks up from the spilled gold wagon and sees Max on the hill looking down at him that he makes the connection. By then of course it's too late.


"The value of an idea has nothing to do with the honesty of the man expressing it."--Oscar Wilde

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Does anyone else see a connection with 'The Bravados"? Two seasoned directors colorfully telling a similar story of revenge very well.

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I do. I thought of it while watching Nevada Smith. And I found both movies very good and interesting. I like the acting of my countryman Karl Malden (Mladen Sekulovic) in this one, it is similar role with the one in One-eyed Jack.

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Fitch must have had a very short memory, at the start of the movie when they are looking for Samuel Sands, Max tells them 'He's my father' and Jesse Coe, Martin Landau's character says 'You have a first name boy?' 'Max' he says. Doesn't take a genius to work it out. Meanwhile Fitch(Malden)never took his eyes off him getting a really long look at him. That's why it spoiled the end for me because he should have know who he was all along.

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It was a very interesting dilemma for Tom Fitch. He was suspicious of the new "kid" but he needed as many men as possible for the gold heist. So he improvised many "tests" to flush out Max Sand including the tobacco pouch from the dress of his dead mother. Max passed all of the tests to Fitch's satisfaction and only at the end did Fitch realize he was dead meat.

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Kobi,

Fitch tested Max BEFORE Cord called out Max's name. Fitch may have been satisfied with Max passing those tests, but he had to have again been very suspicious after Cord did that. I am not sure I would call it a plot hole, because with all the goings on getting ready for the heist he was distracted. But it did really press the line of what is acceptably plausible.

A very differnt sort of problem I had was with Pilar's reaction to Max's killing Bowdre. We don't know much of her backstory as far as her attitudes are concerned other than her asking him initially if he was in prison for killing someone, and he said no (which was technically true). At first though I took this to mean merely that she was going to trust him more, be less concerned about her personal safety, if he was not a murderer.

But on the ohter hand I think it fair to say, despite the arguments later presented by the padre, that a revenge killing is hardly on an equivalent moral, meaning immoral, level as an outright murder.

Then there was the angle that having been bitten by the snake, the poison no doubht was in fact affecting her thinking.

It may have even been intentional which at the time would have made for a frankly revisionist western sort of approach to the unfolding parable, but this all came across as making her rejection of Max rather ambiguous in terms of where Pilar was coming from. This in turn imo made assessing Max's own moral standing ambiguous. Perhaps intentionally so? I do in fact think the film should be understood as showing Max as, just as Cord had warned, becoming more like the men he was hunting as the hunt changed him.

But when he killed the first murderer, there was no real expression of remorse, and the wife even lauded him for doing that. The Indians also seemed to approve what he did. So what changed when it was the second one in Bowdre?

Pilar herself briefly raised that it was that Max had misled her, but imo only in the sense he did not tell her who Bowdre was and what he intended to do. On the other hand I do think Max wanted to save Pilar, and perhaps even had some general intention to stay with her when all was said and done. Nothing was said or done that indicated he was literally only using her, as she said.

All rather confusing. I gave the film a 7, which is not bad. Could have been better though.

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My biggest problem is that Steve was supposed to be green at the start. As much as I love the guy, nothing he does suggests this. Incorrect casting.

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I agree. I thought it was silly how bemused Cord was when Max ineffectively tried to rob him. This whole “green” thing was part of the movie’s poor effort to present McQueen as a teenager with no experience in the world. Maybe a bumbling kid trying to commit a robbery would be slightly amusing but it doesn’t work when it’s a 36 year old man playing the character.

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I guess Fitch panicked when he realized who Max Sand was. Otherwise why didn't he pull his gun & blast away at Max while surrounded by his gang at the overturned wagon? He may have gotten some help from them especially if he made out like Max was the law.

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Just finished watching the film. Remember Fitch told them it was every man for himself when someone asked about sharing the gold. The gang was too busy grabbing their share, and my guess is they would have told Fitch to go eff himself if he commanded them to follow him after Max.

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Sometimes the biggest problems with a film are the people watching it.

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Quite true. All movies have flaws just like life itself has flaws. Trying to figure every flaw or plot hole in a movie can drive you crazy and diminish your enjoyment.I enjoyed this movie w/o having to figure out every detail. You want flaws and confusing plot holes -try Marathon Man with Dustin Hoffman. Great movie but just sit back and enjoy it.

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