"The Girl"


Just saw 'The Lights of Zetar'. Not a good episode by any means. And not made any better by the constant reference to Lt. Romaine as "the girl". She's a member of Star Fleet, not a 10 year old!

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Yes, I cringe every time they do that. There are many cringeworthy moments in this episode but I have a soft spot for it. It was the very first Star Trek show I saw. Spock's ears and eyes kept me watching. The fact that lights could be life forms captured my imagination like no other television show had ever done. I was hooked. I was also very young.

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I will say it does stand out in my mind as one of the episodes that scared the crap out of me when I was a kid! The colored lights and the weird croaking sounds (especially on the older lady at Memory Alpha) just freaked me out!

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Next Generation had an episode where the life forms were light energy that needed water to sustain. The hook was Troi tells them they are beautiful to us. They think we are trying to kill them but we are just despoiling yet another resource. Whut?

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Sigh... my buddy will text me out of the blue just to tell me I'm an "ugly bag of mostly water".

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I would like to think that if this episode was done in season 1 that script issues such as that would have been cleaned up. By the time this episode came along to film it was obvious that the end of the line was clearly in sight. Nobody really cared.

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Actually in the first season, Emily Banks (born 23 January 1933) played Yeoman Tonia Barrows in "Shore Leave" and turned 33 years and 9 months old during the filming of the episode.

And Yeoman Barrows referred to her self as a girl several times.

For example:

"All a girl needs is Don Juan."

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I think in that case the character was saying that to be whimsical. Further, I would guess that the Barrows character was intended to be mid to late 20's. In any case "The Lights of Zetar" is a very poor episode that usually got hacked to bits when run in syndication. I timed it during one broadcast and the local television station had it down to 28 minutes of actual content. I only timed it because the prior two weeks the broadcasts seemed especially laden with commercials.

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I never noticed it back in the '70s when I first viewed the episode, but it does stand out now.

No blah, blah, blah!

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Agreed, to both Biff and LLou.

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Yeah, I complained about that very thing on another BBS ages ago (pre-net I think). It was a 3rd season episode. I can only guess that they cut back on the writing (or quality thereof).

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I remember when my grandmother used to call her friends "the girls". I guess they actually were younger than her but probably only by 10 or 20 years and thus still middle aged or elderly. I had to wonder how old they would have to be for her to call them "the women or the "old gals".

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It is annoying, isn't it? Kirk does it. Spock does it. McCoy does it. Even the freaking Lights of Zetar refer to her as The Girl. Perhaps to emphasize the character's inexperience? (" ... your first assignment for the Federation.")

Shari Lewis was in her 30s when she wrote this episode - probably no older than Mira Romaine, and about the same age as the actress who played her. It's an unusual choice.

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Last year Emily Blunt was The Girl on the Train.
In 2014 Rosamund Pike was the Gone Girl.
Lauren Graham was still one of the two Gilmore Girls last year in the mini-series.

This board is now even more PC than Hollywood. I hope I wake up from this nightmare.

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And not made any better by the constant reference to Lt. Romaine as "the girl".
Lettuce give her the respect she deserves.

It's not a question of political correctness, but of common courtesy. A man would not generally like being referred to as "the boy".

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Lettuce give her the respect she deserves.

It's not a question of political correctness, but of common courtesy. A man would not generally like being referred to as "the boy".


I was just thinking about Earthman Come Home a novel in the Cities in Flight series by James Blish. When the city of New York visits a distant colony planet, Mark Hazelton meets and marries Dee, a young officer in the planet's space navy, who joins the crew of New York City. Dee is called a girl when first met and a few times in later events in the novel spread out over several decades. Of course the anti death drugs she gets to take as a crew member keep her looking young, but still. And one of the Mayor's assistants, old enough to be elected as city manager, is described as a boy.

In A.E. Van Vogt's Mission to the Stars the grand captain of the space battleship Star Cluster is 35 years old. She gets a message on her viewscreen from a young officer she thinks of as a boy. Maybe she used "boy" to mean a male. but if she means the officer is significantly younger than her remember she is 35, and the Star Cluster has been isolated on an exploring expedition for ten years.

Anyway, I'm sure most men and women don't want to be called boys or girls. And probably some boys and girls don't like being called men or women.






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I gather you haven't been to the Star Trek: Discovery board yet.

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When you said Star Trek Discovery, I actually had to think for a moment to even remember what that was.

I love the original series, and enjoyed the Next Generation too, but after that I feel Star Trek has kind of sucked so while I still consider myself a big fan, I really don't get excited about anything new that comes out.

That goes for the new films too. I still haven't seen the last two. I'll probably get around to them eventually just to see.

I'd probably at least give Discovery a chance if it were going to be on some channel I can watch, but as it is, it isn't even on my radar, and I had forgotten about it.

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Well the Abrams movies are terrible, in fact they aren't really even Star Trek when you get down to it. And I can't recommend Voyager, or even Enterprise although on the whole it's probably more worth seeing - even if only just once - than Voyager.

But you really should try DS9. It takes a while to get going, but it's really good.

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I tried DS9. I really wanted to like it. I'd never not liked a Star Trek series at that point and for some reason at first I just needed to like it and watched it every week. Eventually, I just gave up. For some reason I caught several episodes in the last season and liked them even less. I know some people liked it, but it just wasnt for me, I guess.

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As I posted on a DS9 thread, "Some people are never able to enjoy alcohol(ic beverages). But I don't pity them as much as I pity those who are never able to enjoy DS9."

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Sorry LOZ was yr 1st TOS ep. Boorriinng! Except the quest BAB of the week is HOT! She looked more in her late 20s.

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According to Merriam-Webster:

Definition of girl
1a : a female child from birth to adulthood
b : DAUGHTER
c : a young woman
d sometimes offensive : a single or married woman of any age
2a : SWEETHEART
b often offensive : a female servant or employee
3 US, informal
a : a female friend
I love going to a spa and dinner with my girls.
— Karen Clifton
b —used as a friendly way of addressing a woman or girl
Hey girl, I like your taste in Christmas gifts.
— Miranda Crace
Girl, you need to give yourself some credit.
https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/girl

At the present time the legal age of majority in the USA is 18, when TOS was made it was 21.

Jan Shutan (born 5 November 1932) turned 34 years old during filming of "The Lights of Zetar" and was definitely not a girl according to definition 1a. However, she could be classified as a girl according to some of the other definitions of a girl.

I remember when my grandmother used to call her old women friends "the girls". It is true that they were probably all significantly younger than her, since they were still alive, but they were still old women.

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I don't mind being called a girl. At my age it's better than, "Hey, old lady." haha

It does seem like a subtle way of not seeing women as actual grownups though when it is used in TV dialogue.

I was watching an old Big Valley episode recently. A character who liked Heath bought him a very expensive gift, a new saddle.

He says, "A girl shouldn't be buying a man an expensive gift."
I doubt that the dialogue would have ever been, "A woman shouldn't buy a boy an expensive gift."

It's just a subtle thing, but I don't think Captain Kirk would refer to one of his male officers as "the boy."

However there WAS a bit of dialogue in The Wrath of Khan which I get a kick out of. In the scene, Captain Terrell and Mr. Chekov notify the scientist Dr. Carol Marcus that they may have found a totally lifeless planet to conduct her experiment.

She says that there can't be so much as a microbe on it. She says, "You boys have got to be clear on this."
Ha, I love it. A woman calling men "boys"!

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It's just a sublet thing, but I don't think Captain Kirk would refer to one of his male officers as "the boy."


Lieutenant Robert Tomlinson in TOS "Balance of Terror" was portrayed by Stephen Mines (born 3 February 1939) who was 27 years, 5 months, and 22 days old when filming his scenes as Tomlinson on 25 July 1966.

And at the end of the episode:

KIRK: How many men did we lose, Bones?
MCCOY: Only one. Tomlinson. The boy who was getting married this morning. His fianc�e is at the chapel.

So Dr. McCoy called Tomlinson a boy despite Tomlinson being well past the age of adulthood and McCoy being less than twice Tomlinson's age. And that is something which I have noticed for a long time.

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KIRK: How many men did we lose, Bones?
MCCOY: Only one. Tomlinson. The boy who was getting married this morning. His fiance is at the chapel.



Bingo.

Different times. Here's two quick stories on the subject:

I recently met a retired woman judge of considerable reputation and when she noticed my wedding ring she asked how long I was married. I told her 33 years and I was quite fortunate that I married a great girl. The judge looked at me and sternly corrected me: woman.

We were invited to a costume party last year and I told the host we would love to attend as long as a costume wasn't a requirement. She asked why, and I told her that any costume I wear today would most certainly be appropriate, but 10 years from now I'll be branded a racist, or misogynist, or one of the other ists that identify people nowadays. I did not plan to set myself up for target practice by the next generation of idiots.

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I'm going to nitpick and say it's a slightly different situation, as it was McCoy who said that and not Kirk.

As a doctor McCoy doesn't follow the same protocols of rank as chain-of-command officers do (or should) in a military-ish structure, and he was probably twice Tomlinson's age. But Lt. Romaine and Cap. Kirk were probably within ten years in age, and she was at least temporarily under his command, so he really should have been a bit more professional.


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