MovieChat Forums > The Bedford Incident (1965) Discussion > USS Bedford...what type is she?

USS Bedford...what type is she?

posted 19 years ago by CmdrCody
30 replies | jump to latest

I'm puzzled by the two ships that represent USS Bedford in the movie.

It's well known that the US Navy would not lend support to the picture so for the external shots in the beginning of the movie, Director James Harris was forced to film a frigate belonging to one of the NATO members. "F179" is clearly marked on the stern, but whose navy does she belong? What type is she? What's her name?

I compared freeze frames of the ship with my warship book of all navies. The only match I could find that was close to a one funnel frigate of that era was the UK Blackwood class, first launched as HMS Grafton on 13 September 1954.
HMS Devonshire also has some simularites, but has two funnels and is not a frigate, as the "F" designation suggests. Or could it be the frigate UK Gurkha class, first launched 11 July 1960? Gurkha has two funnels instead of one. Any ideas, guys?

My second question is what type is depicted by the model ship, USS Bedford, used in the rest of the film. No US type destroyer looks like Capt. Finlander's vessel as it tools around the screen. The movie model is beautifully detailed and in almost every shot, especially around the "icebergs," looks realistic. It has some visual dimensions of a cruiser rather than a destroyer in some scenes. What is it? US Garcia class destroyer escort (1964)?

Thank you in advance for your comments.

CmdrCody

[–] 19 years ago

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[–] 19 years ago

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[–] IwasSquidly 19 years ago

I'l have to watch it again. When the film was made the Adams Class was finishing its production run and the Coontz/Farruguts were still classified as frigates. Odd classification; the Coontz outweighed Adams by a 1000 tons. The older Forrest Shermans didn't mount ASROC. The Adams mounts ASROC between the stacks with a five incher in the stern, forward of the Tartar. Coontz mounts ASROC forward without a rear gun.

I'm not saying we won't get our hair mussed!

[–] CmdrCody 19 years ago

Thank you, guys, for your comments and insights.

Richard Widmark must have had a lot of fun making this movie, with such a complex character as Finlander to play.

CmdrCody

[–] IwasSquidly 19 years ago

Watched it again. It appears there are two models of different scale and detail but they are both Coontz class.

Can't identify the the live action ship. British County class is a possibility.

My regards to the Lost Planet Airmen.

I'm not saying we won't get our hair mussed!

[–] CmdrCody 19 years ago

Iladyn: You have a keen eye for ships' lines and an in-depth knowledge of such craft. Much appreciated.

CmdrCody (and The Airmen)

[–] pizzawarrior1956-1 18 years ago

By the way, did you notice a strong political message in this film ???

Being made in 1965, I had a feeling that Finlander represented the right-wing, overzealous Cold warrior that might touch off WW III by accident.

I also noticed that when he wore glasses during his briefings, he looked like Barry Goldwater.

I doubt that was an accident.

And his demeanor all through the film, especially during Poitier's interview, seemd to bear this out.

Not that this is a bother, for this is a great film.

[–] mwb_8 15 years ago

The model used during filming is actually a stylized version of the "Farragut Class" destroyer.

It is also incorrect in Wiki that the Navy never used the designation DLG (Destroyer Leader Guided missile), as that entire class was originally designated DLGs (USS Farragut was DLG-6), but redesignated rather early on.

[–] IwasSquidly 19 years ago

I'm only now reading your initial comment. A serious student it would seem. Your Blackwood ID could be correct; they've some similarities. My 'Janes' from '85 (when I used it daily) shows them transferred to India's Coast Guard stripped of the armament we see in the film. F179 would fall into the sequence of UK's 'Amazon' class and has the same high freeboard but the class's first unit wasn't laid till 1969 and hull 179 is missing from the record. I can't find an F179 in the other NATO fleets.

The missle targeting radars on the Coontz were the same used on the Leahy class cruisers and confused me at first as I was more familiar with Leahys.

Generally frigates are single screw/single engine jobs but the US Navy plays fast and loose with nomenclature. Nuke powered CGs were reclassed as DLGs before scrapping. Aegus cruisers were modified Spruance destroyers. Don't get me started on naming.

I'm not saying we won't get our hair mussed!

[–] CmdrCody 19 years ago

1ladyn: Yeah..I remember that oddity about frigate classification by the Navy during the 60's and early 70's. The US thought then a frigate class of ship might bridge the gap between a destroyer and a cruiser and would be a fairly large vessel...while the rest of NATO considered a frigate class to be a destroyer escort class with much less capability. Then we got in line with our allies later on.

I enjoyed reading your comments and insights. I wondered if "F179" belonged to another NATO partner like Norway, or Germany which might explain it's relative "stealth" amongst both our naval records.

Like I first mentioned, "USS Bedford" we see in later shots appears to be a large warship, almost in the class of the "Long Beach" class cruiser (without the distinctive square bridge and Talos missile mounts.)

It's fun to speculate on all of this...thanks for your imput. Regards,

CmdrCody

[–] IwasSquidly 19 years ago

Spent some time in WesPac operating with the Long Beach. Originally intended to carry a Mach 3 anti-ship missle that was never deployed she is truly unique, and huge. CGN9's motto was "The Only True Cruiser". There's no mistaking her for anything else. Now relegated to the Bremerton mothball fleet she's easily distinguished in Google's satelite photos.

I'm not saying we won't get our hair mussed!

[–] CmdrCody 19 years ago

Wow...I'm just an amature historian with an interest in ships. You served in them.

Wasn't "Long Beach" launched to be a sister ship to "Enterprise" and sail in battle groups together?

[–] 19 years ago

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[–] CmdrCody 19 years ago

Right.

[–] CGSailor 10 years ago

Generally frigates are single screw/single engine jobs but the US Navy plays fast and loose with nomenclature.

Actually it had nothing to do with screw/engine combination. It had everything to do with Size/mission capabilities.

And they weren't playing fast and loose with it, they went through a reclassification period in 1975 to close what was perceived as a "Cruiser Gap" between the USN and the Soviet Navy.

All DL and DLG hulls went away and were reclassified. the smaller DLG's were reclassed as DDG's and the larger DLG's were reclassed as CG's.

Nuke powered CGs were reclassed as DLGs before scrapping.

Ummm No.
First off, there is no reason for doing so. They would have simply decommissioned them as is... as CGN's (Not CG's, if they are nuke powered they are CGN's a Nuke Powered CG is a misnomer)

The CGN's were originally DLGN's but were reclassed as CGN following the 1975 Hull realignment. They WERE NOT reclassed back to DLG upon scrapping.

Aegus cruisers were modified Spruance destroyers.

No such thing as an Aegis classed Cruiser.
Aegis is a Combat System of networked sensors and weapons that is installed on several DIFFERENT CLASSES of ships.

You are thinking of the Ticonderoga Class Cruisers (CG's)
And no... they are not "Modified Spruances" The only commonality is they used the same external hull shape of the Spruance, everything else both internal as well as the superstructure are different.

The missle targeting radars on the Coontz were the same used on the Leahy class cruisers and confused me at first as I was more familiar with Leahys.

That would be the SPG-55B Target Illuminators.
Leahy's had 4 of them.

Unlike your Ticonderogas being modified Spruances, A Belknap is a Modified Leahy.
Same everything except they yanked out the Aft missilehouse and launcher and replaced it with a 5" gun flightdeck and helo hangar.

Question... How are you familiar with Leahys?
I served aboard USS Halsey, CG-23.
As an EW (Electronic Warfare Tech) my workcenter was all the way up on the 05 level. Highest compartment in the ship, only thing higher were the Masts and stacks.

I could step out of the watertight door to our compartment, take 5 steps forward, and lay my hands on the #2 SPG-55B

After Halsey was Decommed, I served aboard USS Kitty Hawk (CV-63)

I joined the Navy to see the world, only to discover the world is 2/3 water!

[–] david-axford 18 years ago

I can put your minds at rest regarding the unknown destroyer/frigate. The warship in the opening sequence was HMS Wakeful (Type 15 frigate), pennant number F159. The action sequences onboard the frigate were in fact filmed onboard sister ship HMS Troubridge, Type 15 frigate, pennant number F09. Troubridge was originally built as a 'T' class destroyer and launched in 1942. During 1955-57 she was converted to a Type 15 frigate.

During 1965, whilst on passage from the UK to Gibraltar, we had a US film crew onboard filming some scenes for The Bedford Incident. I was a young signalman at the time and recall being dressed in our number 8's (working rig) with foul-weather jacket, anti-flash gear and life jacket. To top all this we had to wear American tin helmets! I still have a black & white photo of me in this rig, just about to hoist a flag signal and another where I'm holding onto a 10 signal lamp. One afternoon, whilst in this rig, we had to run up and down the flag-deck whilst being filmed. Not an easy thing to do whilst being thrown about in the Bay of Biscay.

I have yet to see the film. One of my New Year resolutions I have promised myself is to do just that. Though I have no illusions of seeing myself in it as I understand that most film shot ends up on the cutting room floor.

Bunts

[–] 18 years ago

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[–] CmdrCody 18 years ago

david-axford: This is great. You were in HMS Troubridge with the US movie crew was aboard filming? Can you fill us in with more memories?

We here on the "Bedford" board love the picture so naturally you're a bit of a celeb to us. More info, please!

Thanks. CmdrCody

[–] david-axford 18 years ago

CmdrCody: I have just watched the opening shots and have amended my original statement to include HMS Wakeful as being the warship in the opening sequence. The other shots onboard ship were on the HMS Troubridge as we sailed from the UK to Gibraltar,where we off-loaded the film crew. For the film sequences we wore our usual action working rig, Number 8's, life jacket and anti-flash gear (gloves & close-fitting hood). The only thing that was American were the tin helmets that were used for the film sequences. I can't recall anything else of significance.

[–] IwasSquidly 18 years ago

Danke mucho.

Alfa Delta Two Eight

That breaks as "Splice the main brace" or belly up to the bar.

My ship was filmed for the Costner flick, "No Way Out" and got 7 seconds of screen time.

I'm not saying we won't get our hair mussed!

[–] peternotar 18 years ago

It appears to be an earlier version of the US Navy DLG-6 class. Also called DLG-9 class and DDG-37 class due to changes in class nomenclature. See the website maintained by NAVSHIPSO (Naval Vessel Register) These ships were characterized by the two Missle Fire Control radars AFT (AN/SPG-55), the Terrier missle launcher aft, the ASROC (Anti-Submarine ROCket) forward of the 01 level and the 5"54 Caliber gun on the Forecastle.
The Radars onboard were typical of the class also. Early height finding on the top of the mast, TACAN on top of after mast and earlier version (if not the actual) AN/SPS-29 air search on after mast also. The wardroom looks correct as far as layout. However sonar operations were not held in CIC. The sonar operator was several decks down so that they were closer to the sonar system. This was needed because the audio processing then was not great and they needed as little loss as possible. I spent 4.5 years on this class. 1970-1974.

[–] Yossarian147 18 years ago

That's right, the Bedford is a Farragut(DL-9, DLG-9, DDG-37)-Class Destroyer leader.

[–] XweAponX 18 years ago

Obviously, they used minuatures when they filmed some of the iceberg sequences. I did not really look for differences in the ship, and I always hate mooovies that show one kind of plane, or ship, or sub, and then they show a close up and the markings are different, or it is a compleatly different make and model of ship. Make/Model, how do you say that in Naval terms? Mercedes Benz makes Ships? Haha! I drive, er... Drive? I drive a Ford Sub-Chaser. Haha! And look at me, I even live in a city that services ships!

Sorry, ehem, ahaha. Well... I think the producers of the film did a capital job of finding a boat that I would believe was a US ship, even though, I cannot say that I am familiar with ships nowadays. When I was a kid, I used to collect models of Tin Cans and Subs, and I used to know alot about them, but, that was 40 years ago.

I agree with Commmander Cody about the Miniatures, they did look very realistic. I wish I had his impressive knowledge of ships, and as I am always one for accuracy and detail, I would like to see things look at least like what they are supposed to be. Which is why when a filmmaker spends a lot of money to get a set or a prop looking exactly right, that is a commendable thing... Even if not very much money was spent to convince me and I was convinced anyhow... That is even better!

Anyway, I found these looking for images in Google:

http://www.pmbdt.co.uk/members%20models/images/A&Rs%20SUB%20HUNTERS.jpg

I think the longer ship in the image looks like The Bedford... But unfortunately there is no identification on the site that is hosting the images, it just says "sub hunters"

Both of these ships have some of the same outward qualities of The Bedford. But, as for identifying exactly what kind of ship The Bedford was, well, this moovie was made in the early 60's? So what ships were used for sub chasing back then?

I googled it and I found several references, which I have to check out. But the Navy websites may be more forthcoming- I found one site that had a lot of ship history, but I do not have the bookmark handy on this machine. When I find it, I can post the link and maybe it will be helpful.

[–] EuroNYC7 17 years ago

In the beginning of the film, when Sidney Portier is aboard a helo snapping pictures of the ship, the latter was a British destroyer (this was considered a nitpick by many moviegoers as it constituted an inconsistency); I am sorry to say I am not very well-versed in IDing British naval vessels. However, I can tell you the USS Bedford portrayed in the main film is a U.S. Farragut-class DLG (Destroyer Leader guided-missile ),first leadship (U.S.S. Farragut) launched on July 1958 followed by another nine ships in the class. She had a complement of 392 officers and men and was armed with one 5-inch gun, one ASROC anti-sub rocket system (which was fired at the climax of the movie), four 3/50 calibre guns, six 21-inch torpedo tubes and a Terrier SAM system. For her time, she was the perfect multi-purpose warship. Like Capt. Finlander told Munsford and "Doc", the Bedford..."could inflict more damage then all fleets combined in World War II"..or something to that effect. In any event, I would love to own a model of that destroyer; she sure is a beauty!

[–] 17 years ago

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[–] 17 years ago

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[–] eThink 15 years ago

Here is the Wikipedia link to the Farragut / Coontz Class:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Farragut_class_destroyer_(1958)#List_of_F arragut_class_destroyers

Reference to the movie "The Bedford Incident" is part of this Wikipedia article.

[–] david-axford 12 years ago

The USS Bedford was portrayed by the British warship HMS Troubridge (F09). She was a Type 15 frigate that had been converted from a destroyer.

We had a film crew take passage from the UK to Gibraltar in 1965. I was a young Radio Operator (bunting) and we were dressed in action working rig (Number 8's, anti-flash gear, life-jacket around our waist with the new foul-weather gear just been introduced. On our heads we wore American tin hats. We were filmed working on the flagdeck, hoisting flags etc. All ended up on the cutting-room floor!

I might also add that no filmstars were onboard, or if they were then I don't remember any. Certainly the big names weren't onboard.

[–] CmdrCody 12 years ago

david-axford: A hearty holiday "Cheers!" to you. Your insight into one of my favorite movies has been much appreciated. At one point many months ago, I had my copy of Jane's Fighting Ships 1985, History of the US Navy and David Miller's "The Cold War" out, trying to get a line on your ship, shown in the beginning of the picture.

I first saw "The Bedford Incident" in the theater when I was 12 or thirteen and it really put a spur to me. The naval cat-and-mouse game up near Greenland was so "cool." I loved everything about the way of life depicted in USS Bedford (except, maybe, the maniacal Captain) as well as the cool gadgets (the ASROC console on the bridge "growling" and clicking as it warmed up).

Never served at sea, though. Just lived it thru books and movies...and my imagination.

CmdrCody