MovieChat Forums > Marnie (1964) Discussion > Not Rape

Not Rape

posted 5 years ago by Painbow (156)
2 replies | jump to latest

She's damaged goods but by the time that scene occurs, she's clearly in love with him. Her refusal to have sex is not based on her lack of desire, her lack of attraction, or her lack of emotional connection. It is based on her psychological issues with sex.

He isn't very sympathetic at that point but some part of her wants him to take control, guide her, connect in a way that she doesn't know how.

It was a clumsy attempt to break her away from that, exploring the psychological techniques and theories of the time.

By today's standards, it wouldn't be acceptable but shit, what is acceptable by today's standards?

[–] Otter (24464) 5 years ago

By today's standards it was 100% rape. By the standards of the early sixties it wasn't legally rape, because back then it was legal for men to physically force their wives to have sex. It was, according to law and custom, a man's "right". Married women had no rights in this matter.

But yeah, it was rape, and not one done with the kindly intention of helping her get over her fears. He was angry and frustrated at her continued refusal and wasn't going to take it any more, not when the law allowed him to have his way.

Considering what we've heard about Hitchcock and Hedren over the years, I think that scene represented Hitchcock's unfulfilled desires (somewhat romanticized). Audiences and critics never liked it.

[–] [deleted] 4 years ago

Oh, it was 100% rape, even by early 1960s standards.

It was precisely because it was a rape scene that Hitchcock fired the original screenwriter, Evan Hunter. Not only was it a rape scene, but a gratuitous one at that (it was his only reason for making Marnie in the first place, to shoot a scene in which he got to vicariously experience forcing himself onto one of his blonde starlets). Hunter begged Hitchcock to not have this scene because he knew it would cause the audience to turn on Sean Connery's character. But being a creep, Hitchcock pretty much went, "F.U.; I absolutely must shoot this scene of Marnie getting raped" and hired someone who was willing to write it for him.

I guess the point is that if marital rape was such an ambiguous concept at the time, the scene wouldn't have resulted in such a major conflict.

Two links that go into this with more detail:

http://www.standbyformindcontrol.com/2016/01/marnie-in-which-hitchcock-rapes-his-audience/
https://cinephiliabeyond.org/marnie-hitchcocks-controversial-exploration-of-sexual-violence-and-the-complexity-of-the-human-psyche/