MovieChat Forums > The Haunting (1963) Discussion > Eleanor was an insufferable character.

Eleanor was an insufferable character.


Her stupid *beep* innocence, naivete, overdramatics, yuck. Awful, awful character. So annoying. The actress who played her did a terrible job, beyond irritating voice. I just want to strangle Eleanor!

oh, stigmas revealing our vices

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OK, good, we were supposed to hate her. Then the actress did a fine job of that, I suppose!

oh, stigmas revealing our vices

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OK, good, we were supposed to hate her. Then the actress did a fine job of that, I suppose!
Why are we supposed to hate Eleanor? She doesn't do stuff that's exactly hateful...just rather annoying.

I do think Eleanor is (while, granted, supposedly unbalanced) ungrateful and a childish hysteric. The whole time she's moaning in voiceover, "No one wants me...they all want me to leave!" And it's like, "YES! Because you're GRATING!"

The trivia section -- which is notoriously unreliable on these boards -- does mention that Ms. Harris had a different interpretation of the role that clashed with the director's view. Perhaps her take went in a different, more sympathetic direction (?)

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On an unrelated note...I have no idea why the glamorous Theo is sexually attracted to the mousy drip Eleanor. It seems kind of insulting to homo/bisexuals...portraying them like they're overheated sex fiends who'll just fling themselves at anyone they share a room with.

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Dear cookiela2001:

That is why IMO, I did not "get" Theo as a lesbian.

I have read the book and seen the film.

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what? you're joking right? it couldn't be more obvious that Theo was hitting on Nell unless she was wearing an old wifebeater, greasy overalls and and working on the engine of her truck

she's even given a a masculine name, uncommon for the 60s

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Don't some straight women work on trucks too?

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I never got the "hitting on" part, Mr Grinder. Are you talking about when they're drinking? Theo never makes a move to touch Nell. I believe Theo is much more outgoing and comfortable socially than Eleanor. When they meet Theo feels sorry for Nell who hasn't had much of a life. Theo is involved with someone that she shares an apartment with and will be returning to as soon as this experiment is over. The interactions Theo has with Eleanor are sometimes physical when both actresses are terrified when the house is making so much noise, but those scenes never look sexual to me. Is there any chance that straight men look for lesbian activity wherever they can plant it? I know many straight men love to fantasize about two women together so perhaps its just natural to impose those feelings on two characters in a movie. If I missed something where Theo was trying to take off Nells clothes please inform me. Maybe I saw a censored version of the movie that eliminated all the sexual stuff. But no, I never saw any "hitting on" in the entire movie, not from any character. Its not a movie about making sexual hits.

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I agree, I didn't see Theo as a lesbian either. It seemed almost like Theo was toying with/tormenting Nell at times, justifiably so because Nell was *beep* annoying.

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As if it wasn't obvious enough in the movie itself... you guys should watch the DVD w/ Robert Wise's commentary. He outright confirms the lesbian subplot, and specifically mentions that one early scene was cut to "tone the lesbian thing down."

But knowing how people are these days, I suspect you'd say "So what? He's just the director, it's just his opinion. He's not the boss of me! If I'm too thick to figure she was a lesbian then she isn't one, end of story!"

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Sorry Cookie, but obviously you saw a different movie. I never saw Theo throwing herself at anyone, especially Eleanor. Theodora was perhaps the most sensitive character in the movie, the one with ESP and within a few moments of meeting Eleanor we see uncanny examples of her ability to discern Eleanors nickname and the fact that she's recently purchased new clothing especially for this trip. True, neither of these is particularly earth-shattering as they involve a lot of common sense and intuition but the remarks she makes are not common among the people I meet. They are the only two women at the start involved in the experiment. They share adjoining rooms. It is a scary old house. I got the impression that Theo (who mentions "we love to go antique shopping to fix our apartment", in regard to her own living situation, which led me to conclude that she is involved in a committed relationship I would imagine with another woman. She senses there is something very special and very needy about Eleanor and Theo makes a point of reaching out to her and making Eleanor the center of attention as much as possible in an attempt to bring her out. No where did I ever get any impression that Theo is attracted to Eleanor sexually. Julie Harris is never a particularly sexy actress and this role in particular underplays her attraction. The predictable crush she develops for Dr Markway stems from the fact she probably meets a new male every ten years or so. We never hear about her going to college, dating anyone or in fact getting out of the house. The car she helps purchase with her sister she says she's never driven. And the pathetic feelings she has for the Doctor are obviously never going anywhere as Theo tries to warn her. Although only in her early 30's (we're informed she cared for her mother for 11 years - so technically she could still be in her late 20's) Eleanor has had next to no life whatsoever and is in fact a born victim. So much so that being killed and trapped forever inside Hill House is a tremendous GIFT for her - finally she feels as though she belongs somewhere. No, Theo plays her part perfectly as the great actress Claire Bloom would and without any hint of flirtation or attraction towards Eleanor. Since Julie Harris got top billing and was probably the better known actress at the time there may well have been some infighting and natural competitiveness between the two women. If so I'm afraid Claire Bloom got the better of her. I don't believe it ever pays to play a loser or a social victim if you're an actor and certainly Eleanor had a vipers tongue when describing her so-called friend as "unnatural".

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Eleanor spent most of her adult life looking after her sick mother. She had no friends and lived with family members who did not get along with her. Eleanor was isolated from society and did not know how to react to other people. Her concept of love was derived from ideal romantic situations found in romantic novels. It was because of these factors that Eleanor was not emotionally equipped to deal with sources outside of her own experiences. I think Robert Wise used Eleanor's life situations in the novel to form Eleanor's character in the film.

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It's refreshing to read a post by someone who understands Eleanor, rather than dismisses and condemns her out of hand.

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Thank you. I have read "The Haunting of Hill House" six times. In the book there is a subtle indication that Eleanor maybe mentally unbalanced. In truth, Julie Harris who played Eleanor in the film was actually suffering from anxiety/depression throughout the production. Due to this her performance mirrored her personality as seen in the novel.

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You're welcome. Not sure how many times I've read or watched it at this point, myself, but a good number of times anyway.

I agree that Eleanor is unstable , and personally think that's more than subtley shown. But, to exact
Y what degree is. The question.

Her anxiety, alienation, and confusion, given her experiences -- provided they're true -- are certainly understandable. Who wouldn't feel the same house under the same, or similar, circumstances? Additionally, who wouldn't at least question their own sanity?

Very interesting.that Julie Harris herself was at the time suffering from anxiety coupled with depression. Often they do go hand in hand, in this case, as far as I'm concerned, her unfortunate state of mind, no matter the cause, added a further dimension to her Eleanor.

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So Eleanor, in a way, is a cousin to Emma Bovary.

Both are given glimpses of excitement and romance that are always just out of reach.

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I do think Eleanor is (while, granted, supposedly unbalanced) ungrateful and a childish hysteric. The whole time she's moaning in voiceover, "No one wants me...they all want me to leave!" And it's like, "YES! Because you're GRATING!"


Hahaha!! Thanks for that. Yes, she's grating, and a little goes a long way.

The trivia section -- which is notoriously unreliable on these boards ...


Lord, yes. I wish citations were required, Wikipedia-like. I could dive into some trivia section right now and claim the script was heisted from a fruitbat literary collective, and it would probably sit there as fact for years.

... Ms. Harris had a different interpretation of the role that clashed with the director's view. Perhaps her take went in a different, more sympathetic direction (?)


That would explain so much! And be more in keeping with all I admire about Harris as an actor.

But then, it's in the trivia section, so it might be someone's fever dream. ;)

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Nothing to see here, move along.

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I wondered if anyone else was bothered by this character. I love old horror movies and Julie Harris was a great actress, but I am SO ANNOYED by her in this movie! I can't sit through the whole thing because of her, she's so neurotic about everything. but it's the character, not the actress! Julie Harris was a great actress: I think she turns people off because she is so unlikeable in THIS movie. But I think it's wrong to not like her based on this one character. Is it "East of Eden"? I'm not sure if I'm thinking of the right movie, where you would fall in love with her, when she plays a sympathetic, very caring person.

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The actress was excellent, but Eleanor was indeed chock full of issues, poor thing.

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The actress of course was Jule Harris, who passed away this year.

Her character in Reflections in a Golden Eye (1967) reminds me of Eleanor.

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Good parallel! Imagine if they had added her houseboy from Reflections as character in The Haunting! That would be a hoot!

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Julie Harris did a wonderful job. The fact you couldn't stand the character proves it. That's how she was supposed to play her.

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aye, though she's not quite one herself, the concept of an anti-hero was around long before breaking bad

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Eleanor was portrayed excellently by Julie Harris. No one could have done her better. Eleanor was "bedeviled" as Markway notes at the end. She sacrificed her life for others and never received any love. A life sequestered inside with a sick woman would create a weak-minded, innocent, naive, fanciful creature just as Ms. Harris played her. In spite of her life Eleanor shows a sense of humor (How nice they didn't mar the woodwork.") Furthermore, she shows insight into Theo's character mentioning "unnatural things, you for instance" in speaking to Theo. All in all, Eleanor's character was key to the story. How else could she have come under the spell of Hill House?

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I agree with you 101%, twofortulip: Julie Harris WAS Eleanor. No, she was not a very likeable character, but Harris plays her to the hilt: she IS Eleanor from the novel to a tee

Even larks and katydids are, supposed by some, to dream

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I thought what we were supposed to feel for Eleanor was a mix of sympathy, pity and maybe a bit of contempt. She is obviously screwed up. But it seems that most of her issues were a result of a crummy childhood, a series of unexplainable "supernatural" events, and her lack of identity and self-esteem.

After a while, her constant victimization of herself becomes insufferable. A few years of therapy could her done her a lot of good!

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Or some sex. You get the impression that she had never lost her virginity. Now most healthy women are going to experiment and occasionally get a night out when they can go man watching. Caring for your mother doesn't mean you're chained to her bed. If she had worked she and her sister could have paid someone to care for the mother or placed her in a nursing home. Life is full of choices and somehow Nell made some bad ones for herself. People who would allow their lives to be so restricted and prison-like as hers appears to have been are suffering some serious mental issues that I don't believe therapy could have solved. Without a healthy sexual perspective you are never on equal footing with a group of more normal people. I believe each of them in their way felt sorry for her. She herself feels so much self-pity that its hard for the audience to feel sympathy. And she is at times a spiteful, nasty, harsh-spoken bitch, in particular to Theo who has done nothing but try to befriend her. There are certainly times when she is insufferable, but I believe Shirley Jackson was setting us up for the ending, when we realize Eleanors life was so pathetic she's actually happy to be dead and haunting Hill House. Finally she has found somewhere she belongs. It just ads a certain creep factor to an already very scary movie.

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You do of course realize, lots of people like her used to actually exist, right?

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Yeah, Eleanor was simply an unlikeable person. She had a mean streak, was self absorbed and far too defensive. Throughout the movie, she was often overbearing and rude.

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I simply don't understand the nastiness toward Eleanor.

First of all, she had led an extremely sheltered and repressed existence. All her life she had the thankless task of doing the bidding of her mother, down to keeping her clean in her final years. She had reached middle age never having been wanted or having a home of her own, or any place where she felt she belonged. She's extremely repressed and uncomfortable with others. She has really low self-esteem.

Or is the problem with Harris's portrayal of her?



Get me a bromide! And put some gin in it!

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I have a feeling that, as with Jane Austen, there's a "right" time in one's life to appreciate _The Haunting_. It was like that for me, anyway: the first few times I caught this movie, over a period of years, I didn't like it, didn't like Eleanor, didn't like Theo, couldn't stay with the story. As I've grown older and more experienced in learning about people and their own traumas, I've come to like and appreciate this story and it's troubled characters much more.

Last night I watched it, and not only stayed with it, but "rode" with Eleanor in a way I never expected to. As stated above, she's the daughter who had to give up a life to take care of mother. Her sister has a husband, a daughter who teases Aunt Nell, and a grasping, unsympathetic attitude toward Nell. This time around, it was no surprise to me that Nell has developed into what she is, and that she is easy prey for Hill House. In the realm of movies, I figured her in the same category as Blanche duBois, left alone at Belle Reve to take care of a crew of dying, resentful relatives; or Charlotte Vale from _Now Voyager_, if her situation had never changed. So this time around, I appreciated and admired the courage in creating a character like Eleanor, and Julie Harris' courage in inhabiting her so completely.

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She deserved it.
And she's a template for what happens if you let your family trap you, which is exactly what she let happen to her. If you're that stupid, someone will always cheerfully take advantage of you. That niece was more adult than she ever was.

How the **** did she ever learn how to drive a car, anyway?
(Ooops - plot hole)

I hope the house's appetite is now finally sated - Eleanor's certainly one Big Non-Happy Meal!


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Well, she probably would have had to drive her mother to the doctor or the hospital from time to time.

A lot of this kind of entrapment is often conditioning: if, from the moment that you're born, you're taught that your first commitment is to your sick parent, and if your social circle is restricted so that you never develop the knack for relating outside your family, it can be very effective and has little to do with stupidity. And it takes very hard work and commitment to break free. And also something to look forward to on the other side. It helps to have allies. Charlotte Vale lucked into a sympathetic sister-in-law with connections to a very good psychiatrist. That's why _Now Voyager_ ends in a victory for Charlotte. Eleanor had no one till it was way too late and in the wrong place.

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Only you can save yourself from your "family."

Too many people I've met think Eleanor ruined the film. They simply didn't give a damn about her predicament, halfway through the film.



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Ultimately true, as it is true of almost any problem a person faces. There are people who don't succeed in saving themselves. I don't view most of them as stupid, but rather as in too deep, one way or the other, for their own particular capacities. Having allies, from my perspective, is mostly about lending a hand, rather than actively saving. Going by _Now Voyager_ again Charlotte's sister-in-law finds Dr. Jacquith, and Dr. Jacquith is a professional, but ultimately Charlotte takes the reins in her own hands and saves herself. But she needed that initial hand reaching out to pull her out of the water, so to speak. In the end, she's able to use her own experience to save the mental health of a child. Eleanor has not been lucky there (neither was Blanche duBois in _Streetcar Named Desire_).

I agree that Eleanor is terribly hard to deal with, both for us and for the other characters in the movie. It's because, I think, by the time we meet her, she's already drowned, so to speak. The first many times I watched the movie, I often tuned out or growled (or worse!) because we had to be with Eleanor. This time around, it struck me differently, and I was seeing her with a more open sympathy. I'm glad to have learned a new perspective, and it's a lesson to me in patience upon revisiting stories; ultimately, I think, it will help me to keep patience when dealing with living people. So, as of this month, I find myself thanking Shirley Jackson, Robert Wise, Nelson Gidding and the brave Julie Harris for teaching this lesson to me.

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True, but thru puberty most of us develop a longing for a lasting sexual relationship where we can love and be loved. Owning our own apartment, working to buy things for our nest, building friendships and eventually having children. No matter how you may be brought up those longings are pretty universal - not 100%, but close. Most women would not wind up as Eleanor, regardless of their upbringing. We have too many inborn desires that conflict.

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Agreed. You do have some responsibility for how your life turns out. Maybe not 100% but certainly some if not most. She allowed her family to control her life whereas most of us would not.

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Its hard to miss the fact at the end that Eleanor is happy for the first time since we've met her. The tragedy that she needs to die and haunt Hill House for all time in order to belong and feel needed is indeed a strange and haunting fact, but like I said its hard to miss. Eleanor does wind up happy.

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I simply don't understand the nastiness toward Eleanor.

First of all, she had led an extremely sheltered and repressed existence. All her life she had the thankless task of doing the bidding of her mother, down to keeping her clean in her final years. She had reached middle age never having been wanted or having a home of her own, or any place where she felt she belonged. She's extremely repressed and uncomfortable with others. She has really low self-esteem.


Exactly as I see her. Even after her mother's death and she moves in with her sister and brother-in-law, they treat her very poorly. You can bet the sister didn't help Eleanor take care of their mother. The sister was insufferable.

Eleanor is, though, difficult to take at times. She's so immersed in victimhood. Even though I understand why, and do have compassion for her, sometimes I wanted to take her by her shoulders and shake some strength into her. But then, that just shows the success of the character, as written, and as portrayed by Harris.

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Exactly. Eleanor isn't nearly as insufferable as her selfish bitch of a sister, her bratty niece, and her indifferent brother-in-law. Now *there's* a family who deserved to be eaten by monsters.

Sure, Eleanor is whiny and a professional victim, but that's the role she was bred into from birth. It's *extremely* hard to break out of that. You have to retrain yourself from the ground up and on top of that, everyone around Eleanor (especially her family) had a vested interest in keeping her that way.

I find Eleanor tragic, not insufferable. She couldn't quite break free in the end.

Innsmouth Free Press http://www.innsmouthfreepress.com

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Eleanor isn't nearly as insufferable as her selfish bitch of a sister, her bratty niece, and her indifferent brother-in-law. Now *there's* a family who deserved to be eaten by monsters.


Absolutely! I'd forgotten about the bratty niece.

Sure, Eleanor is whiny and a professional victim, but that's the role she was bred into from birth. It's *extremely* hard to break out of that. You have to retrain yourself from the ground up and on top of that, everyone around Eleanor (especially her family) had a vested interest in keeping her that way.


Very insightful, and true. Judging by the behavior of the two sisters, the younger and prettier one was probably the favored child by her parents. Eleanor, who was more plain, and shy, had to take second seat, without the advantages of positive reinforcement her sister had.

I find Eleanor tragic, not insufferable. She couldn't quite break free in the end.


I find her tragic too. It's no wonder she fell for the doctor, who was the only decent person of the others in the house. He treated her kindly. But her hopes were soon dashed. No doubt her victimhood would eventually wear on the kind doctor as well, but he did know better than to treat her the way the others did, which only served to reinforce her viewing herself as the victim.

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I've been experimenting with a script for The Haunting (for my own amusement) in which Eleanor does break free from her upbringing. In fact, she was working on this long before she got to Hill House. I imagined that she has a couple of assets - a sense of humor and intelligence - and she has figured out how to use these to her advantage. As another Eleanor, Eleanor Roosevelt said, "No one can make you feel inferior without your consent."

I know that's not the way Shirley Jackson wrote it, but oh well . .

In this scene, set in the late 1990s like the remake, Nell and Theo are having a conversation in the parlor on the first day right after everyone has arrived; it's perhaps a sort of cocktail party.

They've already established, in their first conversation upstairs, that Theo is from New York and Nell is from Fair Lawn, a suburban town in Northern New Jersey.

Nell, “So where do you live, exactly?”

Theo, “I already told you, New York.”

Nell, “But where in New York?”

Theo, “Oh, you wouldn’t know the area.”

Nell, “I’m not a complete hick. Try me.”

Theo, “Ok, it’s called DUMBO, which stands for down under the Manhattan Bridge. . .”

Nell, “I know where it is, it’s one of those names realtors make up.. If they ever get to Fair Lawn they’ll probably call it FaLa. So, you don’t live in Manhattan then, you’re in Bro-o-o-klyn.” She pronounces the name of the borough with an exaggerated New York accent.

Theo wants to defend her present home. “It’s quite an up and coming area, actually. Fashionable yet bohemian at the same time.”

Nell, “You don’t say,” She realizes she is making some progress, and continues her probing. “Where are you really from? You didn’t grow up in DUMBO, I assume.”

Theo can’t find a way to evade the question. “Ohio, I grew up in Ohio.”

Nell, “That’s a big place. Where in Ohio? Shaker Heights?”
[An upscale suburb of Cleveland.]

Theo, “Ashtabula, okay, are you satisfied?”

Nell, “Wow, that's the town Bob Dylan mentioned.”

Theo, “He sang about Ashtabula?”

Nell, “Well, sure, it goes 'I'll look for you in old Honolulu, San Francisco, Ashtabula, you're gonna make me lonesome when you go.’ ”

Theo, “I’m amazed. I’ll have to check that out.”

Nell, “So I guess you don't have a copy of Blood on the Tracks?”

*****

So Theodora, under her glamorous exterior, is a bit more insecure than she first appears.

[Ashtabula is small city on Lake Erie; it was a gateway to the former steel industry centers around Youngstown.]

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I like it!

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Would you like to read more it? I have had a number of people read portions of it before even though it's not finished - I'm not sure if it ever will be.

The movie opens with a character that I made up; he doesn’t exist in any other version. In this case, Professor David Marrow hired four people, instead of the three as in previous versions. The fourth person is a young black man from New York City named Roland Sykes. He is fairly tall and lanky and in his early thirties.

Roland is riding a subway train from Queens to Manhattan (the train is actually outdoors at this point on an elevated section). He is going to meet David at Columbia University so that he can get a ride to the Berkshires.

He’s sitting in a seat near the end of the car with his luggage, and he is reading a newspaper.

A musician busker comes through the end door. He is a middle-aged black man carrying a guitar, a portable amplifier and a small folding stool. He sets up near Roland and starts his introduction.

“Good morning, ladies and gentlemen, sorry for any interruption, but I’d like to do a song for you today. Now you’ll probably remember this one.” He takes a moment to tune his guitar. “This is by the great Bobby Womack - hope you enjoy it.”

Most of the passengers have seen many buskers, candy-sellers, panhandlers, and others working the trains – it’s practically a daily occurrence - and few of them give him more than the slightest notice. Roland glances at him and goes back to reading his paper.

The other man starts his act:

“I was the third brother of five,
Doing whatever I had to do to survive.
I’m not saying what I did was all right,
Trying to break out of the ghetto was a day-to-day fight.

Been down so long, getting up didn’t cross my mind,
I knew there was a better way of life I was just trying to find.
You don’t know what you’ll do until you’re put under pressure,
Across 110th Street is a hell of a tester.”

He’s singing this enthusiastically, but he’s noticeably off-key. Roland is finding this amusing, and he tries to avoid laughing out loud. He has to rub his face to hide his smile.

The other man continues:

“Across 110th Street,
Pimps trying to catch a woman that’s weak . . .”

The doors open at a station, and the musician glances out.

“Oh, man, a cop!” He jumps up and quickly takes the seat next to Roland. A police officer comes into the car, takes a look around, and then goes through the end door to the next car.

Musician, “That was close. I had one of them give me a ticket last week. . . so how’s my singing? A little rusty, right?”

Roland doesn’t want to hurt his feelings, “No, you’re pretty good actually.”

The man smiles and taps him on the arm, “Come on, I know you’re just being polite.” He glances at Roland’s luggage, “You going on a trip?”

Roland, “Ah-huh, up to the Berkshires.”

Musician, “Yeah, really, a vacation?”

Roland, “More like a working vacation, sort of a temp job.”

Musician, “So what’ve they got you doing up there?”

Roland is starting to wonder how long these questions are going to continue. The other man notices Roland’s slightly annoyed expression; he decides to introduce himself, “Hey man, I’m Fred, glad to meet you.” He holds out his hand so that Roland can shake it.

Roland, “Okay, I’m Roland. . .you probably won’t believe this, but this guy, this psychologist, is doing a study of ghosts, and he’s paying me to stay in a haunted house - well, it’s supposed to be haunted, anyway.”

Fred, “Ghosts are real you know, I’ve seen them a few times myself.”

Roland, “Yeah? Where was that?”

Fred, “Down in North Carolina. Now, they’re scary when they’re around, but basically they’re just a nuisance. You see any up there, don’t pay them any mind, you hear?”

Roland shrugs, “All right, I’ll remember that if they show up.”

Fred, “You have to hang out with this dude all by yourself?”

Roland, “No, he’s hired three other people.”

Fred, “Any of them ladies?”

Roland, “I don’t know, I won’t know until I get there.”

Fred, “You could get lucky.”

Roland, “Oh no, I already have a girlfriend.”

Fred, “Yeah, but still. . .”

Roland, “No, this lady is special; I’m really tight with her.”

Fred, “You got a picture of her?”

Roland thinks to himself, Well, why not? He takes a photo out of his wallet and hands it to Fred.

Roland, “That’s Yolanda.”

Fred, “I see what you mean, she’s really fine. So what’s she doing while you’re busting these ghosts?”

Roland, “She’s seeing some of her family down in Venezuela.”

Fred, “Venezuela, huh? I’ve never been there, how about you?”

Roland, “Not yet.”

Fred, “You might be soon - meeting the folks, if you know what I mean.”

Roland, “I know her parents, they’re already here, over in Jackson Heights.”

Fred gets up, “Well, time to get back to business. I guess this car is a complete loss.”

Roland, “You’ve got seven more to go on this train.”

Fred, “True, but you know brother, you could salvage something of this situation, right?”

Roland laughs, “Okay, I can do that.” He pulls out a few dollars and gives them to Fred.

Fred, “Thank you, I appreciate that. Ah, you ride this train a lot?”

Roland, “All the time.”

Fred, “So maybe I’ll catch you again soon.”

They wave good-bye, but then Fred stops for a moment.

Fred, “Yo, Roland, when there’s something strange, in the neighborhood, who you gonna call?”

Roland smiles, “You’re gonna be calling me!”

*********

There’s a brief scene of Roland emerging from the subway at 116th Street and Broadway.

Then we see David Marrow in his office at Columbia University; Roland will be meeting him there in a short while.

David is taking a last look at the paperwork for the people he’s hired; he’s sitting at his desk, and his assistant Mary is opposite. There is a photo attached to the top of each pile.

David, “Eleanor Vance here, you remember her?”

Mary, “Oh yes, she seemed very nice.”

David, “I thought so too, but I don’t know if you saw this - the first letter she wrote to me was a bit odd.” He flips through the pages until he finds it. “First of all, she starts off with a bit of poetry. Listen to this, ‘Dear Dr. Marrow: Can’t seem to face up to the facts, I’m tense and nervous, can’t relax; I can’t sleep, my bed’s on fire, don’t touch me, I’m a real live wire.’ ”

Mary, “That’s not a poem, it’s part of a song.”

David, “Oh, you know it then? So she just didn’t make this up. Then she writes a few lines in French. ‘Ce que j’ai, ce soir la, - what I've done that night, what she said that night, realizing my hope, I’m going to glory;’ that doesn’t make any sense.”

Mary, “Well, that’s sort of the whole point of it.”

David, “After that it’s very straightforward, although at the end, she signs off, ‘sincerely yours, Eleanor Vance’, then she’s got, ah, just a nonsense word repeated, fah, fah, fah, looks like about twelve times, although she hyphenates some of them.”

Mary, “That’s part of the song too, you know how singers will do that sometimes.” She thinks for a second, then sing-songs a bit of “Strangers in the Night”, “You know, like, doo-bee, do-bee doo, doo-doo doo-doo doo. . .”

David, “So how do you do that with fah, fah, fah?”

Mary sings that too, “It goes like, fah-fah-fah, fah-fah-fah-fah. . .”

David chuckles, “Somehow Sinatra does that kind of thing better. What is the name of this song anyway?”

Mary is reluctant to mention that it’s “Psycho Killer,” “Well, it’s by a group called The Talking Heads. You remember them, they had some hits about ten years ago.”

David, “It sounds familiar, but I can’t place them.” He looks at Nell's photo, “When I interviewed her, she seemed pleasant, but very. . . low-key, is the way I might put it. Especially since I met Theodora the day before.”

Mary, “Oh yeah, she was hard to miss.”

David, “Flamboyant is how I’d describe her. Although I got the feeling she was putting on a bit of an act.”

Mary, “How do you think they’ll get along up there?”

David, “We’ll have to see, but I suspect Theodora is going to be rather assertive about things. I hope Eleanor doesn’t get pushed around too much.”

[Later it will be revealed that the reason Eleanor wrote this goofy letter is that she thought the ad she was responding to was a prank, and she was surprised to find out that it was real.]

*********

There’s a scene of Roland entering Marrow's office; then of them walking across the campus. Roland discusses his job as an auto insurance adjuster and why he doesn’t have a car of his own. (Ironically, he wrecked it in an accident.) I’ve written the scene but I’ll skip it now.

The next scene: Eleanor is driving on the road up to Hill House. We first see the car in an overhead shot, then from the front, approaching (pretty much like it was actually done in the 1999 movie).

A song is playing on the car’s tape deck through this (this being 1999, cars still had tape decks) and we hear Nell singing along:

“One hundred cups of coffee, five hundred cigarettes,
A thousand miles of highway and I ain’t forgot her yet,
But I keep on moving, keep a moving on down the line.”

Then we see the car from the side, revealing Nell behind the wheel.

“Ain’t nothing in my mirror, just a cloud of dust and smoke,
What do you expect when some old trucker’s heart gets broke?
Yeah, trucker’s hearts get broke.”

Then she sings the chorus:

“Those big wheels of rubber gonna rub her off of my mind,
I’m a highway junkie and I need that old white line.”

She slows down and pulls some papers out of a bag on the seat. She picks up a map, but it’s one from National Geographic and shows something completely irrelevant, like Australia. She tosses it aside. During this she sings,

“Was ten miles out of Nashville, I’m doing about ninety-one,
State boy pulls me over, said where’s the fire son?
He said, where’s that fire son?”

She finds the right map, showing part of Massachusetts, looks at that and then through the windshield.

“I said man there ain’t no fire, I’m running from a flame,
Go on and right your ticket, but I ain’t the one to blame,
That county judge tried to rob me blind.”

Hill House appears as she turns a corner, and she sings the chorus again.

“Those big wheels of rubber gonna rub her off of my mind,
I’m a highway junkie and I need that old white line.”

She stops in front of the gate and looks through her papers again. An instrumental part of the song is playing now.

She suddenly notices Mr. Dudley standing quite close to her open window. When the lyrics start again, she starts singing too, but now she turns her head and sings directly to him.

“So I rolled on down to Memphis, I had nothing left to lose,
Wanted to hear some rock and roll, but all they played was blues,
Didn’t to want to hear no blues.”

Dudley raises his hand and makes a motion with his fingers as if turning a knob. Nell turns off the tape but continues singing to him.

“So I went to call up Elvis but Roger Miller grabbed the phone,
He said dang we drive them 18-wheelers, boy you’re the kind of the road,
You’re the king of the road . . .”

She stops at this point; she sees him looking at her without any expression on his face.

Dudley gestures towards the car’s tape deck, “Randy Travis?”

Nell is a bit surprised, “Oh, you know the song. This is the Chris Knight version."

Dudley shakes his head, “Don't know that one.”

Nell consults her papers again, “You must be the caretaker, Mr. Dudley.”

Dudley, “One and the same. You must be either Theodora or Eileen Vance.”

Nell, “It’s Eleanor, Eleanor Vance.”

Dudley, “Anyway, you’re on the list.”

She notices that he has nothing in his hands, “What list?”

Dudley, “My list.”

Nell, “Right, you memorized it.”

Dudley, “There’s only four of you, plus this Dr. Morrow fella.”

Nell, “So there’s another woman coming up here.”

Dudley, “Appears to be.”

An awkward silence grows as she realizes he’s not going to say more. She gestures towards the gate, “Are you going to let me in?”

Dudley, “If that’s what you want.”

Nell, “By the way, I’ve got a couple of boxes in the back. Will you help me bring them in?”

Dudley, “I’ll have to look at them first.”

He abruptly leaves her and walks over to the gate. He unlocks it and swings the two sections open. He makes no gesture; he simply stands aside. She drives through and parks by the front door.

After she gets out, she looks at the house for a moment. She tries to think of something to say as Dudley walks up.

Nell, “So, Hill House.”

Dudley, “That’s because it’s on a hill.”

Nell, “Of course, I was just . . .”

He interrupts her, “The boxes?”

Nell, “Sure, they’re in the hatch there.”

As she unlocks the hatch, he notices the license plate, “New Jersey, huh?”

Nell, “You ever been there?”

Dudley, “Nope.”

Nell, “You should go sometime.”

Dudley, “And see what?”

Nell, “I don’t know, maybe the Paramus Park Mall. It’s got a waterfall inside.”

By now the hatch is open and Dudley is test lifting the boxes. Nell tries to keep the conversation going, “Did you know there’s a song that mentions that mall, it’s even got a scene set there?”

Dudley ignores her, “What have you got in here, bricks?”

Nell, “Sorry, it’s just some stuff for entertainment “

Dudley, “I’m going to need a handtruck.” He points towards the house, “Go on in, it’s unlocked. See the missus, she’s right inside.”

Nell, “The missus?”

Dudley, “Mrs. Dudley.”

Nell, “Ok, then you’re married.”

He gives her a slight look of annoyance, then he walks off without saying anything else.

Nell says quietly to herself, “What a happy guy he is.”

She gets a suitcase, a shoulder bag, and CD/tape player out of the hatch and closes it. Then she goes up to the front door and enters the house. She stands there for a moment, looking up at the high ceiling of the front hall.

**********

Well, that's how it starts. Thanks!

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@GunHillTrain:

Depending greatly upon the number of eyes you'd like on your work, you could always join fanfiction.net, which specializes in continuations and adjuncts to others' work (legally.)

There are many hundreds of fanfics on both the film and literary versions of many different stories and, you'll be interested to note, no versions currently, of The Haunting in either category.

You can't make any money on it, of course, but the new eyes might just spot something that you didn't. However, don't look for much critique - most peole are just looking for something to read without strings.

No fate but what we make. -Terminator II

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Thank you. I looked at the site briefly some time ago but I didn't realize that they would accept scripts as well as stories.

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It is true, there are VERY few scripts, but there are a few. As I said, apparently no one has mined this particular ore there yet.

The format, however, for an actual screenplay is a bit different than what you have (and takes up an ungodly amount of space per page.) I suggest reading Screenplay 434 by Lew Hunter to get the exact formatting. The other go-to guy for screenplay writing, Syd Field, never had anything up for an award, as Hunter has.

Best of luck and let us know if you decide to join over there to post the whole thing!

No fate but what we make. -Terminator II

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Oh yes, I have seen that kind of formatting. I guess I never used it because I never thought I was going to try to sell one. And The Haunting one I did do is not really finished even though it's so long it's more like a miniseries than a movie!

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Thanks for posting more. That was a fun read. I like both of your new characters, Roland and Fred. Liked Eleanor's letter, and that she wrote it thinking the ad was a prank. Your Eleanor is something of a firecracker :)

If you're writing it for yourself, this doesn't matter, but if you have thoughts of turning it into a screenplay, the plot would have to move along faster. You'd only have 120 pages to tell -- or retell -- the story.

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Yes, I'm definitely writing this for myself. I know about the 120 page limit but I'm not trying to sell anything. (Well, maybe it could be a miniseries!)

I have a short scene with Eleanor meeting Mrs. Dudley, but I haven't finished it yet. Mrs. Dudley does give her standard "I set dinner at six" speech.

For the first meeting of Eleanor and Theo I lifted some of the dialogue from the 1999 movie. A lot of what Theo says about her Prada boots, about her "girlfriend and boyfriend," the Munsters-Citizen Kane joke, her changing her clothes in front of Nell are from the real film. Most of what Nell says I made up. If you have never seen that version it goes like this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_8b5J7JR4yA

I like the part where Eleanor looks out the window and sees Theo’s car in the driveway. It would keep it as an Alfa-Romeo convertible, although as a somewhat newer (1980s) and thus less expensive car than the classic 1959 version shown in the real movie
.
Theo is walking up the stairs with Mrs. Dudley when she first sees Nell.

Theo, “Hi. Don’t worry, I’m not an obsessive packer. It’s just that getting people to help me schlep these things around is a cheap and exploitive way of making new friends.” She hands a bag to Nell, “Here. I’m Theo.”

Nell, “I’m Eleanor Vance, but everyone calls me Nell.”

They’re now walking down the hallway towards Theo’s room

Theo, “Well, ‘everyone calls me Nell’, don’t you just love it here? It’s sort of Charles Foster Kane meets The Munsters or something.”

Nell, “I always thought The Addams Family was the better show.”

Theo, “Really? They were pretty much the same, weren’t they?”

Nell, “Not at all; how about Morticia, for example? I actually wanted to be her when I was a kid. By the way, I like your boots.”

Theo, “Aren’t they great? They’re Prada, that’s Milan, not New York.”

Nell, “Well, I get my shoes at Target. That’s Clifton, not Hackensack.”

Theo, “And where are those places?”

Nell, “I’m from New Jersey, the town of Fair Lawn.”

Theo, “Fair Lawn. Such a bucolic name.”

Nell, “It sounds like a critique of landscaping, doesn’t it? Someone asks, ‘How’s your crabgrass problem?’ and the answer is, ‘Oh, fair to middling.’ ”

Theo, “I think you’ve lost me there.”

Nell, “It’s a play on words; fair could mean either pleasant or mediocre, right?” Theo is still baffled, and Nell laughs, “Oh, forget it. Let’s see what they got for you.”

They enter the room reserved for Theo.

Theo, “This is so twisted, seriously twisted.”

She jumps on the bed, and bounces around for a moment.

Mrs. Dudley is standing by the door, and she starts her memorized speech for the second time, aiming it at Theo now. Nell is right next to her.

“I set dinner on the dining room sideboard at six; you serve yourselves. Making breakfast is your responsibility.”

Nell is a step ahead of her and says, “You don’t wait on people.”

Mrs. Dudley looks at her, but Nell is looking out across the room. She starts up again.

“I don’t stay after dinner. I leave. We live in town, six miles away.”

Nell, ”I thought you said five miles.”

Mrs. Dudley, “No, it’s six, it’s always been six. What is it with you?”

Nell, “What’s with you? Do you press button B7 and the same thing comes out every time?”

Mrs. Dudley, “Fine, you finish telling her the details.”

She turns and leaves so abruptly that she almost seems to vanish.

Theo, “She obviously likes you.”

Nell is looking down the corridor Mrs. D used for her exit. She says, “Well I think she’s a cyborg; she’s got a steel frame under her skin.” She puts on an accent, “ ‘ Are you Sarah Cahn-ner?’ ”

Theo, “Who’s Sarah Conner?”

Nell laughs, “Never mind.”

Theo, “I assume you’ve met her husband too.”

Nell, “Oh, yes, Mr. Dudley, isn’t he a sweetheart? I was going to ask you - just a causal question - what does everybody call you? Something like Ms. T.?”

Theo realizes that she is being teased, “No, they call me Theo, short for Theodora.”

Nell, “Were you named after the Empress Theodora?”

Theo, “I don’t think so; who was that?”

Nell, “She was in the Sixth Century, the Byzantine Empire. Now she was a very impressive lady.”

Theo, “I guess being an empress is a big responsibility.”

Nell, “There was an emperor too, her husband Justinian.”

Theo, “What was he like?”

Nell, “They shared power, but she was probably equal, maybe more than equal, in her influence."

[This is the first time Theo is impressed by what Eleanor is coming up with, but she doesn’t want to admit it yet.]

Nell, “Something else I was wondering about; what is your last name? I don’t think you’ve mentioned it yet.”

Theo, “Why do you want to know?”

Now it’s Nell’s turn to be baffled, “Well, if you don’t want to tell me . . .”

Theo, “It’s Padgett, ok?”

Nell, “So – you’re Theodora Padgett.”

She can tell from Theo’s expression that she’s not particularly fond of her full name.

Theodora tries something different. She walks over to her luggage, removes her coat and then her dress; she’s wearing a black negligee. (This is much like the real movie, except Nell keeps looking at her through the entire sequence.)

Theo, “So, what do you do, Eleanor?”

Nell, “I’m between jobs right now.”

Theo is facing her now and Nell looks her over.

Nell, “I see you’re one of those people who let their underwear do the talking for them.”

Theo, “Oh, this?”

Nell gestures towards the low cut garment, “Yeah, that old thang . . . So, what do you do?”

Theo gets back on track, “I’m supposed to be an artist, but I’ve been distracted from work by love. You know what I mean?”

Nell, “No, tell me about it.”

Theo, “Hey, don’t tell me New Jersey’s that different from New York.” She gives a touch of scorn to the words “New Jersey.”

Nell, “Not at all, we’ve got indoor plumbing too.” She pauses for a moment to let that sink in. “So, what is going on with you then?”

Theo presses on, “I’d say my boyfriend is one kind of person, my girlfriend an entirely different kind. I wish we could all live together, but that’s never going to happen. It’s hard when you’re the only one at the party, you know?”

Nell, “It could be worse, at least you’re not one of those ladies you collects a lot of cats.”

Nell is smiling at her, and Theo is feeling a bit flummoxed now.

Theo tries another gambit. “What about you? Any husbands? Boyfriends? Girlfriends?”

Nell, “No, I’m a free agent right now, no entanglements.”

Theo is putting on a black gown; she walks over to Nell.

Theo, “A blank slate. I could imagine painting your portrait directly on you.”

She reaches out and plucks something from Nell’s jacket, “Sorry, you had a hair on you.”

Nell reaches over and tugs the edge of Theo’s gown at the neckline. She says, “Nice material. . . Ah, Ms. T, maybe we should have a cup of coffee first, don’t you think?”

Theo, “Okay, if that’s how you want to be about it.”

Nell, “That’s right. I mean, before you start painting on me or whatever else you have in mind.”

Theo, “I was just talking.”

Nell, “Great, let’s talk, a good way to get to know each other, right? By the way, Ms. Padgett, there’s a speed limit in this state, forty-five miles an hour.”

Theo, “What does that mean?”

Nell, “You’re supposed to say, ‘How fast was I going, officer?’ ”

Theo, “All right, how fast was I going, officer?”

Nell, “I’d say about ninety. Now, you say, ‘Suppose you get down from your motorcycle and . . .’ ”

Theo, “Wait a minute, I don’t have to say anything. Where are you getting this from?”

Nell, “You don’t recognize it?”

Theo, “Should I?”

Nell, “Well, I’ll tell you about it later. And, really, don’t worry, I’ll settle for a cup of coffee, but I think you know what I really need.”

Theo thinks about this for a moment, “Maybe it’s time for us to go downstairs.”

Nell, “Sure - let me stop in my room first; I want to get my boom box.”

Theo, “You’re going to play music?”

Nell, “Perhaps; sometimes life needs a soundtrack.”

As they’re walking out the door, Nell looks at her and says, “They’re quite a pair, aren’t they?”

Theo looks down at herself, “What pair?”

Nell “The Dudleys, I mean.” She can’t help chuckling, because she just fooled Theo exactly as she intended to do.

********

“I’ll settle for a cup of coffee, but you know what I really need,” is a reference to the REM song, “I Don’t Sleep, I Dream.”

There really are Target stores in the two towns Nell mentions.

*********

Well the following is entirely new:

Eleanor and Theo are walking through the first floor of the house; in a minute or so they’ll reach the Hall of Mirrors.

Theo is noticing various architectural details, “This place is hardly subtle, is it?”

Nell, “Yeah, our good Mrs. Dudley was complaining about dusting. Can you imagine her dusting this place by hand? That would be like dusting an auto assembly plant.”

Theo, “I think you’re exaggerating a bit.”

Nell, “No, I’ve seen the GM plant in Linden.”

Theo, “Linden; another New Jersey metropolis?”

Nell, “Yep, you got it . . . hey, here comes the man himself.”

Mr. Dudley is coming from the opposite direction. He’s wheeling a handcart, and on it are the two big cartons from Nell’s car.

Nell tries to be friendly, “Hey, Mr. Dudley, I see you’ve got your handtruck.”

He gets right to the point, “So where did you want these things?”

Nell, “Well, they’re marked already.”

The one on the top is marked “Parlor” and the one on the bottom, “Bedroom.”

Dudley, “Ok, so they are.”

Theo looks puzzled, so Nell explains, “It was just obvious there would be such rooms here, right?”

Dudley takes the top box and puts in on the floor. He says, “What have you got in here, cinder blocks?”

Nell, “You said that already.”

Dudley, “No, I said bricks, remember?”

Nell, “Hah, I guess you did. Anyway, it’s just some stuff – there’s a lot of videotapes in that one.”

Dudley leans on the cart and looks up the main staircase. The others follow his gaze.

Theo, “That’s some staircase.”

Nell, “You don’t have an elevator in here, by chance?”

Dudley, “No, there’s no elevator.”

Nell, “I guess it’s okay if you open that box, put the stuff in shopping bags or something - you could make smaller loads that way.”

Dudley, “I suppose I could.”

Nell, “I could help you with that, if you want.”

Dudley, “Yes, you could help.”

He puts a hand out and rubs his fingers together. Theo whispers to Nell; Nell reaches into her jacket and pulls out a ten-dollar bill. She smiles and hands it to him.

He turns it over a couple of times and looks skeptical.

Nell, “Oh, all right.” She brings out another a bill, a twenty. She holds it up, “See, Jackson!”

Dudley takes this one and looks it over too.

Nell, “Come on, that’s my gas money.”

Dudley, “Ok, good enough.”

Nell, “So give me back my ten.”

He gives a small shake of his head, and Theo gives Nell a nudge.

Nell, “No problem, keep it - and, really, thanks for doing this. You know, we should be on a first name basis, don’t you think? We’re going to be here a while.”

Dudley shrugs, “So who are you again?”

Nell, “Eleanor, or just Nell, whatever you prefer.”

Dudley, “And you?”

Theo, “Theodora, remember? Or Theo, that would be fine.”

He nods and just looks at them.

Nell, “And, what’s your name?”

Dudley, “It’s Randolph.”

Nell, “Do people call you Randy?”

Dudley, “No, they just call me Randolph.”

Nell, “How about Mrs. Dudley? I bet she calls you Randy.”

He probably understands her double-entendre, but he won’t admit it, “No, she calls me Randolph too.”

Nell, “I guess that’s all settled then. Now, about the boxes. . .”

Dudley, “Don’t worry about the boxes.”

Nell can see that this conversation is reaching its end. She says, “Great, so we’ll see you around, I suppose.”

They give little waves to him and walk off. He suddenly says, "Wait a minute, Chris Knight, he had an album out last year, right?"

Nell and Theo look back at him. He gives them a brief smile.

Nell says softly, "He actually smiled at us."

Theo, "Yes, I thought his face might crack."

*****

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You feel too sorry for her. Life is full of choices for all of us. If you had a sick mother who needed care when you are 20, are you going to give up your life and care for her exclusively, never dating or getting nights out to date or just go to a restaurant or night-club? Most of us are not that generous with our lives, especially in our 20's. That's when we tend to be the most selfish. The fact Eleanor did so tells us she must have been very shy, very insecure and uncertain about her ability to meet someone socially or conduct an adult relationship. Certainly we have lots of pitiful people who fit that description. I remember being painfully shy myself and taking years to finally develop a life, but you have to aspire, have hope for the future and work to make things better. Simply accepting your mothers care until she dies is not an acceptable solution for most of us. Had Eleanor worked she along with her sister could well have paid someone to care for her mother or sent her to a nursing home. Your parents and family do run your life until about age 18 at which point you either take over control or not.

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