MovieChat Forums > Charade (1963) Discussion > Super movie with 4 holes

Super movie with 4 holes


I love this film. Have watched it recently for the 3rd time and still enjoy it.

But 4 things don't make sense to me:

1) If Charlie stole $250,000 in 45, how does he still have that much several years later, given the lifestyle he and Audrey had. They obviously had been living off that money, and interest rates weren't THAT high.

2) Why didn't he have any clothes with him on his train trip?

3) Tex writes "Dyle" on the carpet in perfectly formed letters after he was strangled? Looked like he was training for a 5th grade legibility test.

4) Charlie's last "appointment" was at the street-fair, presumably to buy the stamps that he took with him on his trip. How is it that the stamp-guy was so honored to have them for the short time he did? If Charlie didn't buy them from him in the first place, what was the significance of him going down there before he left?



These flaws in logic do not detract significantly from my enjoyment of this movie. Great film that should be high on any film-buff's list.

reply

[deleted]

1) While it's a bit too convenient and coincidental that Charles, after the auction of the apartment's contents in 1963, walked away with the exact amount of money he'd stolen in 1945, there are certainly ways in which he could have ended up with a comparable sum. The script dropped enough hints (including his many passports and his mysterious life of "secrecy and lies") to indicate he was involved in shady activities which, while not enough to make him rich, were sufficient to finance his lifestyle with Regina. Six Degrees Of Separation made reference to an upper level of society that lives "hand to mouth," only on a grander, more affluent scale - a description that could have easily applied to Charles and Regina. Even if he'd squandered all the money he'd stolen, the sale of the apartment's contents (which could have included works of art that had appreciated in value by the early 60s) would have made up for any financial losses he'd experienced.

Of course, this is also one of those cases where the needs of cinematic storytelling trumps real-life logic; it's simply easier for the audience to follow the action if the amount of money (in this case, $250,000) remains constant from 1945 to 1963.

2) The French police reported what they had found in Charles' compartment after he'd been thrown off the train; it's quite possible he had a suitcase that Carson Dyle made off with and later discarded (in some secret place) once he'd discovered it didn't contain $250,000. After all, even though Paris is far less traditional than many cities, it's hard to imagine Charles boarding the train at Gare Montparnasse in his pajamas.

3) This is once again a case of the needs of cinematic storytelling overruling real-life logic. It's important that Dyle's name appears clearly and legibly - not just so Regina can read it, but so the AUDIENCE can read it as well. We always have to keep in mind that movies are heightened reality, and a certain suspension of disbelief is necessary (let's not forget that Cary Grant's character is by turns charming and menacing, depending on the needs of each particular scene).

4) The film never suggests that the vendor who winds up with the three priceless stamps is the same vendor who sold them to Charles; in fact, when Reggie gets a chance to talk to him, he admits he's familiar with the stamps (because of their notoriety), but he also makes it clear this is the first time he's actually set eyes on them -

I know them as one knows his own face, though I had never seen them.

All the film tells us is that Charles met someone at the stamp market before he left Paris. And as we see in the Jardin des Champs-Elysees sequence, there are numerous vendors present when the stamp market is in full swing.

reply

3) This is once again a case of the needs of cinematic storytelling overruling real-life logic. It's important that Dyle's name appears clearly and legibly - not just so Regina can read it, but so the AUDIENCE can read it as well. We always have to keep in mind that movies are heightened reality, and a certain suspension of disbelief is necessary (let's not forget that Cary Grant's character is by turns charming and menacing, depending on the needs of each particular scene).


Interesting point about catering to the audience. However, given the way Tex died, I think it would have been impossible for him to have written anything. I have finally decided that it must have been Carson Dyle who wrote "Dyle" in order to cast suspicion on the other man calling himself Dyle. Carson probably assumed that this other fellow was some crook who was only after the money.

I was saying to someone else on this thread that, if Tex had really written the name, then he wouldn't have written "Dyle". In order to let others know who the killer was, he would have had to write "Carson" (at least part of the name). Just writing "Dyle" would have pointed at two men (in Tex's mind), not just one.

~~~~~
Jim Hutton (1934-79) & Ellery Queen 🎇

reply

Apparently it was possible for Tex to write the name. At least according to the story. After all, it's not like we saw Tex die. He was tied up in a way with a bag around his head that kept him from breathing. It's consistent with the logic of the film that he lived long enough to write a name without being able to get the strength to escape his predicament.
Seems like a weird thing to do. But hey, it's a movie!

reply

Nope. I watched this film very recently and I double checked the scene where he is shown murdered. His arms were tied up, as were his legs. Obviously Carson Dyle got him tied up and then smothered him. No way could Tex have written anything.

Carson Dyle wrote "DYLE" in order to throw suspicion on the man calling himself Dyle. Carson probably thought that this "other Dyle" was just some crook after the money and that he'd be arrested for the crime. Serious mistake on his part. All he really did was to confirm what Cruikshank probably suspected already - that Carson Dyle was still alive. That was probably what they were saying at the American Embassy and it was up to Cruikshank to prove it. He probably got more suspicious once he saw Reggie running off and meeting someone. Seeing the word "Dyle" written on the ground there just confirmed his suspicions. Reggie was certainly meeting Carson Dyle and he chased her near the end of the film so that she wouldn't fall into Carson Dyle's trap. That's why (I think) he was so quick to say "That man is Carson Dyle". Quite likely he had seen pics of Carson Dyle at the Embassy, too. Identifying him would have been easy and obvious.

~~~~~
Jim Hutton (1934-79) & Ellery Queen 🎇

reply

4) It wasn't a "street fair" per se. As Sylvie says, it's a stamp market. We see scores of booths of stamp dealers, any one of whom could've sold Charles the stamps, or connected him with a collector willing to sell.

reply

I was in Paris on a Thursday in May 1992 and the stamp market was there.

reply

$250,000 was a LOT of money in 1945. A family of 4 could live comfortably on an income of a few thousand, so Charlie and Reggie could have lived well on the interest.

reply

Using an online inflation calculator:

$250K in 1945 = a little more than $3.1 million in 2012.

So, he could have lived quite well just off of interest / investment income if he were so inclined.

reply

Besides, she might have had some money of her own coming into the marriage. Nothing is said about her own family. Maybe her parents died and left a bit of money?

~~
JimHutton (1934-79) & ElleryQueen

reply

What I dont understand is if Crookshank knew that Mrs Lampert was innocent, then why did he scare her like that and not just tell her that he works for the embassy? Very sneaky, and couldve gotten her killed.

This is Mike. He saves ghettos.

reply

Cruikshank didn't know for sure that Mrs. Lampert was innocent. Even late in the movie, he had his doubts and insisted on going through that bag.

~~
JimHutton (1934-79) & ElleryQueen

reply

1) Plenty of gpod answers already.

2) Minor issue, since the killer could have made off with the clothes. He was obviously traveling extremely lightly -- in fact, the real question is why he'd bothered to weight himself down with PJs.

3) Huge problem. Poisoned, OK. Shot, just marginally OK. But strangled? No way.

4) As others have said, he didn't have the appointment there to buy the stamps. Maybe he was meeting Dyle there, or maybe he went there to make contacts. (I don't quite remember the chronology.) One doesn't buy and sell $100,000 items at a street market.

Edward
Can't he do something useful, like start an avalanche or something?

reply

3) He wasn't strangled; the killer tied him up and left him with a tied plastic bag over his head. Tex slowly suffocated to dead, with just enough time to write the killer's name in the dust in the carpet.

reply

It does make one wonder about Tex, though. With a free finger, he decided to scratch a name in the dust rather than poke a hole in the plastic bag around his head.

reply

Actually, here's another hole. The stamps have been stuck onto the envelope as if they were to be used as postage. A collector would never do this. It might have dramatically lowered their value, and certainly risked damaging them.

Edward

reply

Nothing like hiding them in plain sight.

reply

I love this movie...an all time fave. But everytime I see "DYLE" on the carpet, I cringe.

reply

Charles wouldn't necessarily have thought of this. He was on the run from the others and he had to "hide" the money in plain sight, so to speak. Besides, just because he could afford those stamps, doesn't mean that he knew anything about them and the proper way of caring for them.

~~
JimHutton (1934-79) & ElleryQueen

reply

Thats true, but then its weird Mr Felix didnt comment on this. This was the one thing that really bothered me. You should never put such rare stamps on an envelope, most possibly glue them on. As other mentioned, the value would have decreased siginificantly.

reply

Okay, maybe the moviemakers just had no idea. They wanted to come up with something creative for the movie, and they did...even though this introduces a major plot hole.

~~
JimHutton (1934-79) & ElleryQueen

reply

It's not a plot hole, just a goof.

reply

It sort of depends on exactly how rare they are.

I'm not a stamp collector, but I do collect coins, and a similar thing holds true. If an item is "rare" (meaning there are a few hundred), then damage does affect value. But if they are "RARE" (say, fewer than 50 in existence), they come up for sale so infrequently that it doesn't really affect the value--with the rarest examples the person buying it may only get one or two chances to buy it in his or her lifetime.

For example, the "real life" versions of the stamps are (according to the trivia section) the Swedish orange 3 skilling, the "Hawaiian Missionaries" 2 cent blue and the 81 para blue Romanian "cap de bour" on blue paper

There is one known example of the Swedish stamp, about 40 of the Romanian, and I couldn't find any information on the Hawaiian stamp

reply

I see I'm two years late to the party (Charade was just on today 01/13/2014 on Encore, I believe) but I thought Walter Matthau's character wrote "Dyle" on the floor so that Audrey Hepburn would suspect Cary Grant-she didn't know at the time that Matthau was Dyle--and would therefore call him (Matthau) with the information about the stamps instead of trusting Grant.

reply

I thought Walter Matthau's character wrote "Dyle" on the floor so that Audrey Hepburn would suspect Cary Grant-she didn't know at the time that Matthau was Dyle--and would therefore call him (Matthau) with the information about the stamps instead of trusting Grant.


You know, I never thought of it that way. I always assumed, as Reggie did, that Tex was pointing a dying (though surprisingly legible) finger at Alexander Dyle. But for Carson Dyle to have written it himself, knowing the conclusion Reggie would jump to, is even more interesting - not to mention more believable. Well done!

reply

that's an excellent point. There is no proof that the murdered man wrote "DYLE" as he lay dying. Dyle himself could certainly have written the name.

~~
JimHutton (1934-79) & ElleryQueen

reply

Yeah, I thought that was a possibility, since the real Dyle really needed to foster mistrust between Lambert and Four Names Guy.

reply