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Why is The Saint called The Saint? - + other Qs


Hi, I've seen the val kilmer movie years ago - and I had the tv on Fox Classics and i saw (most of) my first episode of the tv show (the episode I saw was in black and white and there were 3 older ladies getting blackmailed)
~ Would someone please explain how he got the nickname The Saint?
Also - does the show have him put on disguises like in the movie? or change his name? or are the film and tv show not really alike.
I saw half an episode today - I'm still trying to work out the general premise of the show - i read something about him being a theif - but he didn't steal anything in the 2 eps i've seen so far, so is there a basic formula to the show? if so - did it change much when it became coloured?

I liked the 2 eps I watched, but I usually like watching a series right from the start, so any info would be well appreciated. - (oh and i did try looking it up on wiki, but it didn't really answer my questions very well.)

Thank you.

Do you have monkeys in Scotland?
~No, but if we did we'd probably deep fry them!

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Simon Templar's past has always been shrouded in mystery. Some say he's a reformed thief making up for his past by helping others.Some say it's because of his initials ST. It's hinted at By Leslie Charteris himself in the Saint's debut novel MEET THE TIGER,but it's only a hint.It's a slight combination of the two. But it has absolutely nothing to do with Val Kilmer's movie which was as removed from the original character as you can get.Perhaps we'll a bigger taste of how it came to be in the new TV series being produced by the original Saint,Roger Moore, to debut,hopefully, next year. It will star Dougray Scott.



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I agree with NickKitt. The film really didn't have much to do with either the series or the books, although they are pretty different as well. Basically think of The Saint as an adventurer, a Robin Hood. In the early books he is something of a thief with a heart. He then is granted a Royal pardon (after thwarting an attempt to kill the King) after which his status becomes more dubious - he still commits the odd crime, but almost always against other crooks or other worthy parties, often taking a cut of their proceeds, or cons conmen. On occasion though, he seems to be directly employed, albeit temporarily, by the various forces of law and order. Generally the police know he is committing crimes, but usually the victims can't press charges, or he simply evades capture. His exact status and modus operendi tends to vary a bit from book to book, and its rather hard to pin down a chronology. In the early novels he has an unusually open relationship with a Patricia Holme, who I don't think was ever introduced in any other media, and who eventually disappeared (without explanation).

The series, being 60s TV, rather plays down the law breaking, and he's seen as a more general do-gooder and righter of wrongs, or even something of an informal detective at times. Also don't forget the 30s/40s film series, where he first appeared as particularly ruthless, then became more suave than action oriented.

I don't think the origin of his name is explicitly explained, but was really the author's conceit of both his actions and initials. He very occasionally uses disguises, but more often just used an assumed name, and more often than that everybody knows who he is. Again, its a conceit of the opening of every TV episode that everyone knows "the famous Simon Templar". In the books he was headline news for a while as a modern Robin Hood, but that seems predominantly in the early stories.

I'd try thinking of him as a modern Robin Hood, another story where the details change a bit but the broad strokes remain the same. Except for the 1990s film, which was really a pretty disgraceful cash-in on little more than the name. It pretty much discarded the premise of the books and series, even more than the Mission Impossible films did theirs. The argument is that the film is sort of an origin story, a prequel, but this is kind of making an excuse for the abandonment of the (admittedly vague) premise, IMHO.

The episode you spoke of BTW with the blackmailed women, sounds almost certainly to be The Gentle Ladies.

Hope some of that helps.

I hope NickKitt is is right about a new series (although I'm not sure about Dougray Scott - here's always been a lightness to the character, which seems wrong for him), but this has been rumoured so often that I'll believe it once they actually start filming.

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While the nickname "Saint" seems to stand in for his initials (S.T.), it can also be taken either ironically (he breaks the law every chance he gets) or poetically (he goes out of his way to help those in trouble and does what he can to bring down "the ungodly", as he likes to call them).

In the earliest books I've read, he and a group of like-minded friends saw themselves as crusaders for justice, doing whatever it took to make the world a better place.

However, the group soon split up and it mostly Simon and his on-again/off-again girlfriend Patricia Holm (what a shock it was learning about HER, as in the entire history of SAINT films and TV shows she's only ever appeared ONCE, and hardly resembled the Patricia in the books at all). For most of the 30's, Simon (sometimes with Pat, sometimes not) splits his time between helping those in need and pulling elaborate CON GAMES against criminals (often OTHER con men) in order to finance his "retirement fund" (something mentioned in a different context in the Val Kilmer movie).

By the 40's, Pat has mostly disappeared and he spends a lot of his time with a small-time crook-gone-straight, Hoppy Uniatz (who, like Pat, makes exactly ONE appearance ever on film, and Percy Herbert is NOT my idea of Hoppy!). In many ways, RKO's FALCON films are actually closer in format to the SAINT books of the time than RKO's SAINT films, since The Falcon tends to have A)a girlfriend, B)a sidekick, and C)a butler.

Templar continues his adventuring, helping people, and sometimes doing favors for British Intelligence. A bit of this can be seen in the film THE SAINT IN LONDON, where Templar hires an "ex"-pickpocket, Dugan, roams around with Penelope Parker (it was PAT in the original short story, and Sally Gray would have made a PERFECT Pat!), and doing a favor for the "Intelligence Service", something he can't tell Inspector Teal until the adventure is finally wrapped up. (This was rather similar to the situation in "ANGELS OF DOOM", except there, Templar was working-- in secret-- for the Police Commissioner, who didn't tell Teal what was going on, either!)



One could say that Templar on the 60's TV show should have been an older Templar who was mostly "retired" and down to just having adventures helping people... but Roger Moore is so YOUNG on the show, and they rarely if ever seem to explain exactly what Templar is "FAMOUS" for!

It's a shame Roger Moore didn't spend the 70's and 80's making big-budget SAINT movies, instead of doing a bad impersonation of "James Bond".

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he's kind of a respectable guy. the tv show was following the name created and featured before in cinema with louis hayward, george sanders

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Here on IMDB they say it's because the writer used to abbreviate his name as ST instead of writing it out and it makes sense to me. I couldn't bear to watch the Val Kilmer movie after being so in love with Roger Moore in the role when I was young. I think the black and white stories are better than the color ones.

They're showing it again where I live right after the Man from UNCLE and before the Fugitive. I could stay up all night watching and a few times have darned near done that.

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