MovieChat Forums > Goodbye Again (1961) Discussion > Did she actually love Philip?

Did she actually love Philip?


Toward the very end when Philip was leaving and she came running after him and was screaming "I'M TOO OLD"...It made me think that she really did love him but that she couldn't marry someone so much younger than her. I dunno..this movie was fantastic..really and truly but I was crying at the end..Philip is such a better person and I hated Roger. Paula deserved her fate at the end yet I can't help but feel horrible for her :(
Poor Philip though, he loved Paula so much; and I think Paula could've loved him if she wasn't so caught up in age..but that's my question to you all- what do you think? Did she really love Roger that much more than she cared for Philip? Because I do NOT think so. I think she loved Philip more and that was very evident in the scene where she didn't want him to leave and she was screaming after him that she is 'just too old and don't act so'.
Anyway- awesome movie and I hope I get a few responses.

reply

I thought Anthony Perkin's character was endearing. He seemed really devoted to Paula and Ives Montand seems good at playing playboy kind of characters (i.e. Grand Prix). But I wondered why Philip (AP's character) did not want to work when he was with Paula. Sort of showed Paula that no man is perfect? I dunno.
I really liked the movie.

J

reply

I just finish watching this movie today, it was ok.It seem like at the end of the movie she was right back were she started in the begining of the movie, being in a relationship were she is sad and lonely and missing communication with the other person.I can't tell who she loved more, because she ran back to Roger as soon as he said he needed her in her life, and she was crying and saying she was too old for philip when they broke up so I'm not sure.In my opinion I would of prefer for her to end up with Philip he seemed like he had more to offer and alot of love to give if given the chance, but i suppose she had to learn the hard way in the end of the movie.

-God bless my friends I hope my opinion made sense and gives us something to discuss

reply

I believe she did love Philip, but was afraid of the stigma attached (at that time) to an older woman/younger man relationship, as evidenced in the restaurant scene when they encounter his mother's friends and the child asks if she's his mother. Very sad ending, but predictable and realistic for the time. Today, I'd like to think that given a similar set of circumstances, the heroine would end up with the man who truly loved her, regardless of his age.

reply

I think in her way Paula loved Philip, but I think it was more that she loved how much her loved her and showed his affection and devotion. She needed to feel wanted which was something she wasn't getting from Roger. She 100% loved Roger, which is why she went back to him so easily. She needed him. And because she loved him so much, is why she just let herself be a victim of her own circumstances in the end. Very sad story, but very true to life even now. A lot of women feel that they are "too old" or too something to do better than what they have, and it's very tragic. I fell in love with Philip from the first moment I saw him and her attraction to him (or the idea of him) was blatant, but I figured that she wouldn't be able to stay away from Roger gradually throughout the film. She let it happen, and didn't really try to stop it. There are certain people who you know will never change, and Roger was so obviously one of them, and if she couldn't let herself see that, then I think she did desrve her unhappy ending.

reply

Saw this for the first time this morning on TCM. I am an older woman and I would keep Phillip and grab that special bit of happiness that pretty much only comes once in a life time. Who cares if she was older, I believe he said he was 25 and she said she was 40. That's only 15 years. Even if it didn't last forever, it would be better that that philanderer she married in the end. She was afraid of what people would say and you only go around once in this lifetime so forget about whether or not people think you should be with a younger person. You are not doing anything wrong and they should mind their own business !!!!!!!

reply

AMEN! I'm not an older woman or anything, but I think that was beautifully said.

reply

I agree with HoferPM-1. I've been in this situation, but was a divorced woman at the time, not with a "philanderer". There was a bigger age gap, than the movie's situation, and I took the risk. I didn't let the opportunity pass me by, to experience the love of my life. It was tough when we had to part a few years later, but like Piaf, I regret nothing.
I remember loving this film "Goodbye Again", back in the 60s and I still have my LP soundtrack album with the lovely but tragic theme music, and also the great jazz version by Diaahn Carroll. I'd love to buy a DVD of it too, but it seems we must keep waiting.

reply

I haven't watched this movie in a while so i could just be remembering this in a skewd(?) way. Also forgive my bad writing.

Anywho this is the way I interpreted the relationship. I always thought Paula and Philip were awkward together like she didnt realy know what to do with him and he seemed a bit to eager. I dont think it was an issue of age but maybe of maturity or experience. In the begining when trying to "woo" her Philip comes on like i said a bit to eager, almost stalking (for lack of a better word) her, but in a harmless way, of course. I think from the moment the relationship starts its obvious its not going to last. For her its an escape and also payback to her longtime lover Roger for his sleeping around with younger women. Roger is always insisting that Paula can do the same and she always says no, until she has this oppertunity with the Anthony Perkins stairing her right in the face. This also happens to be the time when she has just about had enough with Roger so she of course goes with it. During the course of Paula and Philips relationship i think she does grow to care for him more then she ever thought she. From the start though you just know if Roger swore off other women she'd be back with him in a second. Anyway, Philip slowly starts to become a "kept man", though through no fault of Paulas. Philip quits his job and really just focusses all his time on paula. This can be veiwed as a very emasculating thing and i think she realizes this and starts to also feel smothered by him. Which is the total opposite of how it was with Roger who wasnt giving her enough attention. So i think by that point she was very happy to get out although she would miss philip.

So thats how i saw it. I thought it was a good movie and i should deffinetly watch it again (hopefully things will become more clear)and just for the record if i was Paula i would dump both Philip and Roger and go find somebody else (preferably played by Cary Grant :)

reply

Haha, i love that last bit. Cary Grant is THE smoothest and most charming old Hollywood actor.

But in response to the question, I dont think she loved him. As she said, they both needed each other at that point in their lives and that was it. She was just too old to move on from either man so she settled for Roger.

I think i would've liked the movie better though if she ended up with Philip. I'm a hopeless romantic at heart and this movie had too much reality in it for me. She was way too hung up on age and repution and I wasnt the least bit impressed by Roger at all. Ending up with Philip or just breaking it off with both of them would've provided a better ending. After the movie i felt nothing cause the movie didnt seem to go anywhere. It ended with the way it began.

reply

[deleted]

"It ended with the way it began."

Which of course was the point; the cyclical nature of her life. She refuses to accept the facts and sticks with the loser every time, and Roger's behavior traces a similar path, always moving but never getting anywhere. The weaving of the Brahms piece throughout also reinforces this cycle. There's a cogent observation on class distinction worked in here too, as Philip, a young man who doesn't need to work for a living, finds in his love for Paula the piece that completes the puzzle, his raison d'etre for existing. Without her he literally wanders in circles, and with her he decides to leave a job he hates to do God knows what. I thought part of why she broke it off was because she knew it would make him follow through with that breaking free of the shackles that bind. But mostly, it was because she desired the safety Roger provided, from prejudice and snobbery and from having to begin again with a new love when she believes she is too old to give herself over to youthful passion but soon to be too old for marriage. This explains the closing shot of the masked frame emphasising her willful acceptance of her chosen fate.

reply

[deleted]

PHilip and Paula should have been together, Roger just totally RUbbed me the Wrong way and dont underStand why Paula would want to be around somebody so Boring, UnComfortable, and Selfish.

Philip on the other hand despite being so many years younger than Paula but was just Soooo Charismatic and LOVing of Paula and she let her AGE get in the way when they could have REALLy had such a WOnderful life together.

Now she will spend her WHOLE ENtire life being Misreable with Roger, HOPe it was WORTH IT PAULA!!!!

*CHeers***

- D
Billy K.

reply

I dunno, I've always liked this one but I see it as a tragedy of circumstances. Paula is afraid to break that social taboo of the older woman/younger man (and, sorry, I adore Bergman but she looked older than 40 here) and returned to Roger because he was her safety zone. She knew at some point Roger would always come back to her, he was "the right age", respectable, successful, whereas Philip was a dilettante, and a bit spoiled. I think she loved the way Philip made her feel and maybe even loved him in a way. But you have to admit that he was a bit immature, confident but a bit petulant and smothering, and what happens when he "grows up"? Does he become like Roger? You have to remember too that in France it's fairly accepted that a bit of philandering goes on in any relationship, so Paula's knowledge of Roger's trysts wouldn't have been as deal-breaking as they would in an English-speaking country where such things are seen as unacceptable behavior. Would Philip grow to be like Roger anyway? Should she trade Roger's success and respectability for what might turn out to be happier for awhile but ultimately turn into the same thing? I'm not saying that Paula was right in her decision, and I don't think she made the right one, but I am not French and having been born well after the time period of the film I don't have the same hangups about age differences. Nowadays we think, as long as both parties are legal and happy, no prob. But in 1961...it could be a very big deal. Society definitely had a problem with it, and apparently so did Paula. She was a product and ultimately a victim of her time.

reply

[deleted]

I watched the movie today on TCM and absolutely loved it. Depressing, sure, but it was great. Perkins and Bergman were incredible as usual. But everyone knew that probably already so to the question.
I think that Paula did love Philip, but not love in the sense that she was going to marry him and be with him forever. The age issue obviously was a large obstacle which she obviously had a problem with from the beginning.
If you recall the first time she gives any hint of romantic feelings for Philip, the letter she sends him in London, she tells him she sent it because she was sad and alone. I think after she sent Philip away she realized that she enjoyed the affection and attention he gave her and that grew into a caring oddly motherly type of love. She cares deeply for him and doesn't want to hurt him however, I think she couldn't help but see him for the young man he was. I don't recall her ever saying she loved him, she says she cares for him, and that her relationship with him has become more than just an "amusement" but not the romantic love that Philip was looking for. Philip was just there when she was going through a tough time.
For the record, I thought the ending was fabulous. Painfully sad, but if it ended any other way, it would have been any other movie.


I hope that made sense I kind of proof read as I went so it may or may not make sense.

reply

First of all, I should like to thank everyone in this thread for the courteous quality of their posts. It is more than refreshing to encounter this, a thread full of true film-lovers who are not here to be rude to each other. Bravo!

All I want to add to the discussion, is a reminder that this is, in essence, a French film; it is based on a novel by Francoise Sagan, the famous authoress of "Bonjour tristesse", which means "Hello, sadness". It appears to have been a joint French-USA production, but the theme, and the feeling of it, are very French. When it comes to love, and what can happen and is apt to happen with it, we get a French point of view in this film, and more specifically, a Francoise Sagan point of view.

In a French film about love, there may be a "happy" or an "unhappy" ending, but there will usually be a lot of insight, either way, into our human foibles and their effects on our search for love. They are like fables, in a way, containing lessons about mistakes we are apt to make. One film that had a happy ending was "Cousin, cousine" (1975), and one very famous and great film classic is "Les Enfants du paradis" (1946), which ends with two who loved but lost each other, separated by the crowd, which makes visual the sense of loss, beautifully. In that film, the female lead tells the male lead "love is simple", but he is not able to grasp that soon enough, and they both end up with others. By the very end of the film, the male has realized the truth of his beloved's words, but it is simply too late. The film ends with an emotion that is analogous to the punctuation of three dots...

People often study that which is central to their lives, endlessly, exploring the nuances of it. Another great film from France is "Le Diable au corps", "The Devil in the Flesh" (1949), which is about love between a married woman whose husband is away at war, and a very young man. In that one, the woman observes that he is such a man, in bed, but can be so like a boy when they are not making love.

I think that none of these films were composed just to make the audience feel good; I think, rather, that they were constructed to make us think, to make us wonder about life, and to help us face it. I think these films are like the famous French saying, "C'est la vie", "That's life".

And I have gone on far too long lol. I apologize, but I suppose it is clear that I love these films.

Ah, I forgot. The question was, did she love Philip? I think she loved them both, just differently. She obeyed the mores of her time, choosing what she considered the safer love, the love of which her society would not disapprove. Each man had something she wanted; largely because of her age, she did not have faith that she would find a new lover who had both qualities, so she chose to bear the ills that seemed more known to her, rather than "fly to others" that were unknown.

reply

Hi :) I'm the original poster and I just wanted to thank every one for their well though responses!


The Dark Knight= 10/10

reply

excellent response ubaranaa

reply

She cared for both of them, but her fear of growing old "alone" made her accept things in Roger that she knew she should not. She was living in denial, pretending that she did not want to be married, when it was the very thing she sought.
I believe she loved Roger; she also loved Philip, but she could not face society's possible reaction to the age difference.
She wanted outward manifestation of happiness and normalcy, instead of true, inward happiness, she would've found with Philip.

http://www.classicstarsonline.com
http://www.peterstrauss.net

reply

I think part of the problem was that Philip was looking for a mother figure, and Paula was looking for someone she could depend on, rather than someone who depended on her. When she was involved with Philip, she came home to find him asleep on the bed, not working, just waiting for her to get off work so he could be with her. He was far too dependent, even if Paula had been a woman who had the courage to break things off with Roger and stay away from him.

I feel that Paula was addicted to unhappiness. She knew Roger would never be faithful to her, but she stayed with him. She knew Philip would do anything for her, and was more than willing to marry her whenever she said the word, but she was still too hung up on Roger to work on her relationship with Philip.

Philip certainly needed to grow up and depend on himself, rather than making Paula the center of his existence. In that respect, he and Paula had more in common than either of them knew. They were both dependent on and clinging desperately to people who weren't right for them. Paula cheated on Philip (emotionally) just as Roger cheated on her. She was long accustomed to being in a dysfunctional relationship, so she didn't know anything about being in a healthy one, or making one healthy. Had she stayed with Philip, she would have needed to lay down the law and make sure he worked and didn't spend the whole day sleeping. He also needed a social life apart from her. She just didn't know how, though; she was used to being passive and letting the man in her life roll over her.

I like to think of Paula getting it together a year or so after the movie ended, and seeking out Philip. But she had missed her chance.

reply

Naillon, I completely agree with you. Thanks for the explanation.

reply

They did love each other, but back home in America people thought she was his mother. And when she died he hide her up-stairs in a rocking chair and he ran the motel down below. OH wait, that was another movie.

reply

You people need to watch this movie again, she was only infatuated with Philip and really in love with Roger. Watch the scene where they are dancing and Roger grasp her hand and the way they look at each other.
Also look how happy she is when Rogers says they should remain together the next day. Also when she was explaining to Philip that she was picking Roger over him, you could see she was concerned about his future and well-being, but no love. The, I’m old, was just her way of making him and her feel better about the whole affair.
In the end Paula realizes that Roger is the man she loves and picked and she has to accept his cheating to be with the man she loves.

reply

I think she loved Philip but he was a little over the top with his 'stalky' behavior and his juvenile and iresponsible, he seemed a little too old for boyish behavior but then this was a different time.

reply

She loved Philip, but she didn't have the passion for him that she had for rotten Roger. It's an age-old theme in films. WE (as an audience) know that Philip is the better man for her, but she still carried a torch for Roger and resigned herself to the scraps he tosses her way.


A similar theme is in the Brazilian film, Dona Flor and Her Two Husbands--except in that case the older man she had the passion for died, and she still saw him after remarrying a younger, better man, but who was less passionate by comparison.


"Well, for once the rich white man is in control!" C. M. Burns

reply