Major themes


I think we should have a talk about the major themes in this film. Obviously fate/destiny play a part, chance/circumstance. Identity, also.

reply

I think the Hitchcock-esque theme of death is apparent; the way that they are all very relaxed about crime and even find it comedic. And the nonchalance towards death leads to Charlie's second downfall.

You have no idea what I'm talking about, I'm sure. But don't worry... you will someday.

reply

Wow, the broadest post on an IMDb message board ever.

Anyway, the ending struck me as being about someone escaping real life through art. Obviously this is a big thing with Truffaut in general, so I doubt he'd object to this interpretation.

What's the Spanish for drunken bum?

reply

Anyway, the ending struck me as being about someone escaping real life through art.

Well the only thing he has left in his real life is his art and his art is playing a HonkyTonk Piano in a cheap bar. A lot like Tom Neal in the beginning of Detour.

Shoot the Piano Player is on a critical level about the personal integrity of an artist. Like as Edward Saroyan, great concert pianist, his character is a hack simply where he is because his wife slept with his backer whereas as a honkytonk anoymous pianist, he's truly being himself and uncompromised or so he thinks.

The film is about crime films, films noir since it's the spirit of New Wave films to talk about the cinema. So you have parodies of gangster films and cliches. Much of the humour comes from the fact that the hitmen are really funny jokers who nonetheless also kill. That the heroine likes to use expletives while Charlie is poker-faced. So the film is simultaneously a genre film, a crime-thriller, a gangster film, a film noir and a critique and deconstruction of that genre by changing the tone, the style and the payoff.

The main theme is loneliness, solitude, trying to and generally failing to deal with that. That's a key Truffaut theme.


"Ça va by me, madame...Ça va by me!" - The Red Shoes

reply



Yes, Shoot the Piano Player is a "hommage" to American low-budget crime dramas of the 50's, like "Detour" (specially "Detour"). You can see the influence of the Truffaut film all the way down to Pulp Fiction (with references to Kiss Me Deadly), with dialogues that have nothing to do with the plot (just like in real life). My first contact with Shoot... was through Pauline Kael's review on the New Yorker. She opened the world of the nouvelle vague for many of us, even people like me who did not live in the U.S. But I don't think a young person who sees this film for the first time will be as impressed by it as we were ("we" meaning people from my generation --the "baby boomers"). Many other great films, like the Third Man or Out of the Past, retain their original impact. What do you think?

reply

I didn't see any of those films when I saw Shoot the Piano Player and I am from this generation. So the film's impact is still there. It's very bleak but it's cool and funny at the same time.


"Ça va by me, madame...Ça va by me!" - The Red Shoes

reply



I ment that many of the tehcnical innovations in Shoot the Piano Player have been used repeteadly by many filmakers since the film came out. "Pulp Fiction" is one example. So I believe the film does not look as technically revolutionary as it did 40 or perhaps 30 years ago (by technical I mean the experiments with the use of film language). I'm glad some of the impact is sill there. Some of the other filsm I mentioned (The Third Man etc.) have strong plots and retain their entire impact. Shoot the Piano Player is impressive because of its technical wizardry but the plot is kind of weak. The first half is much better than the second half.

The other day I saw The 50,000 of Dr. T with my grandson (it is one of the few commercial films we can call "surreal"), but it has dated badly. On the other hand, all my grandchildren enoyed A Hard's Day Night which still is ahead of its time.

reply

Having read the novel Shoot the Piano Player is based on, Down There, as well as a number of other David Goodis novels like The Blonde on the Street Corner and Dark Passage, I would say the one recurring theme amongst all his stories is a fall from grace--guys who were once rich and successful who are now down and out. However his protagonists, like Eddie/Charlie, seem to have willfully victimized themselves as a lot of times the ability to change their lives for the better is well within their control--and if not, extraordinary circumstances arise so that they do have a chance--yet they ultimately choose to remain leading lives of poverty and suffering (it drives the hardboiled lamentations that comprises Goodis' unique prose).

These narratives also seem to parallel the life lead by the author himself--Goodis was a successful writer and Hollywood screenwriter who left a life of relative glitz and glamor to return to a more ascetic life in the slums of Philadelphia. Goodis churning out dime novels in Philly, just like Eddie/Charlie playing honk y-tonk piano in a dive bar, is being true to himself. I guess they're both kind of masochistic...

_____
Suddenly, thud! My mind tottered like a jinkyboard in a windstorm...

reply

Too schematic at a way at looking at this film. Shoot the Piano Player is not a conventional film in any sense of the term.

What the film is about is personal will and solitude, about Charlie Kohler always being too late and one step behind all his life and unable to find satisfaction at any moment of his life. It's the tragedy of a very passive man. That's why Truffaut cast Charles Aznavour in the role because of his very Keatonian features.



"Ça va by me, madame...Ça va by me!" - The Red Shoes

reply

I agree with those who have noted references to genres, particularly film noir of the forties and fifties. But I do not think that is its major feature, as it were. The primary theme is alienation, without question, and one cannot miss that life feels to the main character like he had no real control over events. Thus one must add chance and the unexpected to the mix.

Another noteworthy element is the treatment of Charlie's own art. I think Truffaut, like many other filmmakers, is very interested in the personal connection they have to their own art and craft, where that connection places them and affects their own search for more general meaning. But for probably a number of reasons it is "better" to examine some other art form than filmmaking itself. Here we have music and music performance to serve as an analogy. Is there a message, or a metaphor, in his wife's effectively prostituting herself in order to get ahead in the business to what is required to get ahead in the filmmaking business? Perhaps not so much overtly on that point as in the more general sense of satisfaction in one's work. By that I mean whatever benefit Charles received in his career as Saroyan, not only did not hold up as it were. It was not as real as his direct and personal connection to the sheer act of playing as the film closes, in a much less auspicious setting, to say the least.

Of course what undermined the connection in his Saroyan days was made brutally clear by Therese, and shown to be not real at all. And later, when Lena more or less assumes that Charlie will want to, and can, go back to his Saroyan levels of success, by his look Charlie shows Lena is missing a good deal of what he had learned from prior experience.

Well, in Lena's defense perhaps one could argue that Therese's death and the reasons for it have led him to learn perhaps the wrong lesson. It of course does not necessarily follow that the specific arc of events that were involved in his Saroyan days as a performer was necessary. We can sense that Charlie is not only not sure he wants to return to that level of success. I think he doubts that he could, at least not without hte kind of help that Therese provided for him. But again, we do not know that to be the case.

Finally the whole dynamic of having two separate identities is an obvious theme. Other examples in film range from Kim Novak's character in Vertigo to Viggo Mortenson's in A History of Violence. What is common to them, I think, is in some cases more overt than in others, Mortenson's performance being a fairly overt one exploring how the differences on those characters raise questions of identity and true meaning. Aznavour's performance by comparison on the surface seems to suggest that Edouardo and Charlie in fact are personas that are not all that different. But then recall the photography sessions, the interviews, that followed Schmeel's gentle accusation that he is not giving the press enough to work with, meaning he has been too reticent. In them we see Edouardo presenting a subtly different face, in fact arguably not all that subtly, and clearly attributable to his comfort as well as the expectations of his audience, in terms of what is possible for someone in Saroyan's place.

Charlie by comparison is expected to be withdrawn and timid, and lives up to those expectations.

I suppose the film is not the most coherent film, as a bit of criticism here. But it deserves credit for taking risks, and I suppose that in itself is also a theme. The two deaths and the way the film takes for granted that his brothers are stuck in a life of crime could be grindingly nihilistic, and certainly fatalistic. Yet Charlie keeps on going, with the help in large part of his music. And it should be noted the caring of others around him.

reply

But where is Charlie going to find happiness? He is indirectly, some might even suggest directly, responsible for the tragic deaths of the two women who have loved him, first Thérèse and then Léna. Is he really going to spend his life bashing out tunes for low-life customers in a louche bar, livened only by sessions with Clarisse, the glamorous whore next door? In the beginning we are introduced to an anonymous man in the street who claims to be happy, to have learned to love. But will Charlie, with the millstones of his past and his profound emotional reticence, achieve such simple serenity?

reply

Charlot,

Sorry I did not see this until now.

I first of all do not think Charlie thinks he was directly responsible for the death of either woman. Indirect in this context means not morally responsible, which is the level at which it would matter.

I suppose the silver lining of seeing the world as more chaotic and random than mechanistic and intention driven is that moral responsibility for actual resulting events is attenuated, perhaps to the point of a complete absence.

So, I don't think their deaths will necessarily prevent Charlie, in some categorical sense, from ever finding happiness, or as you suggest the more pratical sense of some modicum of serenity. For myself I think serenity itself has for many an idealized context, but in reality is itself a relative term as one might realistically hope to achieve it or, quite simply, experience it.

How much happiness, how much serenity, can someone have in pursuing their art with limited financial reward? I suppose it depends on the person, and how rewarding they find the pursuit. As a general matter, I don't think we can or shoud say that financial reward above the achievement of some level of comfort is necessary to realize happiness. Whether in the particular case of Charlie it will be enough for him to do what we see him doing as the film ends? I think that is open to interpretation.

reply

I think Charlie feels some responsibility for his wife's death. He tells himself this is his only chance, that he alone can save her and if he walks out on her now she will be alone forever and it will be his fault. He says this and does it anyway. It would be strange for him to go through this mental process at the time and then entirely dismiss the situation later.

I wondered if this film was an influence on Christopher Nolan's Inception, in which the central character is literally haunted by the guilt of his wife's suicide in a scene extremely reminiscent of this film.

The film deals with multiple themes and issues, artistic integrity (and authenticity in general) is certainly one of them, but equally present is the force of relationships past and present over our lives. However, I am extrapolating his guilt more from what happens at the time (and potentially from his broken shell of a life and emotional distance towards women) rather than from any specific scene or dialogue that implies this.


Ten Things you didn't Know about Batman Begins
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=npNxZrERSH8

Boardwalk Empire Review (no spoilers)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DWNdJTU8Bos

reply