Sinister Undertones


Just watched this film - and there were a few moments that made me raise an eyebrow, these may just be a product of my modern impure mind but i figured i'd point them out anyways.

1) is the treatment of the animals - especially the ostrich which is clearly real and is lassoed and ridden and chased by the whole of the family and never really seems to happy about it...though this is a 60's thing - i seem to remember in Thunderball they actually shot sharks with harpoons for the action scenes.

2) the line where the two robinson boys are talking about girls, and if they'll find any their age, the other replies something along the lines of: 'by the time we find girls we won't care HOW old they are' and they both laugh very hard.

any contributions to this list? or to any old movies with dodgy moments like this.

reply

I saw the film yesterday too, and also noticed the exact same things you point out.
Im glad it wasnt just me who found it rather sinister, particularly the 'girls' quote!

reply

[deleted]

This is true, the animals are exploited mainly for comedy value, they did do that more back in those days; however I have to say, this movie is much LESS cruel than the original book by Johann Wyss!! I recently bought the book for my 8 year old son, as I had loved the story I had read as a child. However I think I must have had an abridged version as a child, because this book shocked me! I'm not squeamish or easily shocked, but these characters seem to be hell-bent on shooting or stabbing every single living creature they encounter on the island! I think the idea is, if we can't domesticate it, we can eat it.

Imagine, reading this to an 8 year old...

"We stole quietly to the ledge where the animal lay, but instead of a crocdile, it turned out to be a sort of lizard called an iguana.
"I'm going to shoot him", whispered Fritz.
"No, son. It would be hard to pierce that scaly coat. If you make him angry, he could be dangerous. I have a better idea."
I cut a stick from a bush and tied a long string to it. Then I knotted the loose end and cautiously tiptoed toward the iguana, who was snoozing peacefully in the sun. When I was very near to him, I began whistling a lively tune, an air from my native Switzerland.
The creature smiled in his sleep. Suddenly he opened one eye and raised his head to hear the music. As he looked all around, I tickled him gently with my stick.
To my joy the iguana flipped over, stretched himself flat on his back, and undulated with his tail, as if he was overwhelmed by the music. He raised his head again, and I threw the noose over him.
"Draw it tight!" cried Ernest.
"Strangle him!" yelled Jack.
"No!" I said firmly. "Why make him suffer any more than he has to?" And quick as a flash I plunged my knife into him. Soon he was dead."

Quite repulsive isn't it? There are many more examples, the family just go around killing everything. It's probably pretty indicative of the attitudes back then, but for it to be hailed as a classic children's story is a bit much I think. I certainly prefer my son to watch the Disney adaptation. It isn't politically correct at all, and is also fairly cheesy in places, but I think as a movie, it tells a nicer story.

I do wonder how they get those scenes with the animals. I can't imagine it being possible without the animals being very distressed. It was the same with circuses back then too I think. Animals were used merely for humans' enetertainment, to hell with their feelings.

As for the comment the boys made about not caring how old the girls where, I didn't pick up on that, and I've watched this movie over and over. I just thought it was an example of how desperately they wanted to see some girls, and their joke about it. I took it to mean they would settle for an old lady perhaps. I guess nowadays things like child abuse are brought much more to the fore, and it springs to mind when you hear comments like that, but I never took it that way before.

Only WISE people can see the Emperor's new clothes

reply

I think the boy's reference was meant to be just the opposite - in other words they wouldn't care if they were OLD women.

Keep in mind this film didn't just need to get past Hollywood censors - but also it had to pass the more stringent Disney black suits.

reply

Dont forget that this movie was made well before the time that the Humane Society was allowed on set to make sure that the animals were not harmed during the filming.

reply

[deleted]

sleepeejane: "This is true, the animals are exploited mainly for comedy value, they did do that more back in those days; however I have to say, this movie is much LESS cruel than the original book by Johann Wyss!! I recently bought the book for my 8 year old son, as I had loved the story I had read as a child. However I think I must have had an abridged version as a child, because this book shocked me! I'm not squeamish or easily shocked, but these characters seem to be hell-bent on shooting or stabbing every single living creature they encounter on the island! I think the idea is, if we can't domesticate it, we can eat it.

Imagine, reading this to an 8 year old..."
-------------------------------------------------------------------

I'm fairly certain Swiss Family Robinson (I almost typed Lost IN Space) was ot written for children, or with children in mind.

So many of the old things are believed to be tame and more suitable for children, even 20 years ago, that that period and lifestyle was naive or something.

Bugs Bunny cartoons were made for adults as well.

The Flintstones was a primetime cartoon.

The funny thing is seeing things like Fritz the Cat completely vanish, because younger generations don't care to watch such an old cartoon and feel that it is simply being exploitive in its sexuality.

Expect the same thing to happen with The Simpsons. Already Beavis and Butthead, also intended for a mature audience, but kids were watching it, has disappeared.

if it turns up 20 years or so from now, it will be as an oddity and nostalgic.

Disney could have made a musical movie about Jack the Ripper and either it would be sneered at for being too tame or there would be shock at how explicit the movie was during one of the prostitute's murders.

reply

Does everyone neglect the scene during which Fritz rescues the Zebra from quicksand and a certain death at the hand of several hienas (spelling?) and a cheeta?

reply

I swear, it takes an idiot to watch something and not put it in context or start up a fuss over 40 years AFTER the film was made. Do you not realize ostriches have been ridden for years in contests, in fact they are still ridden. Please, take a chill pill and if you have children stop acting like an over protective principal when you watch movies. And about the girl remark, do you think only you can think for yourself? Take it in context. Remember, at that time in history very young teen girls were married off quite frequently because the life span was much shorter. Ok, maybe you have taken your chill pill and can settle down, I sure hope so.

reply

Also, successful ostritch breeders have found that they first need to overcome one fairly crucial problem. Female Ostrichs tend to "imprint" on their human owners - which makes it kind of hard to get them to mate with male ostritchs - they'd far rather mate with humans (if asked!?) Given that... merely riding on one seems kind of no big deal (at least, from the ostritch's viewpoint)

As to the tiger/dog fight... there were a slew of movies around the same time that featured the same (tame) tigress. Wasn't her name "Temptress"? I recall her swimming in a jungle pool with Dorothy Lamour in one movie (at the time it was widely believed that tigers couldn't swim)

reply

They never killed or even hurt any animals, the just scared them off, including the sharks and the anaconda. I supposed they scared the chickens and fish to death before eating them. It's sooo '50s Disney, but its innocence is its charm.

And critters weren't mean to the family, either. No crocodiles, cobras, scorpions, mosquitos (or malaria or dengue fever). And it always seemed to be perfect weather.

reply

gn65283: "I swear, it takes an idiot to watch something and not put it in context or start up a fuss over 40 years AFTER the film was made.

Please, take a chill pill and if you have children stop acting like an over protective principal when you watch movies.

Ok, maybe you have taken your chill pill and can settle down, I sure hope so."
---------------------------------------------------------------------------

How about that bottle of chill pills be passed in your direction?

There was no need to refer to anyone as an idiot or make such a comparison, nor to conclude anyone was causing a fuss.

Next time you come across a post such as this one that gets your dander up that you have to resort to such name-calling, try to do what I do and just let it pass as someone else's observation or opinion.

If I found a post under The Little Rascals that felt there was something discriminatory in only one girl and only one black kid, I would find it very easy to just move on to another post or topic or site, without having to call anyone a name.



reply

Watching this film for the first time, I was struck by the open sexual jealousy between the two older boys when they first realise that 'Bobbie' is a girl. It seemed strong for a Disney - maybe nobody noticed at the time!

reply

To Margaret Phillips - That was one of the main story lines in the movie - the jealousy between ernst and fritz over roberta. imagine... two teenage boys on an island and all of a sudden a girl comes along - OF COURSE their's going to be jealousy and competition among them... its human nature. Plus, it seems that Fritz being the older one seemed cocky and full of himself.

reply

[deleted]

god iam just sick of all the politicaly correct weirdos about , man for crying out loud its a family film ffs!
friggin oddbods like you who have screwed this world to death and if you ask me , if you seen anything sexual in the remarks made by the lads, then thats damn right pervy and shame on you , go get a life !

reply

apache 1-1: "god iam just sick of all the politicaly correct weirdos about , man for crying out loud its a family film ffs!
friggin oddbods like you who have screwed this world to death and if you ask me , if you seen anything sexual in the remarks made by the lads, then thats damn right pervy and shame on you , go get a life !"
-------------------------------------------------------------

Yea, hostility, whether in the form of name-calling or out and out insults, is very sad and unfortunate, but what are we to do?

Why can't we just go 'I disagree' and let it go at that without having to resort to personal attacks.

And then we have the gaul to say others are bigots with their hate.

reply

Of course they noticed!!! Do you think we lived in the dark ages?

Strong for Disney? Not by a longshot! He loved adventure, scary movies and those young in love.

He scared the pants off a lot of us with the wicked witches in Snow White, the kidnappers in Pinoccelo, shooting Bambi's mother, etc. etc. In fact at Disney World they have a very large exhibit about all the bad people in Disney's cartoons and movies. \\

My Lord--remember--this was in the sixties--you know like--all that free love and stuff.

reply

OMG...The line about not caring about the womans age was not sinister or inapropriate at all. Young men like girls and make comments much worse that that. The point was simple...they liked women and missed not seeing them...nothing more to it than that so stop trying to analyze it to death.

The treatment of animals. Could have been much worse and if any of you has ever watched Stagecoach w/ John Wayne the treatment in that film of the horses would really upset you. I doubt any of these animals were killed during filming...this happened often in westerns. If you have complaints about it you need to go over to that board.

In the end I thought this film was so so. Very cheesey but the youngest boy was an idiot. If I was on that Island he would not have lasted long. Especially when he whistled for the dogs and gave there position away to the pirates. Like I said if I was on that Island that kid never would have had that opportunity...he would have had an "accident" before that opportunity.

reply

Why can't people just enjoy the movie for what it is. Your mind must be a twisted to come up with this age thing, it never ever crossed my mind and I've seen several times. Also animals die everyday including the ones corraled up in lots to be slaughtered for you to eat at McD's everyday. Yes I eat meat that's what they were put here for. Do wear leather shoes?

reply

Well I'm a vegetarian personally, so I don't like to hear about animal abuse .. but even I am not worried about what may or may have not happened 45 + ago. My motto is that life is both good and sucks at the same time and then you die and hopefully have a nice afterlife hahaha. anyway

This was one of my favourite childhood movies on the Disney re-runs in the 80's. I taped it and then taped over most of it except for the fending off the pirates scenes. I remember being 8 years old and obsessively watching that 30 minutes or so several times a week. Ah, the strange habits we have as kids.

reply

As somebody already said, I'm pretty sure that the line about girls meant that the boys would be happy with women much older, not much younger.

reply

[deleted]

[deleted]

the only sinister undertone I caught was when they told the girls to hide because they know what will happen to them if they are found by the pirates

reply

If one wasn't looking for sinister undertones, one might understand that the Robinson boys were implying that they might be on the island for a very, very long time and women that seem old to them at the time may seem the right age by the time they get off the island.

reply

What cracks me up is how people find it horrible that they wanted to kill animals in the book! Umm.. hello! Stranded on a desert island with nothing to eat.. of course they're going to be killing animals! They need to survive. They probably don't recongize most of the plants since it is a foreign tropical island.. and they'd have a much better chance of survival by eating animals, than by eating foreign plants that could have the possibility of being poisonous. That being said, I love this movie! It's a Disney classic and one of the finest! :)

reply

The book was pretty graphic, though, and lots of times they killed animals that they weren't planning on eating. The part where they trapped 40 apes in a sticky substance and beat them all to death wouldn't have played well on the big screen.

reply