MovieChat Forums > Santa Claus Discussion > The Santa Claus Defense Topic

The Santa Claus Defense Topic

posted 12 years ago by Pencho15
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Ok. I just written a review in wich I gave my opinion of this film and in wich I defended it against some misguided critics it has received, however the space limit of the review and the need to keep it focused on what that text is supposed to be left me with a lot of things to say about this movie, so I have opened this discussion to explain some of the most common complaints about the film, I'll write little by little so reading this at once doesn't get to tiresome.

First of all let me give you a small summary of what I wrote on my review. In there I said that I don't consider Santa Claus a good film, it is indeed bad, but I think its placement as one of the bottom 100 movies in history is unfair due to three things:
first most of the ratings have been given based on a dubbed version in english that was made with little respect to the original. Second most of the complaints I've read are given based on the fact that this Santa Claus has a lot of differences with the U.S. version of the character, as if this was unique and inalterable when it is not and different countries, in this case Mexico, have all the right to give the character aspects of their culture. Finally this is a children for very small kids, maybe up to five years, it was not really meant for the enjoyment of adults or even childs out of the Kinder Garden.

I think ratings should be given based both on the original version and considering this is a movie that comes from a different cultural tradition thant that you might be used to. And since many if not all the critics I have read or heard are due to one or both of the things mentioned above then I want to explain all I can about this movie, wich comes from my country hoping that you people judge it more fairly than it has been so far. And if you have given it a 1 maybe after this you'll reconsider.

[–] Pencho15 12 years ago

For starters two things that I have written in my review and that I consider specially important as many negative comments come from these parts of the plot of the film.

THE DEVIL AGAINST SANTA CLAUS? Yes, this comes from a Mexican tradition called Pastorela which has its origins on the colonial epoch and it still exists today; pastorelas are simple plays whose ultimate end is evangelization, they show Satan trying to stop small groups of shepherds that are on their way to worship the newborn Jesus at Betlehem. In modern times different cultural elements like Santa himself have been added to the original tradition, but the root of the pastorela is religious and hence the important part of the devil. Christmas is a religious celebration and that is still very important in catholic latinoamerican countries.

SANTA IS A FRIEND OF JESUS? Why,of course. I thought this to be common knowledge but apparently it isn't so You just have to watch a documentary, read a book Or simply visit Wikipedia and you'll learn that the origin of Santa Claus is in Christianity and in the figure of Saint Nicholas. It wasn't útil the XIX century when the world famous version of the character started to take form and it didn't do it in a massive way until Coca-Cola used the character as part of an advertising campaign when it became the marketing figure it is today. In the United States you may have a very defined idea of how this character must be, but can't you accept that in other places it evolved in a different way closer to it's religious roots? Well that's what happened in Mexico and the film itself says in the introduction that Santa is no other than Saint Nicholas, that means a Christian saint. Now in catholic countries saints are very important figures, they serve as intermediaries between God and men, in this case rewarding kids that are good and punishing those that aren't. So as a Christian saint it makes perfect sense that Santa prays to Jesus and it makes much more sense that the devil is trying to stop him; he does this not just because he can, but because making Santa fail will prevent that he spreads his Christian message

[–] Pencho15 12 years ago

SANTA CLAUS LIVES IN OUTER SPACE Mmm. That's not true, I reffer you to the previous post, the mexican Santa mythology is closer to it's christian origins that the U.S. Santa. He is in fact Saint Nicholas and therefore he lives in heaven alongside God and all the other thousand of saints. That is the reason for his palace to be surrounded by clouds, it is heaven. And since no one knows where heaven may actually be the director decided to place it somewhere beyond the moon, for that reason as Santa approaches earth you see both our planet and our satellite from outer space (I remember a Simpsons chapter in wich Homer Simpson and Buzz Aldrin are astronauts that have letters from children to God so having heaven somwhere beyond our planet in space must not be completely crazy for you or is it?).

THERE IS NO NORTH POLE No, once again this picture belongs to a different cultural tradition and some things you consider inalterable in Santa's mythology are not. Our Santa never lived in the North Pole because he lives in heaven and while if you ask today many will tell you that he lives in the North Pole that is due to the fact that globalization and Hollywood movies has slowly replaced our traditions, however that wasn't the case in the 50's. Today in Mexico many children (those that are not in contact with mainstream movies) still send their letters to Santa in a balloon so they reach heaven, and some of them are even addressed to Baby Jesus.
By the way if the english dubbed version says that Santa's palace is above North Pole then that is a lame attempt od the ditributor to merge the U.S. and the mexican tradition, the original film never says anything like that.

[–] Pencho15 12 years ago

SANTA IS CREEPY This is one of the most common critics I've seen for this film, and I don't understand why is this said, wich means I don't really have arguments to defend the film since I don't know what I am defending it against. If someone could give me an argument to explain me why is he creepy I would like to hear it. The only thing I see when I have seen this film is a guy with white beard and a red suit, how is that any different from any other Santa in the movies?
In one comment I hear he has a scary Ho Ho Ho. That can be only balme to the english dubbed version, since in the mexican film I don't recall he ever does that classical laughing, if that's the case and that's the reason to consider him creepy then it is another misguided judgement since it is not fait to judge the film based on a poor dubbing. What would you think if I told You "It's a Wonderful Life" its a terrible film because the voice they gave James Stewart in Mexico makes his character sound as a moron. That's not fair is it? Well then don't judge this film based on the english voices.

THE REINDEERS ARE CREEPY Ok. I admit it, the reindeers are not pretty, but I don't think they are such a big deal to destroy the picture based on them. As you probably know in this film Santa's reindeers are not actual animals, instead they are white toys that start working after the red suited man winds them up. But now consider this, this is a low budget film and in Mexico there are no real reindeers, so how was the production supposed to get some real animals in order to get a couple of shots done, it would have been very expensive and not worthy to get a group of reindeers in another country and take them to Mexico, also the low budget made it impossible to make something fake look remotely as a real reindeer; making the animals toys was simply a solution to solve this issue without spending much and besides it allowed them to make up a story about the animals dissapearing with sunlight giving Santa some danger to make it more exciting. Mayv¿be it was not the best solution, but I am sure anything else they could have come out with would have been equally criticized.
I've also heard the reindeers make weird noises, they don't do any noise at all in the original version so once again that is something to blame the U.S. distributed movie for and not the original wich should not be rated that bad for other people mistakes.

[–] Pencho15 12 years ago

THE FILM HAS RACIST STEREOTYPES It does indeed and that is something quite bad by today standards, if I see something like that in a film made today I would get annoyed inmediatly, but in this case I first take notice that this is a film from the 50´s when this was not so bad. I would not defend this if the streotypes where made with an ill intention of discriminating a race or a culture, but that is not the case; the only intention of the cultural stereotypes shown is to make it easy for the small children that this film is aimed for (again it is not for anyone over five) to identify the different countries depicted. If you ask me I don't see much difference between this children and those shown in the Disney attraction "It's a small world after all" wich doesn't seem to bother anyone.

THE AFRICAN STEREOTYPE IS REALLY OFFENSIVE There is no way to argue against that, it is, but again showing them like they do had no mean intention, the image of Africa people had on that time was shaped by american movies and comics wich showed this black stereotypes and thta was the only image mexican children got, I don't like to see it either, but I blame it to ignorance, not to racism wich is not present on the film. A proof about the previous assertions is that the mexican kid himself is a steretype, if this potraits of culture had any derogatory end then they would not include mexicans, you don't really think that a mexican production would show mexicans in a way that was considered humilliating either by public or producers do you?

[–] Pencho15 12 years ago

COAL iS A STUPID PUNISHMENT FOR CHILDREN I have read comments about how stupid it is for Santa to leave pieces of coal to the bad children of the film. This is also a tradition in Mexico that comes from Spain and that I suppose we share with every other country with a hispanic culture; every child in Mexico is told that if he is good he will receive toys from Santa (or the three wise men january 6) and if he is bad he will receive pieces of coal. I don't know how you handle things in the United States (are bad children simply ignored by Santa?) but in this case the piece of coal is a proof that Santa watched over you and that he considers you bad, it is a way to show you that a change in your attitude is needed (if nothing was left kids could simply say hey maybe Santa does not exist and that's the reason for me to have no presents).
And if you think it is a absurd punishment then it is because you have seen no children filled with hope to find presents under the three suffer the dissapointment of finding coal, I knew one and he was heart broken, it is actually a very cruel punishment.
Again this is a different cultural tradition, don't say it's wrong because it is not yours, that's close to discrimination.

[–] Pencho15 12 years ago

SANTA ONLY CARES FOR MEXICAN CHILDRENS This critic is wrong and it is very annoying. First let's see why it is wrong: during the end of the movie there is a moment in wich Merlin and Pedro are together checing Santa's progress with the presents delivery, there they say that he has already finished his task at Asia, Africa, Europe and that he only remains to visit some parts of Mexico, therefore if you simply pay attention to the simple plot of the film then you'll realize this is absolutely untrue; a further proof that this is false is simply the presence of all those children that live with him and that everyone criticizes. If he ignored every country except Mexico then there would be no russians, japaneses, germans, africans and boys from the United States in hos workshop.
With that settled let me tell you why its annoying to find this kind of complaints about the film. I suppose that if you complaint about these then you expected to have Santa delivering presents to people in your country, you would have liked to see him in the United States or in the United Kingdom or wherever; well sorry to dissapoint you but this film is aimed to mexican children and those kids expect to see Santa delivering presents in their country not anywhere else; its a low budget film they couldn't afford to expend money traveling around the world just to shot a couple of scenes.
Also, there are hundreds of U.S. produced films about Santa Claus, I ask you, in how many of them is Santa shown delivering presents to childrens in Mexico, South America, Africa or anywhere else but in the United States? Very few of them. Why? because those films are for an american public and they want to see Santa delivering presents in their country. As far as I know no one criticizes about those films saying "apparently Santa only cares for american childrens". It is understanded that if the film is from that or any other country then the action occurs in that place. then why the heck it is an issue that a mexican Santa spends the film in Mexico? If this is a valid argument to rubbish this film then it is also a valid argument to critically destroy any christmas film.

[–] dphinds 12 years ago

Bravo, Pencho... I didn't see any replies here, so I want to be the first to thank you for your work. I enjoyed reading your defense, as misguided as it might be.

-Dan

[–] preppy-3 12 years ago

Thank u Pencho for explaining why this movie doesn't work for us Americans and how Mexico views Santa Claus. However I still think it's a bad movie and the reindeer are nightmare-inducing.

[–] Pencho15 12 years ago

I also think its bad, just not as bad as the comments say. Thanks for letting me know someone read and liked this.

I want the daily poll at the IMDB not at Facebook.

[–] grifftrain2000 10 years ago

To call this a " bad movie" simply misses the point. If its compared to " Shaw-shank redemption " , pulp fiction, or gone with the wind, it certainly would be called a bad movie. But that is not what it is. It's a simple good triumphs over evil movie aimed at kids. The fact that its incredibly campy and disturbing adds to its strange beauty. A demon named pitch who demonstrates his evil using interpretive dance? That's funny. The amateurish equipment Santa uses to spy on children? It's classic.
I guess what I'm saying is lighten up and just enjoy the movie for what it is

[–] Starduster 10 years ago

I guess what I'm saying is lighten up and just enjoy the movie for what it is

Ok, but what IS it?

[–] grifftrain2000 10 years ago

I guess you just read the last sentances of posts

[–] tseybert 9 years ago

I would much rather watch "Santa Claus" than "The Shawshank Redemption."

Janet! Donkeys!

[–] ElectricWarlock 11 years ago

I agree that the criticism against this film is undeserved. The only reason people hate it is because it was on Mystery Science Theater 3000. People just automatically assume any movie that appeared on that show must be unwatchable, when in reality, many of the movies on the show aren't even that bad. Many movies that are on the Bottom 100 list of IMDb are on there only for the sole fact that they appeared on Mystery Science Theater 3000.

This movie had a fascinating concept and an interesting story that was much different from any other Christmas movie I've seen which made it a breath of fresh air. Many Christmas movies I've seen are basically the exact same plot for the most part, just with different characters so I appreciate this movie because it was unique and didn't seem like anything else I've seen before.

Come, fly the teeth of the wind. Share my wings.

[–] Pencho15 11 years ago

I agree with you Mistery Science Theatre 3000 is the cause for many bad movies that aren't really that bad become trashed. It's a shame for them to suffer that while many other things that are actually awful enjoy better ratings and little criticism.

I want the daily poll back.

[–] oknar1977 10 years ago

This movie is so weird that it's actually cool -
Satan is due to film color of 50s weirdly artistically redish. Movie is not boring, it's so weird that it's worthwhile to watch, given it's first sci-fi movie from Mexico (Keaton 1947 flick not including), it's ridiculous - it's made for small children, but it's really not that bad. Poor kids are presented to public, something that american movies of that time forbad. Those huge lips. Everything is so weird, as if aliens made a movie about Santa claus. Narrator's voice from such educational USA movies of that era is unintentionally funny. I liked it infact, I gave it 5/10. It's really not that bad as they say-

[–] Just_Alex 10 years ago

This is a bad movie. Not awful, not an all-time turk. Just a silly, kinda annoying, bad movie.

Somehow, IMDb seems to be the place where this movie is dragged in the mud, with a 2.2 average, and therefore listed in their bottom 100 list. Other sites like Allmovie gives this movie a 2/5 (or 4/10 converting to the IMDb rating system), Rotten Tomatoes users gave this 2.8/5 (5.6/10), FilmAffinity.com (an european site) has a 4.5/10 average. All those scores seem to be much more fair and accurate.

This movie is, as you say, a mexican movie made for the mexican audience, that's why one of the main criticisms "It's too scary", doesn't make much sense. In Mexico, the Devil is presented in many forms, tales, and traditions, as a very popular and graphic representation of evil. Just like the U.S. presented the communists as the go-to-villains in their cultural manifestations. That's why a mexican kid won't be as scared of Satan (as presented in this movie, mind you) as a young international viewer.

Another two criticisms that feel hollow to me (and hypocritical) are "Santa Claus IS NOT like this" and "too many stereotypes". Are you kidding me? First of all, Hollywood has taken dozens of international folk figures and heroes, and then applied the Hollywood make-up and change much of the original depictions, resulting in their own spin of characters/heroes/tales from all around the world.

Yes, this movie has a lot of ugly stereotypes. It's from 1959. Are we going to pretend that Hollywood never used stereotypes to depict a foreigner? Just for a quick example, I give you the Looney Tunes. How about Speedy Gonzalez. That is a very stereotypical (albeit funny) depiction of the mexican culture, and nobody seems to mention it. At least not the same people that complain about Santa Claus.

Bottom line, yes, it is a bad movie, but I have seen hundreds of movies that I would put in that Bottom 100 list (this is not one of them), yes it has ugly stereotypes (very common back then ALL AROUND THE WORLD), yes it's not the U.S. Santa (nor the U.S. King Arthur is the real King Arthur, nor the U.S. Emiliano Zapata was like the real Emiliano Zapata), but it's not one of the worst movies ever made.

_______________________________________________________

My ratings:
http://www.imdb.com/user/ur5531916/ratings

[–] Pencho15 9 years ago

I'm glad to find people sharing some of my thoughts.

My travel blog http://www.caminossellados.com

[–] Pencho15 9 years ago

Another Mexican film: La momia azteca contra el robot humano, has entered the bottom 100, that one is much more deserving of the position than Santa Claus, as are other Mexican movies I could tell you about but that are rarely seen and have little votes.

My travel blog http://panchoporelmundo.blogspot.com