MovieChat Forums > Marjorie Morningstar (1958) Discussion > Only Successful Men Are Worth Relationsh...

Only Successful Men Are Worth Relationships?


This movie seems to suggest that if a man is not successful, he's not worth it. Is that a common Jewish attitude?

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Unfortunately, I'm afraid it's a common _human_ attitude; fortunately, not universal. But does the movie suggest it, or just make the point that life sometimes goes that way?

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The movie leaves out many important points that Wouk made in the book. In the book Noel Airman is very cruel to Marjorie. He is unable to commit to anything or anyone. He just wasn't unsuccessful he also used people - borrowing money he never intended to repay, etc.

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I don't think that Noel is not worth a relationship because he is unsuccessful, I think it is because he lacks any direction and he is all talk. Those are not very attractive qualities. However, he is incredibly charming--the kind of charming that is very magnetic. He even says that he doesn't finish things he starts. Women are attracted to stability.

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Yes, he is awful to Marjorie in the book, but I also think Marsha Zelenko is cruel to her as well. Marsha used her a lot and was another person who borrowed money without paying it back - or paying it back as an excuse to see Marjorie and use her further. She's catlike about Marjorie and Noel and pushes Marjorie together with him. The name Airman (his pun on his actual surname, Ehrmann) suits Noel - his character is airy, like his dreams of greatness. Unfortunately, he cannot achieve them.



"...truth against the world..."

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Yes obviously the film is thematic of this. It doesn't mean men like Noel literally but he's certainly a metaphor for men lacking in anything. While Marty is representative of the stable partner.

As far as what Jews value Marjorie's mother is quite clear what she really wanted for her. First the Dept. store would-be heir, and next the MD. Most parents would feel this way but for Jews it would be the ideal.

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I'm not Jewish, but yeah. Why would I be attracted to an unsucessful man??

RIP Heath Ledger 1979-2008

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That's not the impression I got from the movie.

Noel Airman was a man who emotionally did not want to grow up, handle responsibilities and pressures, and come to grips with the real world.

The scene where he freaks out and shouts at and insults the very people who just agreed to back his show, because of what he perceives as an offense to his own "artistic sensibilities", is the perfect example of his immaturity. This is further emphasized when he starts crying and whining in front of them like a spoiled child.

That's, in the end, who he was: a spoiled child who never emotionally and mentally grew up and learned to handle stresses, pressures, and at times, compromise. He treated Marjorie with consistent resentment, accusing her of "riding" him when all she did was fall in love with him.

Noel didn't want to grow the heck up, "man up" as they say, and grow a pair. He whined and simpered because life was not as specifically perfectly structured as he would've liked it to be, and basically threw little temper tantrums all throughout their relationship because of it.

The end is particularly telling....Noel at Summerwind, playing his ONE song, surrounded by a bevy of naive, adoring girls. This is how he wants life to be--a beautiful dream where he doesn't have to face adversity or challenge of any kind.

That's why in the end, Marjorie really comprehended the man she had been so entranced with. She knew that as long as his character was that fragile, nothing she could've done would have made a marriage work.

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It is a common Jewish, Non-Jewish, Japanese, Mormon, Atheist, French, Russian, Chinese, Hungarian and Gypsy attitude.

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"Why would I be attracted to an unsuccessful man?"

So it's not about the person they are, but about what they have and how well they have done? Shallow and disgusting.

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Seems to depend on the individual as the ending can be openly interpreted. The line we hear shortly before the finale, where Wronkin said two people who are in love sometimes can never be together, seems significant. Clearly Marjorie loved Noel but conflict would always cause friction between them. Maybe Marjorie realised this.

"I'd rather be hated for who I am, than loved for who I am not".

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disgusting yes but not shallow. I teach 6th 7th and 8th grade. They better be successful. It's a rough world out there.

suzycreamcheese RIP Heath Ledger 1979-2008

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JEWISH??? What a bigot! I'd say the sentiment that "only successful
men are worth relationships" would be very American, as in "The American
Dream." And can one blame Marjorie's parents? Joe Airman was a total
LOSER as a PERSON. I would've stopped at nothing to prevent Marjorie
from marrying such a self-absorbed, self-pitying jerk.

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Joe Airman was a total
LOSER as a PERSON.


First his name isn't "Joe." Second he wasn't a total loser at all. He had issues certainly and maybe they would prove toxic to any relationship he was involved in: but he wasn't abusive, a drunk, a fellon et al.

I'm sure there aare lots of Airmans on the fringes of show biz. They are dreamers but not horrible human beings.

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Joe Airman was a total
LOSER as a PERSON.


First his name isn't "Joe." Second he wasn't a total loser at all. He had issues certainly. Maybe his ego would prove toxic to any relationship he was involved in: but he wasn't abusive, a drunk, a felon et al.

I'm sure there aare lots of Airmans on the fringes of show biz. They are dreamers but not horrible human beings.

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Right, Toots. He was self-absorbed, childish and a drunk. Would YOU
have supported a daughter's choice to marry this pathetic camp-counselor
loser?

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