Alan and Clara
Why was it that Alan was no good for Clara? My impression was that he was a momma's boy, or, in 2006 terms, gay. Is this way off base?
shareI don't think you're off base at all; that was my impression as well. I think it was 1950's code for what we'd simply call gay today.
It's never too late to be who you might have been - George Eliot
Yep - someone being gay is an underlying, unspoken factor in a lot of Faulkner's stories.
shareThe impression that I got was that he loved her more like a sister than a potential wife and didn't want to hurt her feelings by not returning her affection.
Arrr! Math be hard! Let's go shopping!
I've seen this film a couple of times, and whenever I had the thought that Alan was gay, I just said to myself, "Well, you can't possibly think that just 'cause he's a Mama's boy he must be gay." But now that I've read these posts, I realize that it wasn't simply that he didn't care for Joanne Woodward in that way, because he was never looking for other women either. He didn't appear completely repressed or socially dysfunctional either. He wasn't neurotically shy or have some underlying personality inhibition that was completely disabling either. So--he must have either been gay or completely disabled psychosexually as a "Mama's boy," living with his Mommy and taking no part in other aspects of life. There is no fleshing out of his character to indicate that he was so neurotically paralyzed as to be unable to forge a life for himself independent of his mother; he does have a relationship of sorts with the Joanne Woodward character, but he doesn't have any other relationships in the film, as I recall. Ergo, it's a tossup: either he is emotionally paralyzed, lives with his mother, without many other relationships, unable to achieve a sexual relationship of any kind, but not necessarily gay, or, he is gay, in the closet and celibate. There are straight men who turn out to be Mama's boys, because of a repressive upbringing they had, unable to seek out a suitable woman, and remain with their mothers. I think that does happen. A man living with his mother past the normal age of doing so, doesn't necessarily have to be gay. In this movie, it's possible that Alan is gay, but why then doesn't Joanne Woodward character realize that? Usually women pick up on this. After all, the film doesn't take place in 1700, or 1800, or even 1890 or 1915. It's the 1950s, I think. You would expect the woman will be able to tell that this guy--who never comes on to her, never kisses her, or tries to make advances--is gay. I don't know. I guess I would tend to think he's gay. Any comments are welcome on this board. I'd be interested to know what other people can pick up on in the film.
Allen Roth
"I look up, I look down..."
Remember the scene where Will Varner goes to see Alan and his mother and then smashes the table with his hand and screams that he's a "sissy"? That's the big "ding-ding-ding!" clue to Alan being gay (being a momma's boy doesn't automatically mean a guy is, but that's where I thought they were going with it). Calling someone a "sissy" was pretty much the only way you could call out someone's gayness in a movie--at least in the 50's/60's it was.
Now, you could just call him "gay" and be done with it. How times have changed!
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Fun and Failure: both start out the same way
Well i'm really torn on this. The relationship between ALan and Clara is certainly the most interesting relationship in the film for me, only because it isn't so clear.
Several times in the move, references are made to the effect of: "Well Clara, how long are you willing to wait [for Alan]?"
I kinda take that to mean that Alan is psychosexually repressed by his mother. At the beginning of the film, Alan is sick sitting in a chair speaking to Clara, and his mother abruptly disrupts them and (for no good reason) basically tells Clara to take a hike... she politely leaves but its clear she is annoyed and Alan is distressed. I think this scene is the key.
I'm leaning towards he isn't gay. And the references in the film to "how long is Clara willing to wait".... I take that to mean how long is she willing to wait until his mother dies... because that's the only way she and Alan can ever be together. His mother controls every part of his life and doesn't want a woman to take her away from him, and he's obviously feeling guilty about leaving his mother and wont ever do it.
It really isn't clear whether he is or he isn't... I'm curious to hear how you guys interpret the scene I mentioned above, that's an important scene.
I kinda take that to mean that Alan is psychosexually repressed by his mother. At the beginning of the film, Alan is sick sitting in a chair speaking to Clara, and his mother abruptly disrupts them and (for no good reason) basically tells Clara to take a hike... she politely leaves but its clear she is annoyed and Alan is distressed. I think this scene is the key.
You're right on target with this scene, although you leave out a key element--Alan's mother doesn't disrupt Clare and Alan and tells her to beat it for no good reason; she comes in exactly when Clara kisses him. It's obvious that she represses him in some way, even if she is unconscious to the fact, and even if he allows it.
That being said, I'm siding with the others here who think that Alan is gay. In this day and age it isn't fair to assume that being a mama's boy automatically makes a man gay, but back then, that was usually the way Hollywood got the idea across. The general idea at the time was that homosexuality was a mental disease, a perversion, something akin to incest or the like. Even today, when a guy is gay a lot of people come to the conclusion that his mother coddled him too much in his youth. I took the "How long is Clara willing to wait?" questions to mean, "How long is she willing to wait to marry him?" I never saw Alan's mother dying or living really having any bearing on their plans. share
Somerset 25, okay... I can't remember when Alans mother first enters that scene. But, if I recall correctly (and I believe I am), Alans mother enters that scene to tell Clara to take a hike BEFORE the kiss. Clara, then annoyed that she's just been told to leave (and that Alan makes no effort to prevent it)-- begins to leave and as she does she makes a final act of defiance by kissing Alan on his cheek-- it's a "screw you" to Alan's mother (whose standing right beside his chair).
I interpret the scene as a fight over Alan. Clara wants Alan and so does his mother... and they are fighting over him. Meanwhile, Alan is reduced to spectator because he has affection for Clara, but absolute loyalty to his mother. He isn't willing to side with either, he's paralyzed.
I'll cite another scene which leads me to believe Alan isn't gay. The dinner table scene. Here, where everyone is present-- Alan is Clara's dinner date for the evening and is sitting next to Clara's father, Will Varner (Orson Wells). Orson is drunk and is giving Alan a hard time, he's insulting him and attempting to degrade him. Alan is a stalwart character, he is by definition a perfect "Southern Gentleman". Alan doesn't get upset, but does defends himself.
The battle at that dinner table reveals deeper insight into the relationship between Alan and his mother. Orson makes reference that Alan never knew his father, (who abandon him and his mother)... and that it's just him and his mother living there alone. I think this scene establishes that Alan was raised mainly by his mother, that he has been both father and son to his mother. Thus, the overprotection by his mother who never wants anyone to take him away and why Alan (again, the perfect Southern Gentlemen) won't ever leave his mother.
What do you think?
It was not unusual at all for a man to live with his mother at that time if the father was gone. Even if they didn't share the same home, he would have helped provide for her. It was actually seen as rather bad form and ungrateful, if he didn't. Alan makes the comment at the dinner table that his mother is alone. So, Alan has a sister Agnes and a mother to take care of. It seems that their family was at one time rich and now down on their luck, living off the inheritance (what is left of it).
Even so, most mothers would have welcomed a daughter-in-law and the prospect of grandchildren. The usual arrangement would have been that the mother would have lived with them or at least nearby. Alan's mother obviously does not want any daughter-in-law.
So, Alan has enough integrity to realize that this would be a terrible future for Clara. Whether he is gay or not, his mother has crippled him badly and he knows it. Agnes seems to have avoided this, at least partially.
I think Alan was gay. I did not realize it right away, because it is played real subtle. However, it is also clear that Alan's mom had the apron strings tied real tight.
Clara saw what she wanted to see, because Alan represented everything her father wasn't; sensitive, cultured, educated and from a well respected family. Considering how lovely and passionate Clara was, it seemed like any healthly normal male would feel attracted. Also, her family was rich (new money maybe) but a rich and powerful force in the community nonethless.
Alan like Clara, but he did not love Clara and he lead her on for years. Maybe he did it to cover up the truth, who knows? Six years is a long time to lead someone on. At least Clara finally confronted him.
He could have handled Varner's confrontation differently, the man disrespected his mother and broke their furniture. Our last glimpse of Alan is watching him climbing up the stairs of his home and he is walking funny (no pun intended).
Just to weigh in... Doesn't Ben say to Clara something to the effect that if she's waiting for Alan, she's got her money in the wrong bank. This certainly implies that at least Alan is percieved by others as being gay-- which in the south, and Faulkner's world, that's as damning as actually being gay. There is definitely a need for the men to be, as Varner puts it, 'stud horses'-- that is something that Jodie is also struggling under. Anyone who doesn't fit this manly man role is certainly an outcast. There is so much sexual repression in this movie that it does make sense for Alan to be a repressed homosexual. I guess I just assumed he was without really questioning it. It was wonderfully acted all around....
Chinaski
I don't hate people. I just like it a lot better when they're not around.
I have to agree in a lot of respects to your comment about Alan not being gay.
The scene where Will is rudely taunting Alan about his closeness with his mother brought about this dialogue when Alan replies that his mother is widowed and relies on his help and support.
Will: " Your Daddy ain't dead! He just up and ran off years ago."
Alan: " The result is the same. My mother is alone!'
Will: " She's not alone. She has you,Alan--she sure has you!"
Alan: " I try to to my best!"
Will: " Not around her you don't!"
I think that Alan's mother has emotionally neutered him. I have often wondered if Alan's father was more like a better-mannered counterpart of Will Varner, and that Mrs. Steward was determined that neither of her children were going to take after their father in anyway--- it is clear that she is a controlling person who has no intention of letting them escape her control.
Mabel Anderson gave a memorably nuanced performances in the few scenes allotted to her. It is also clear that poor Agnes has been given short shrift in the family heirarchy.
Agnes seems to have a more healthy and down to earth interest in life. As she phrases it to Clara, her goals are to " have a strong, healthy man to love. To put children in a bath, make ice cream, have supper ready for her husband, and think about what the night is going to bring!" Agnes is a normal girl with normal needs and hates the wasted non-life she has to endure with her family.
I kept wishing for Agnes to meet that "strong,healthy man" before the end of the movie, and perhaps even elope with him to show a counterpoint to Alan's being trapped by his possesive mother!
The general idea at the time was that homosexuality was a mental disease, a perversion, something akin to incest or the like.
And actually, in a lot of film and literature in the time, incestuous feelings and homosexuality seem to go hand in hand. The main example I can think of is Bruno in Patricia Highsmith's Strangers on a Train (the mother in the book is quite different than in the Hitchcock movie), but I know there are others. share