Ca C'est Magnifique
I mentioned this in the comments section, but does anybody see "Ca C'est L'Amour" and "C'est Magnifique" as virtually the same song?
shareThey are not the same song. They might be written in the same spirit of love and contain French words, but the music, the lyrics, the key changes, and the harmonies are different.
shareThe lyrics are extremely similar. They follow the exact same pattern of "Love is wonderful. It's tragic when you fall out of love. It's wonderful when you fall back in love again." Not only do they both use French words, they use very similar-sounding French phrases for the titles and to end each section of both songs. In fact, the SAME exact word is used in both: "c'est", and that word is stressed on the same accent in both songs. The rhythm pattern is virtually identical in both instances. Both melodies pretty well follow the same cadence. While the notes may not be exactly the same, "Ca C'est L'Amour" is essentially "C'est Magnifique" in a minor key.
shareNope. If you play C'est Magnifique in a major or minor key, the notes still aren't the same. Ca C'est L'Amour is in a minor key for the first two A sections until the last three notes of the second A section, and in a major key for the last A Section until the last three notes of the song. Again, they are both Porter songs and may have a similar theme, but they aren't the same song "C'est" is a common French word. If one were to follow your logic, "If I Loved You" and "If Love Were All" would be the same song because they are both ballads and they both contain the word "if". The spirit and the subject matter are the the same - yes - but the songs are different.
Reread both my posts please. NOWHERE did I say they are the exact same song. NOWHERE did I base my premise solely on the fact that they contain the same word in the title. NOWHERE did I say that the notes were exactly the same. My contention is that Ca C'est L'Amour is essentially a reworking of C'est Magnifique. The similarities are too numerous to ignore. Cole Porter was not being very original here. And there is no "may" about them having the same theme. They definitely do have exactly the same exact theme, and that theme follows the exact same story pattern. Look at the lyrics side-by-side, and you'll see what I mean.
C'est Magnifique -- When love comes in and takes you for a spin. Oo la la la. C'est magnifque.
Ca C'est L'Amour -- When suddenly you sight someone for whom you yearn. Ca c'est l'Amour.
C'est Magnifique -- When ev'ry night your loved one holds you tight. Oo la la la. C'est magnifique.
Ca C'est L'Amour -- And when to your delight she loves you in return. Ca c'est l'Amour.
C'est Magnifique -- But when one day your loved one drifts away. Oo la la. It is so tragique.
Ca C'est L'Amour -- Then dawns a dreary day, Your darling goes away. And all is over you are sure.
C'est Magnifique -- But when once more she whispers, "Je t'adore". C'est magnifique.
Ca C'est L'Amour -- But oh when she returns and loves you as before, You take her in your lonely arms and want her even more. Ca c'est l'amour. Ca c'est l'amour.
Look at the use of the word "when" that starts nearly every phrase of both songs. Look at the third line of each song. They both use the words "day" and "away". In C'est Magnifique the "loved one drifts away", and in Ca C'est L'Amour the "darling goes away". Extremely similar. I would be willing to bet that Ca C'est L'Amour may have been originally written for Can-Can, but eventually evolved into the far superior C'est Magnifique, and Porter just pulled his old number out to use for Les Girls rather than write a new one.
You are so wrong. Shockingly wrong! You couldn't be wronger. In the Broadway Musical version of "Can Can', Lilo, the shows star, sings "Cest Magnifique" as part of a musical scene with another character who sings his part following hers. The song is not a ballad in the show. It is a "charm song" containing a more pronounced and upbeat rhythm. It was written as such. "Ca Cest Lamour" WAS specifically written for an actual scene. Taina Elg sings it in a scene that was completely different from Lilo's, and the song serves a different purpose. In terms of song, style, sequence or presentation - they are not the same song or meant to be performed in the same way. NOWHERE, have you proven your point. NOWHERE! and I mean NOWHERE doo dah!
You keep deliberately missing my point and building up strawmen arguments that have nothing to do with what I said. "Charm song" or "ballad" is completely beside the point. How the songs are performed is completely beside the point. Tempo and rhythm are also completely beside the point. As a case in point from "The Music Man": "76 Trombones" and "Goodnight My Someone" use the same melody, yet one is a march and the other a waltz-ballad.
The content of the lyric and the melodic line in each song have striking similarities.
And contrary to your opinion, both songs are sung in very similar situations in Can-Can and Les Girls. In Can-Can, Pistache sings her song to seduce Aristide. In Les Girls, Angele sings her song to seduce Barry. The only difference is that the Can-Can scene is a more humorous one, and the Les Girls scene is more romantic.
It is entirely plausible that either "Ca C'est L'Amour" was a more romantic reworking of "C'est Magnifique" to fit the scene in "Les Girls" or that it was written originally for "Can-Can" and reworked into "C'est Magnifique" because Porter realized that something different was needed in the situation. I am not saying that this is gospel truth. I am merely pointing out the plausibility of either argument.
For some reason I seem to have touched a nerve with you here. Cole Porter was a wonderful composer and lyricist, but he was by no means perfect. Just as with any other songwriter, he wrote songs that run the gamut from great to just okay to not good at all. "Ca C'est L'Amour" falls into the "just okay" category. It has a nice melody and serviceable lyrics, but it is by no means one of Porter's best.
"You keep deliberately missing my point and building up strawmen arguments that have nothing to do with what I said. "Charm song" or "ballad" is completely beside the point. How the songs are performed is completely beside the point. Tempo and rhythm are also completely beside the point. As a case in point from "The Music Man": "76 Trombones" and "Goodnight My Someone" use the same melody, yet one is a march and the other a waltz-ballad."
That was done intentially to further enhance the organic feeling of the score. Goodnight My Someone" and "76 Trombones" are wonderful songs and the melodies are similar, but not exactly the same. The harmonies, though, are identical.
Still, this has little to do with the Porter songs. You seem all mixed up.
"The content of the lyric and the melodic line in each song have striking similarities."
Why must you keep insisting that they are the sameYes - but they aren't the same? One did not replace the other.
"And contrary to your opinion, both songs are sung in very similar situations in Can-Can and Les Girls. In Can-Can, Pistache sings her song to seduce Aristide. In Les Girls, Angele sings her song to seduce Barry. The only difference is that the Can-Can scene is a more humorous one, and the Les Girls scene is more romantic."
The same can be said of Jerry Herman title songs and R & H inspirational songs, but "Hello, Dolly" isn't the same song as "Mame", and "You'll Never Walk Alone" is not the same song as "Climb Every Mountain".
"It is entirely plausible that either "Ca C'est L'Amour" was a more romantic reworking of "C'est Magnifique" to fit the scene in "Les Girls" or that it was written originally for "Can-Can" and reworked into "C'est Magnifique" because Porter realized that something different was needed in the situation. I am not saying that this is gospel truth. I am merely pointing out the plausibility of either argument."
It's also plausible that Golda Meir liked to eat anchovies.
"For some reason I seem to have touched a nerve with you here. Cole Porter was a wonderful composer and lyricist, but he was by no means perfect. Just as with any other songwriter, he wrote songs that run the gamut from great to just okay to not good at all. "Ca C'est L'Amour" falls into the "just okay" category. It has a nice melody and serviceable lyrics, but it is by no means one of Porter's best."
My nerves are intact, but I do enjoy proving you wrong each time you post.
The quality of both songs is really an opinion and not a fact, but they are both certainly well written in my estimation. I don't understand why you continue to harp on this as much as you do. Let it go. You were wrong. They are different songs. Let it go! Jeepers!
Again with the straw man argument. The point in mentioning the songs from "The Music Man" was to show and example that differences in tempo and rhythm have nothing to do with similarity between songs. Please answer THAT point instead of making up one of your own to knock down.
The lyric and melody for both "C'est Magnifique" and "Ca C'est L'Amour" do have striking similarities. I've demonstrated the similarities in the lyrics in a previous post. I would do the same for the music, but not possible in this medium. Your argument so far to this has been "No they don't". Please demonstrate that they don't. Back your assertion up.
Instead of being dismissive about the plausibility of the arguments I made for the possible origin of "Ca C'est L'Amour", show me where they are NOT plausible. Do you have empirical evidence to the contrary?
You haven't "proven" anything other than that you have no clue how to argue your points. You build up straw men and state opinions, and think you've "won" your argument. If you can't make a substantial argument, then there's no use continuing this discussion after this posting.
I never thought of this as an argument, but at least you agree that I "won". Of course I won, because you and I both know that I am most certainly right. This isn't my first time at the rodeo buddy. I thiink I've proven my point admirably. Unfortunately, you've been unable to see that. If you don't want to continue in what you consider to be an "argument", don't continue. You know I'm right and your unnecessary defensiveness is getting a bit tiring.
shareYes, the great Miriam Applebee who knows everything there is to know thinks she "won" because I refuse to continue a discussion with someone who says I'm "wrong" but comes up with absolutely nothing to support that. Yeah, you "won". Whatever.
shareWe at last agree. It's not only that you are a quitter, you really have nothing else to contribute that would help you to prove your points. Your behavior is not becoming at all. Not at all!
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