MovieChat Forums > Hellcats of the Navy Discussion > Just saw Hellcats on TCM for the very fi...

Just saw Hellcats on TCM for the very first time!


All in all, I thought it was good. Silly as Patti Davis thought? Sure, but it was likable as well. (And Patti, if you are reading this, I saw this alone and not with someone else! ).

Watching a submarine movie where the two senior officers were at odds, reminded me a lot of RUN SILENT, RUN DEEP with Clark Gable and Burt Lancaster and even the sci-fi VOYAGE TO THE BOTTOM OF THE SEA with Walter Pidgeon and Robert Sterling. But then I realized that HELLCATS actually predated both films!

Truth be told, I’ve only seen one other Ronald Reagan film, THE WINNING TEAM, where he played St. Louis Cardinal pitcher Grover Cleveland Alexander, and he wasn’t bad in that one.

Of course, HELLCATS is famous for starring Ron and Nancy Reagan, in their only feature together. Here, Reagan plays the square-jawed, no-nonsense captain, but he is really not a tyrant to his crew, although some may see him as that (refusing to pick up one of his divers at sea when a Japanese destroyer was quickly approaching their sub, etc.). In the end, if the part had called for what Reagan portrayed, then he did a solid job. Nancy, I thought, really didn’t have much to do here except to converse and comfort her man. Watching the beginning, I thought this was going have a love-triangle story, but that quickly changed.

For all of the talk about Ron and Nancy, I thought the movie ultimately belonged to Arthur Franz, as Reagan’s second-in-command, and in many ways, the film is really looking at it from his point-of-view. Franz chastising his captain for making questionable decisions, then ultimately having to make those tough decisions himself was quite predictable, but Franz made it work anyway (he grew up as Captain Reagan would note).

The special effects I thought were pretty good, although I have this feeling some of it was taken from other pictures. Certainly, the scene where a sea rescue plane is searching for survivors of Reagan’s sub, and ultimately spots them…..I could have sworn I saw that before! And yes I did! That clip was taken from IT CAME FROM BENEATH THE SEA. Tricky Charles Schneer for inserting a scene from one of his earlier pictures and hoping that no one would notice. But, hey, this movie nerd did! (Pounds his chests!).

It is interesting to see war movies like HELLCATS, RUN SILENT RUN DEEP, and even HEAVEN KNOWS MR. ALLISON, during this period where Hollywood had to walk that certain fine line. By the late 1950s, Japan was one of the big, if not the biggest foreign market for Hollywood. While HELLCATS had the Japanese as the enemies, it never really stereotyped them or smacked of racism, like we would have seen had this movie been filmed during the war itself (GUADALCANAL DIARY comes to mind).

Some other notable tibits:

You had Admiral Nimitz introducing the film. It probably would have been equally interesting to have him playing himself during the strategy scenes later on in the movie (which was ultimately played by Selmer Jackson).

We see Thomas Browne Henry as the Board of Inquiry Chief. I guess when he was doing these movies for Charles Schneer, it was probably stipulated in his contract that he play a military figure!

While Ronald Reagan played a submarine navy captain, his predecessor, Jimmy Carter was actually in the U.S. Navy and on submarines from WWII to the early 50s.

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I'm watching it now on the westcoast with my wife and neither of us are laughing. It IS one bad movie, almost as bad as Plan 9..... almost.

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Hey Big G! Finally remember to check your review of HOTN.

The stock shot from It Came From Beneath the Sea wasn't the only stock footage used. Memory doesn't serve too completely at the moment, but I do recall one of the stock shots briefly inserted during the opening, about Japanese shipping. It was a black & white reproduction of a color shot from John Wayne's 1955 movie Blood Alley; the shot was of the ferry boat in that film entering Hong Kong harbor with refugees from a Chinese village (actually, it was all models in the Warner Bros. tank). There were others. And the music was all from the Columbia library -- the end theme was from The Caine Mutiny, which Columbia re-used in a number of its B films in the 50s.

Nathan Juran was an Academy Award-winning set decorator but not an especially good director. Here, I thought he did one of his poorer jobs -- most scenes are very stilted, in my opinion. Juran did better with fantasy stuff, such as The Seventh Voyage of Sinbad and First Men In the Moon. Did you know (I'm probably repeating myself) that Juran directed two low-budget sci-fi films in 1958 using a pseudonym? "Nathan Hertz" -- his first and middle names. The films were Brain From Planet Arous and...Attack of the 50-Foot Woman!! Guess he didn't want to make his association with them widely known and thereby harm his career. But if you ask me, they're much more enteratining than Hellcats, which fundamentally isn't too interesting. Not terrible, just predictable and bland. Stilted, as I said. Much of this due to the badly written script.

Long ago Nancy said, "I must say, the love scenes in that movie were by far the easiest I ever had to do." Well, of course. But they were embarrassing -- that "I wanted to make sure you were Mister Right" line is wincingly awful!

RR always thought of this as his final film because his next one, the 1964 remake of The Killers, had originaly been intended as one of the first made-for-TV movies. But Universal thought it was too violent and so switched it to a theatrical release (= real movie) at the last moment. But Reagan's insistence seemed based more on a sentimental impulse, since Hellcats was his only movie with Nancy.

I'm really surprised you've only seen this and The Winning Team among Reagan's 54 movies. He did a number much better or more entertaining. See, you should've paid more attention to TCM last month when they showed most of 'em!! Anyway, may I make a few suggestions? Knute Rockne -- All American, Kings Row, Desperate Journey, The Hasty Heart, Storm Warning, The Last Outpost, Prisoner of War, The Killers and, yes, Bedtime for Bonzo. These aren't necessarily all great but they are either entertaining or informative about aspects of his career. And a few of his early supporting roles in big films, such as Dark Victory and Santa Fe Trail. If you ever get the chance to watch That Hagen Girl, do so -- Reagan himself called it the worst film of his career, one from which it never recovered. He begged Jack Warner not to make him play in it, but Warner insisted. It co-stars Shirley Temple as a young girl in a small town who becomes embroiled in gossip and scandal when it's alleged that Reagan is her father! Reagan's real girlfriend is played by none other than "Miss Moneypenny" herself, Lois Maxwell, in her brief Hollywood sojourn before moving onto England. Guess which one Ronnie ends up marrying?

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Yup hob, only two Reagan movies. Perhaps I should've paid more attention to TCM last month, but hey, I'm sure they will show other Ronald Reagan films, maybe even later this year.

HELLCATS also reminded me a lot of John Wayne's THE FLYING LEATHERNECKS, with really the only difference being that one took place at sea and the other in the air. Like HELLCATS, Wayne's movie has the two senior officers at odds, with the superior (Wayne) making sure his Exec (Robert Ryan) does not get a command of his own, because he believes he can't make the gutsy calls. Then predictably, Ryan has to make the tough calls, once he's in charge.

Like I said before, HELLCATS was OK. Not nearly as good however as RUN SILENT, RUN DEEP, because both Gable and especially Lancaster were much superior actors, me thinks.

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I think TCM has virtually every one of RR's films (probably half a dozen or so they don't), so you'll never find yourself far from a Ronald Reagan movie there.

Actually, I saw a few for the first time myself -- his Bs from between 1937-40, including his "Secret Service" movies in which he starred as Brass Bancroft, two-fisting his way amongst crooks and counterfeiters, spies and agents. They were pretty fun, hardly great but solid second features. It was doing those films (I think four in all) that led Reagan many years later to refer to himself as "The Errol Flynn of the Bs", which frankly was elevating his standing and the films' quality quite a bit.

Interestingly, even TCM didn't run That Hagen Girl (the one with Shirley Temple) in March...I suspect it was so bad they didn't want to speak poorly of Reagan. Too bad they didn't show his last film, The Killers -- it was the only time RR ever played a downright villain -- he even gets to slap Angie Dickinson so hard he knocks her to the ground -- and he was really very good playing something other than his usual good guy...though reportedly it made him feel uncomfortable doing so. I read years ago that Reagan had signed to do three made-for-TV movies in '64 or '65 but when he moved to run for Governor withdrew.

Now, as to Hellcats, I think it's much inferior to Run Silent, Run Deep and most other contemporary sub dramas in great part because of the way in which the crew was depicted. Here, I thought they were a little too much on the "dumbbell" side, the all-too-often-seen characterization of U.S. servicemen as gape-mouthed knuckleheads. The "comic relief" was neither. Otherwise it was standard-issue sub stuff, much as you say, but done much more on the cheap than most similar films of the period -- something else that harmed it. By the way, this should have been (and in a sense was) Ronnie's second submarine movie. In 1937, right after making his film debut as a radio DJ in Love is On the Air, Reagan had a supporting part in a WB film called Submarine D-1, but his footage ended up on the cutting room floor, so no go. Twenty years later, he got to be in command, though, so all's well that ends well, except for that guy he left to drown. (Hmmm...think Charles Schneer foresaw Open Water?)

Did you know that Reagan was petrified of flying? Apparently soon after arriving in Hollywood in '37 he was invited to join a party flying to Catalina Island, but the flight over was in bad weather and he was violently shaken and ill. After that he swore he'd never fly again and didn't for almost 30 years! Funny, too, since he "flew" in many of his Brass Bancroft films, Desperate Journey, and others, not to mention the Army training films he made during the war, in some of which he was also a flyer. When he hosted General Electric Theater on TV in the 50s and was contractually obligated to go around the country speaking at GE's plants, he had it written in that he could always travel only by train. It wasn't until he began running for Governor in 1966 that he finally relented, and thereafter didn't seem to have much problem with flying at all. (I'm sure Air Force One was a pleasant experience.) Apparently underwater wasn't an issue, but up in the air was.

It just occurred to me, but maybe that early flying experience left some bad undercurrents that surfaced when he confronted the striking air traffic controllers in 1981. "Where were you at Catalina?!"

Okay, trivia...name another, rather different, sub movie Arthur Franz starred in a few years after HOTN.

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It just occurred to me, but maybe that early flying experience left some bad undercurrents that surfaced when he confronted the striking air traffic controllers in 1981. "Where were you at Catalina?!"

That's a thought. I just may forward that to my Reagan loving boss!

Okay, trivia...name another, rather different, sub movie Arthur Franz starred in a few years after HOTN.

That would be THE ATOMIC SUBMARINE, and again, Franz would play second-in-command, but this time he had no qualms with his captain, Dick Foran. Rather, he would have qualms with poor Brett Halsey, and would chew him out any time he could because of Brett's peacenik ways! And of course, you had Joi Lansing at the beginning, strictly for the eye candy, as she would play in other roles, and yet manage get her name on the major credits!

Hob, I didn't realize your wealth on knowledge on Ronald Reagan's movie career. I think I can get you a job at the Reagan Library in the Hollywood career section!

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>I think I can get you a job at the Reagan Library in the Hollywood career section!<

One more crack like that and I'm turning you over to the tender mercies of Arthur Franz.

Anyhow, I figured you'd know The Atomic Submarine (I figured you'd better know it!), but it's the career symmetry of these submarine movies I like. For my money, T.A.S. is a really cool, and decidedly the most unusual, submarine movie ever! When Criterion released it, that was enough to elevate it to something noteworthy. Love that cyclopean space guy! Nifty music, too.

About which, there is one RR movie also released by Criterion. Okay, no suspense; it's The Killers. It's out in a dual-film edition, the excellent 1946 original, plus Ronnie's 1964 remake (in which he was actually billed fourth, after John Cassavetes, Lee Marvin and Angie Dickinson). Definitely something worth getting, albeit pricy, like all Criterions.

I just recalled that Nancy's one remaining film role after Hellcats was another Schneer production called Crash Landing (1958), about a plane that develops engine trouble and goes down into the sea, but I think everyone escapes. Gary Merrill was the co-star and the film looked like it was produced at a cost of about $36. I'm sure that plot reenforced Ron's aversion to flying. Hell, cats, he probably recalled her as having been in a real crash!

Speaking of poor Joi Lansing, did you hear that poor Marilyn Chambers just died?! Amazing. I'm off Ivory Snow for life. Say, do you suppose if they'd had her aboard, Joi could have helped plug up the subs' hulls and keep either the Sea Tiger or the Tiger Shark afloa--oh, skip it.

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Love that cyclopean space guy!

I always have this strange feeling that the producers of THE SIMPSONS created Kang and Kodos based on that creature (along with it's voice!).

If THE KILLERS has a Criterion release then that makes it more interesting, and of course not to mention, it has Ronald Reagan as a heavy!

I just recalled that Nancy's one remaining film role after Hellcats was another Schneer production called Crash Landing (1958), about a plane that develops engine trouble and goes down into the sea, but I think everyone escapes. Gary Merrill was the co-star and the film looked like it was produced at a cost of about $36.

Well, fortunately, Schneer would go on and hire Gary Merrill in a bigger budgeted move, MYSTERIOUS ISLAND, where this time Merrill crash lands on the island but from a hot air balloon.

Speaking of poor Joi Lansing, did you hear that poor Marilyn Chambers just died?! Amazing. I'm off Ivory Snow for life. Say, do you suppose if they'd had her aboard, Joi could have helped plug up the subs' hulls and keep either the Sea Tiger or the Tiger Shark afloa--oh, skip it.

I always like to use Dove! And if Joi had been on that sub, I think she would have fallen for Brett Halsey and then we really would have seen fist fights!

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The cyclopean octopoid in The Atomic Submarine was built over special effects artist Irving Block's arm! I've read the producer hated the alien, but I thought it was not only pretty cool but very well done for its budget, not to mention its arm. Never thought about a Simpsons connection, but you have an interesting point. Ripping off the names from Star Trek is a solid, obvious move, but if they really did steal from Alex Gordon, that's inventive!

I wonder why Charles H. Schneer never rehired Arthur Franz after Hellcats? He often re-used performers and AF was certainly a capable actor, usually better than the B-movie material he so often starred in. I think he'd have been a better lead than William Hopper in 20,000,000 Miles to Earth. Gary Merrill made it. Kerwin Matthews made it. Though not Ken Tobey, Hugh Marlowe or, lest we forget, Ronald Reagan.

Somehow I can't quite see Ronnie in Jason and the Argonauts....

Zeus?

At least the sub in Hellcats of the Navy was sort of real (and with real shots of a real sub). Much as I like the movie, the titular vessel of The Atomic Submarine looked like one of those cereal box things that ran on baking soda.

Shore leave choice: Joi Lansing or Nancy Davis? You shouldn't even have finished reading that sentence before deciding. Even if Ms. Lansing was "Miss Wrong". What a way to sink!

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While Ronald Reagan played a submarine navy captain, his predecessor, Jimmy Carter was actually in the U.S. Navy and on submarines from WWII to the early 50s


Carter was in the Naval Academy during WW2. He did not serve aboard subs until AFTER WW2 was over. He graduated Annapolis as 59th in his class of 1946.

So sorry but no. Carter did not serve aboard subs during WW2.

While Reagan may not have served aboard subs, He did serve DURING WW2, not in school like Carter was. A medical condition prevented his service in an overseas combat unit but He still served in staff positions and in public relations.

TRIVIA TO NOTE:

You have to go all the way back to FDR to find a president who has NOT served in some capacity in the US Military with the exception of two notable presidents.

Since FDR, the ONLY TWO presidents who have NOT SERVED are....
Democratic presidents Bill Clinton and Barak Obama.

And Clinton was officially a Draft Dodger.



I joined the Navy to see the world, only to discover the world is 2/3 water!

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While Ronald Reagan played a submarine navy captain, his predecessor, Jimmy Carter was actually in the U.S. Navy and on submarines from WWII to the early 50s.



Just to be clear. Jimmy Carter did NOT serve aboard submarines DURING World War 2. He joined the US Naval Academy (Annapolis) in 1943 and did not graduate until 1946. The year AFTER the war was over.

He served as a junior officer aboard an old battleship that was converted to a test platform for new electronic equipment, and then later another old BB that weas converted in the same ammer after the first was Decommed.

IN Jun 1948 he applied and was accepted to Sub School. He graduated and was assigned to his first sub in Dec 1948.
So you see. He never served aboard Submarines until well AFTER WW2.

After serving as a Junior Officer on ONE sub, he was transfered to the precommissioning crew of a new sub. (one that was still being built)

He then applied for and was accepted by Rickover into the fledgling Nuclar Submarine Power program. While there on Dec 12 1952, Carter was sent as part of a cleanup crew to shut down the NRX reactor at Chalk River which had a partial meltdown. Carter was just one of many "Expedables" which were lowered into the reactor wearing protective equipment, each person spending only seconds at a time before being pulled back up. This was in an effort to shut down the melted reactor.

Afterwaords, Carter was Disallusioned of nuclear power. Following the death of his Father, Carter resigned his commission as a Lieutenant in 1953.

NOTE: Lt. in the Navy is still only a Junior Officer.

SO in retrospect.
1 )Carter served aboard a pair of old ships being used as testbeds.
2) Served aboard 1 active duty Sub as a JO
3) Served as the precommissioning crew of a new sub
4) Served as part of a nuclear development program
5) Helped clean up a Nuclear accident
6) Got disallusioned and got OUT as a JUNIOR OFFICER


Yeah... Some career!!!




I joined the Navy to see the world, only to discover the world is 2/3 water!

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