MovieChat Forums > The Harder They Fall (1956) Discussion > The One Funny Thing About This Film

The One Funny Thing About This Film


The implication at the end that acts of Congress actually do good.


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usa! usa!




sake happens

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Hey Snooze,

You made a very, very good point. Sadly, it is a point that is quite accurate.

Best wishes,
Dave Wile

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It's easy to make cheap and cynical remarks like that, but acts of Congress have often made a very real -- and positive -- difference to millions.

It was acts of Congress that passed the Civil Rights Act of 1964 and the Voting Rights Act of 1965. Congress passed Social Security and Medicare. Congress passed constitutional amendments, which were later ratifed, that ended slavery, gave women and 18-year-olds the vote, and ended the poll tax. Congress funded the transcontinental railroads, the interstate highway system and the race to the moon. There are thousands, if not tens of thousands, of other examples. The U.S. Congress has done countless things in its history that have benefited people, expanded the nation, helped business, industry and agriculture bring about prosperity, and make the United States the great nation it is.

Obviously Congress has and has had a multitude of failings. It's always had a lot of venal, stupid and incompetent, even dishonest, violent and bigoted, members. It's often done the bidding of special interests and engaged in obstructionist partisan gridlock -- as we see in abundance today. It's been argumentative and dysfunctional, and thousands of other things you can point out as wasteful, selfish, hypocritical and greedy. Money always plays a corrupting role. But the country wouldn't have survived if Congress hadn't also always had a lot of smart and dedicated people with good ideas who worked hard to make them happen.

As for Bogie's plea about Congress to outlaw boxing? Well, obviously, it didn't happen. But remember that into the 50s and beyond boxing was so brutal, exploitational, corrupt and mobbed up that many people felt it should be outlawed. Not that there's a huge improvement today.

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Hey Hobnob,

I don't mind being called cynical in my remarks about Congress, but I must take issue with you if you consider my remarks cheap. I would like to also point out that my cynicism is not partisan in any way; I dislike Democrats and Republicans equally. I also do not limit my cynicism to Congress - the Executive and Judicial branches are just as worthy of cynicism as Congress. What can I say? None other than Thomas Jefferson told us it was not only our right, but also our duty to keep a wary eye out for our government to insure it does not get so large and powerful that our freedoms are abridged, and it no longer exists to serve its citizens, but the citizens exist to serve the government. If Jefferson saw our society today, I think he would ask if we ever read the Declaration of Independence.

You mentioned a lot of "good" things Congress did in its 220 year history, and I would agree there has been much to look on with favor. However, Social Security and Medicare may not represent our government's finest works.

In our "Cold War" with the Soviet Union, our government managed to outspend them to the point where their economy crumbled, and their nation split up into separate states. We may have won that "Cold War" by some standards, but we were left just barely standing economically. Now, in our race to become a socialist nanny state, our economy that is so far in debt we have no idea where our ship of state is sailing. Our nation may very well go the way of the Soviet Union with our own union crumbling into separate states.

Personal freedom of its citizens certainly has not been a primary concern of our government for many, many years. Instead, our government has been far more focused on what it thinks is best for society as a whole rather than indivuals as citizens. Individual rights have been trampled in the name of the common good of society as viewed by the government.

Yes Hobnob, I am cynical of my government (all three branches), but I take pride in my cynicism, not shame. It is what Thomas Jefferson told us to do. And I do not think my cynicism is cheap.

Best wishes,
Dave Wile

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davidwile,

My statements about cynicism were directed as much to the OP as you, but in fact much more broadly. When I say "cheap", I mean that it is easy to attack the government. It's a convenient fall guy, and doing so doesn't require creative thought, or sometimes any thought.

I have great suspicion about people who selectively quote Jefferson, or anyone else for that matter, and twist his words to suit their own beliefs, as you have done. Some on the far right have claimed that Jefferson advocated armed insurrection against the government, which he did not. In any case, people like you seem to treat everything Jefferson said as infallible truth. Why? Thomas Jefferson was just a human being, not God, and as prone to mistakes, errors in judgment and other human failings as any other man, including all the founding fathers. He made many misjudgments in his life, was like many of his contemporaries hypocritcal about slavery, was a poor governor of Virginia, had other failures. He himself violated his supposed limited government beliefs in bypassing Congress to acquire the Louisiana Territory, and acted as he chose when it suited him, regardless of his prior belief in executive restraint. A great man? Indeed. But approach him realistically, completely and honestly. Not everything he said or did, even within its full context, is received wisdom to be slavishly followed or not to be questioned, and it's certainly not justification for individuals to do whatever they wish.

It's part of American folklore to simplistically portray the fathers as noble, divinely inspired, faultless and far-seeing...truly, as demigods. In truth they were all normal human beings, of great gifts certainly, but scarcely infallible. The fact that they disagreed amongst themselves proves that there is not one rigid line of received thought that all must follow without deviation. They were also smart enough to realize that the country would and must evolve, which is why the Constitution, while laying down some fundamental rights and obligations, was also left flexible enough in parts so as to be interpreted and amended as conditions changed.

The fact is that individual rights are stronger in this country than ever before. Freedoms once denied to blacks, women, and others, have been protected by law, and such discrimination is no longer countenanced or legal. It is part of the far right gospel these days that "government" is trampling on people's freedoms, that a socialist monster is devouring our rights, and so on. Try going to a true dictatorship -- North Korea, Iran, Cuba, any of the places where you really have no rights, where you cannot say or do anything out loud, are watched by informers and secret police, face torture, imprisonment and even death, with no rights of any kind. All the world would love to have the freedoms we enjoy in this country. To claim these are being stifled or restricted is preposterous, a triumph of mindless hysteria over facts and reason.

I've known people who lived under actual dictatorships -- in Hungary, Poland, the former USSR, even in Nazi Germany. Go tell them their rights are being taken away here. They'll laugh you out of the room, in barely suppressed outrage.

In truth, what people who make such idiotic and factually false claims want is the right to do whatever they want, period. What such people don't realize or grasp is that there is no freedom without the law; no right is unalloyed; you cannot simply pick and choose which laws you will observe and those you won't, and you have no right to act unlawfully to get your way. Anarchy is not freedom. No founding father advocated an unlimited right to do whatever one wished, nor allowing a minority -- whose rights are enshrined in and protected by law -- to take it upon itself to violently overthrow the government of the majority. And if one group arrogates unto itself the right to so act, then so may any other self-styled group of "patriots" who deem that government an infrignement on their rights. No one, including Jefferson, proposed or countenanced continued internal warfare and lawlessness as a means of change in government or policy.

This is a great country. It has a lot of problems, but it will endure, and survive even those who seek to destroy a government they don't happen to agree with (and which a majority of the people voted for -- and I mean any government, not just the present administration). There's a lot wrong with America, but much more that's right. You want to help solve our financial or other problems? Use the tools our laws and Constitution provide you with to achieve your goals. Criticize what's bad. But act with truth, not delusion. Perverting the past through selective quotations, devoid of thought and resistant to reality, is not a justification for anything.

Your rights are there, more secure than ever, protected and affirmed by law. If it were really the case that we were losing our freedoms, none of this would be permitted on the internet, and one or both of us would be in jail.

Of course, nothing I've said will make any difference to your thinking. Such a bubble is impossible to burst. So, I'll just say, best regards.

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