Historical accuracy


John Wayne's "The Alamo" garners most of the attention, but "Last Command" is by far the more historically accurate of the two. Okay...which film highlights the characters of Stephen F. Austin and Juan Bradburn? Which film places the early action in the town of Anahuac? Which film mentions the Constitution of 1824? "Last Command"...naturally.

So then which film moves San Antonio 160 miles to the Rio Grande? Which film has the Alamo garrison conducting three "special ops"? Which film highlights the song "Happy Birthday to You" at least 22 years before the music was published? John Wayne's "The Alamo...naturally. Caveat...if you're learning your history from the movies then you are definitely on the wrong track. But between these two films...more actual history is being shown during "The Last Command" than during "The Alamo".

Smokey, this is not 'Nam. This is bowling. There are rules.

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The Alamo: 13 Days to Glory also mentions the Treaty of 1824 and nary a Happy Birthday is sung. Based on a book by the same name which I haven't read yet, I can't say if this movie strayed much from the book or whether either is more historically accurate than the two movies you mention. I happen to prefer this movie to The Last Command and Wayne's The Alamo but there are some others out there including a newer one released in the last few years but even that movie has its detractors. Technically by definition, history can't change unless new contrary evidence is dug up. For historical events that have happened prior to any living witnesses, all that is left to sort through are personal letters and diaries. This is problematic as they more likely than not carry the personal bias of the writers especially when dealing with views on other people and their personalities. Someone wrote about General Santa Ana in the 13 Days thread that he is always portrayed as a madman. The Last Command did not but how will we ever know? People who wrote of him who liked him will say he was not mad while people who did not like him will write that he was.
KS

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I like both movies; but to me on the accuracy scale it's six of one half a dozen of the other. THE LAST COMMAND does have a lot going for it in terms of accuracy, but to me where it really falls down is the final battle. Wayne at least got the basic pattern of the battle down right (north wall and Travis falling, leading to the defense of the east and west walls collapsing in on itself, south wall holding out, final defense of inner courtyard and chapel, etc.). Also, the "Wayneamo"--the Alamo compound-- while having a lot of inaccurate details (and looking more like a pleasant Mexican pueblo than a squalid, abandoned ruin)--has the general layout right; while THE LAST COMMAND only has two walls (that we can see) and a chapel with an odd bell tower that appears and disappears.

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Cinematically, this is all soundstage fantasy! Historically, it's never mentioned in this Mexican-hating country that the whole Texian ball of puckey was based on slavery, little boys, not "freedom", except, as with today's rightwingery, the "freedom" to own slaves. Whatta buncha freedom fighters! Like Reagan's right wing death squad he celebrated in the WH as the "equivalent to our founding fathers". Either he knew the founders were a lot worse human beings than i know, or the sickening analogies are based on lies like the Alamo.

WHICH WAS: A site where the government that had banned slavery in its country wiped out a band of foreign slave-traders, who eventually won. So much for "freedom". Yeah, and Hitler was just a misunderstood dog-lover.

~~ Native Angeleno

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Way to mindlessly regurgitate the party line, craig.

I'm always amused that the people who make the loudest noise about slaveowners in the Texas and American Revolutions are usually the biggest State-humpers and coercion-junkies.

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Movies and TV series generally portray history in terms of a modern perspective. As this perspective tends to be liberal (in the broad sense of the word), we see characters (historic or otherwise) behaving in ways they never would have in real life.

This is equivalent to rewriting history a la 1984, so that things will always seem to be unchanged. This is unfortunate, because Americans are by and large stupid and ignorant. Our general failure to search for and respect the truth is perhaps the biggest reason we are currently going through a period of political insanity.

I've been working through the LIFE books on the American West. The Texans goes into a lot of detail about the evolution of Texas as an independent state. It's a far more-complex story than any film has portrayed (as far as I know).

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That's quite a rant... you forgot to throw in some random comment about Fox News to complete the cliché, though. As with the American Revolution, revisionists love making it begin, end, and have everything to do with slavery; regardless of a lack of documentation from the time identifying it as a factor. (The founding fathers considered abolishing slavery in 1776, but set the issue on the backburner)

Only a small percentage of the population owned slaves, and while reliable information on most of the individual Alamo defenders may be lacking, not one of the 32 volunteers from Gonzalez owned a slave.

Put simply, Santa Anna had abandoned the established constitution, dissolved the congress, made himself the center of power, and passed strict regulations that were equally unpopular with native Mexicans. People remember Texas, but San Luis Potosí, Querétaro, Durango, Guanajuato, Michoacán, Yucatán, Jalisco, Nuevo León, Tamaulipas, and Zacatecas all rebelled.

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Just as an aside, JW was the first pick for this but
it ended up with a perfectly cast Sterling Hayden instead

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Let me clue you in on something: no movie has ever been made about the Alamo nor will there ever be that's historically accurate except on maybe one or two historical truths and that's it. What you have to understand is that we actually know very little of what really happened there that you could take to court for two reasons: first, all the defenders were killed, second, even the Mexican eyewitnesses who were there disagree on all the major events that took place. For example, there are those who claim that Davy Crockett was killed as is depicted in this version as well as the Walt Disney and John Wayne versions. Others claim he survived the battle along with about five or six others only to be captured and then lined up against the wall and shot which is depicted in the most recent version starring Billy Bob Thornton. So the point is that any movie you see about the Alamo is going to be mainly conjecture. Now I would imagine we'd all like to hope and believe that Crockett went down like the Walt Disney version depicts it, where as the sole surviving defender he takes on the entire Mexican army single handedly by swinging his rifle butt at everybody knocking them over right and left.

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John Wayne's Alamo showed Jim Bowie giving his slave his freedom, who then decides to stay. According to some historians, Bowie's slave was not an old man but a young man and it was reported that he survived and was later seen further west. I used to like Wayne's version until I discovered the reason for annexing Texas was to add another southern state to counteract the non-slave owning northern states. Good movies to me but as a black man, it changes the concept of freedom and gallantry depicted.

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THE LAST COMMAND is more historically accurate, for what it's worth, than either the Wayne film or the Disney Davy Crockett. Both THE ALAMO: THIRTEEN DAYS TO GLORY (even with budget limitations, miscasting, and some howlers abut Mexican history) and the 2004 THE ALAMO are more accurate still. But only a fool would use a movie for a history lesson.

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When Santa Anna told Bowie he was going to blow the Degüello , Jim did not answer "blow this."

For the record I thought some aspects were more accurate than Duke's film.



Kisskiss, Bangbang

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Last Command has Travis taking a head shot, which is what happened.

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