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The Only Film Marie Windsor Was Ashamed Of

posted 15 years ago by guanche
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I recall reading an interview with Marie Windsor in which she stated that this was the only film she was ashamed of. She shouldn't have been so hard on herself. Her role as a Damsel In Distress (she was in the process of being turned into a catwoman you see, by means of robotic dances and theramin music) was completely out of character for this tough noir broad/hard bitten (and authentic) cowgirl. The scene of her fainting and being carried out of the Catwoman Cave by a guy who seems to be about half her size and on the verge of a hernia, is a real side splitter.

I've always been one of her admirers, and resented her relegation to B movies. She was absolutely tops in suitable roles, and sexy as all get out. Wherever you are Marie, I hope that your spirit understands that I'm laughing with you, not at you.

[–] hobnob53 15 years ago

She may have hated this movie (understandably), but 56 years later, here we are talking about it. How many films, especially low-budget B's (but even many A's), can you say that about?

Actor Robert Clarke wrote that decades after making what he considered throw-away movies he made just to earn a living, people were still asking him about them (The Hideous Sun Demon, The Man From Planet X, etc.) Peter Graves said on his old Biography series on A&E that after decades spent making movies like Stalag 17, The Night of the Hunter and Airplane!, after TV shows such as Mission: Impossible, Fury and The Winds of War, the one thing he got more fan mail for, and was asked more questions about, was Killers From Space!

Besides, I think Marie (and I agree with the comments you made about her) did make worse movies than Cat-Women. The Day Mars Invaded the Earth (1963), for one.

[–] guanche 15 years ago

A very interesting perspective. Perhaps these movies, with their tight shooting schedules and limited budgets come straight from the psyches of the creators without the editing and marketing baggage attached to mainstream films, and are therefore closer to our subconscious selves. I never saw The Day Mars Invaded Earth, but perhaps I should. Since I am both a "bad" movie fan and an even bigger fan of Marie W.---my very first screen crush. And, (from what I've read about her) a worthwhile and multi-talented person as well.

[–] hobnob53 15 years ago

I think most people like films like Cat-Women -- I certainly do -- not because they're great art but because, when all is said and done and made fun of, they're entertaining. Whatever else CWOTM may be, it isn't boring or uninteresting. They may be guilty pleasures, but the operative word is "pleasures". Give me a movie like this over some $100 million overblown piece of junk today.

The Day Mars... is just a dull film that mostly takes place around the house of the family of a scientist who has sent a probe to Mars. (I won't say more lest I ruin it for you, if such a thing is possible!) It isn't awful, simply fairly unimaginative and plodding. It clocks in at barely over an hour, and has been run on the Fox Movie Channel (in widescreen) from time to time.

Yes, Marie was a very talented as well as sexy woman. I liked her best in the film noir The Narrow Margin, which I assume you've seen. (My only personal disappointment -- but not surprise -- was when I found out she was an ardent Republican, which, as a Democrat, I regret!)

Do you know the actress Illeana Douglas? I think she bears a striking resemblance to Marie Windsor in many ways. A few people I've mentioned this to agree, at least to some extent, but others don't really see it. What do you think?

[–] guanche 15 years ago

Once again, an interesting commentary. Illeana Douglas does indeed bear a strikng facial resemblance to Marie Windsor, especially in the optical department. But Marie is (was) much sexier and better built. And, at least to me, her face was more expressive of depth and intelligence. The Narrow Margin was a great noir movie but had some glaring reality deficits which I point out in my own review of the film. I could never understand why Marie was smoking and blasting a record player from an "empty" compartment and why the killers didn't know what their gang's chief accountant's wife and kid looked like.

I'm also a registered Democrat, but, for the last 20-25 years I have voted Republican (often reluctantly) in most national elections. I am appalled at how totalitarian liberalism has become, and how dogmatic and allergic to critical thought many modern "liberals" are. Many of the Hollywood elite support or at least rationalize the behavior of the most repressive individuals, cultures, and regimes on Earth. Sean Penn is one of the greatest actors ever. But his politics and dictator worship make me wanna upchuck!

I know that Marie was politically conservative, much more so than I. But, if she were my contemporary, and I had the opportunity, that wouldn't stop me from pursuing her. The only possible bump in that road from my point of view is something I've never been able to ascertain. She was raised as a Mormon and went to Brigham Young University. But I don't know if she continued this affiliation later in life. If so, it would be pretty ironic considering the types of parts she played best. And, from her point of view, that she was noticeably taller than me. Not a problem for me. I'd carry her out of the Catwoman Cave (and into mine) anytime.

[–] hobnob53 15 years ago

Yes, it's the eyes where both Marie and Illeana share the strongest resemblance. They also have the same broad facial features and so on. But I agree, Marie is sexier and more attractive. (Though I.D. certainly isn't hard to take! She's the grandddaughter of Melvyn Douglas, by the way.)

Do you think those chaise-lounges in the rocketship were useful for...oh, you know. Those looooooong moon voyages. After 8 or 10 hours Sonny would be crawling the walls, if not for the artificial gravity.

I don't want to get into political arguments here but I'll remark that most actors, liberal or conservative, aren't very smart or well-informed on matters of public policy. Ideologues always see no evil on their own side and ascribe all deviltry to their opponents. I've never had any use for hypocrites or people who try to distort or ignore inconvenient facts to fit their preconceived notions, who betray their intelligence and any concept of truth and reality in order to slant things to fit their own biases. As for the modern Republican Party -- so dominated by various lunatic extremists of the far right (birthers, teabaggers, racists, secessionists, creationists, know-nothings, paid mobs and media liars, to name a few) that even its so-called mainstream office holders are petrified of offending them and kowtow irresponbily to every psychotic who shouts loudly enough -- I'd like to think (or hope) that at least some of yesteryear's responsible conservatives in the film colony (Gary Cooper, Frank Morgan, Clark Gable et al) would be ashamed.

Now we've each made a political statement, back to the divine Miss W.

[–] guanche 15 years ago

At the risk of being "politically argumentative" I must say that most Republicans, as most Democrats, are quite mainstream. However most "mainstream" people are rather apathetic and the activist and even lunatic fringe elements within any given party tend to drive The Bus. I know that many responsible liberals (which I consider myself to be) are ashamed not only of the views of what often passes for "liberal" these days but of the infantile manner in which many of the "politically correct" immediately demonize anyone who even partially disagrees with them, and their unwillingness to think critically or at least listen to and debate opposing viewpoints. That's why we see modern "liberals" now beating the drum for things that used to be anathema to liberalism such as "hate speech" laws and restrictions on "offensive" content in the mass media. Seeing Hollywood celebrities express admiration for Stalinists like the Castro brothers is as nauseating as it is incomprehensible to me. I find that nowadays even extreme right wingers like creationists, ect. will at least listen to and debate opposing points of view. Whereas "liberals" tend to overtalk and even shout down opinions they don't like---and run away. Often after insults and name calling.

I guess Otto von Bismarck said it best: "Two things one should never see being made are laws and sausages." I'm sure the Catwomen would agree.

I'm not aware of Marie W being a political activist for any side. Do you know if she was? I'm sure the chaise lounges got some of the use you imply. As I recall, Marie changed squeezes at least once during the course of the film.

[–] hobnob53 15 years ago

Actually, I agree with much of what you say. Self-described liberals (like Ed Asner, Sean Penn et al) who mindlessly supported, or at least minimized the despicability of, Communist or other dictatorial regimes because they were leftist always angered me. (Hence my comments about ideologues in my last post.) These types were hilariously skewered in the puppet movie Team America: World Police, which also knocked the right in equal-opportunity skewerings.

Unfortunately, the same (albeit opposite) mind-set governs the right. Pat Buchanan wanted Gerald Ford to appoint him ambasador to South Africa in 1975, certainly not because he harbored any racially progressive views. The right-wing intelligentsia supported thugs like Pinochet, the Greek junta, Chiang Kai-shek, the South African apartheidists, and numerous other quasi-fascistic types because they were "anti-Communist". It's little remembered, but Ronald Reagan (speaking of actors), in his 1976 campaign against Ford, advocated sending American troops to fight for the white supremicist government of Rhodesia. His national security advisor, Jean Kirkpatrick (an old professor of mine), pushed for the US to back the Argentinian junta against Britain in the Falklands war, despite their being an unelected dictatorship that murderd thousands of domestic opponents, abridged basic freedoms and violated international law. Domestically, I was always disappointed that Charlton Heston, who moved further and further to the fringe right over the years, should have several times campaigned enthusiastically for an unapologetic racist and anti-Semite like Jesse Helms, even as he (Heston) continued to proclaim his participation in the civil rights struggles of the 1960s. Conservatives are one thing, fringe haters another.

And no way do creationists and other rightist groups sit and listen respectfully to opposite views. They most certainly do no such thing. The recent outbreak of paid-for mobs of people, usually bused in from outside, disrupting town hall meetings of Democratic congressmen in place of respecting others' rights to be heard, and certainly in place of civil or informed debate on health care, is the normal modus operandi of the far right these days. There is nothing honest or edifying about them in any way.

But I agree, most liberals and conservatives are mainstream. If only they could control and not bow before their repective, loud extremes. In this, you're absolutely right.

Whew! Okay, please, please let's stay off politics. I've encountered too many off-putting (and tiring) fights on that subject around here. At least, you're civil and reasonable, as I hope I am. We actually do agree on many principles, and while we may disagree on some particulars or assessments, we do so respectfully. (Anyway, I've tried to be: I hope I have committed no offense to you.)

As to Marie, I do have some vague recollection of seeing her name associated with a list of Reagan supporters in the 80s. How politically active she was, I do not know. It sounds as if she probably was at least a little bit.

More critically, who do you think she ended up with following her cat-women close call? Sonny or Vic? One was too old and the other too drunk. And weren't either of those guys concerned about mixing in with alien DNA?

I don't know that I agree with your take on her behavior in The Narrow Margin. Her loud, brassy demeanor served as a decoy to help throw off the gangsters, and at obvious danger to herself. Maybe a bit overdone, but still, a necessary ruse. As for the mob not knowing what the real wife looked like, this is a little unlikely, I agree -- someone, somewhere, should have caught a glimpse, even if her identity was kept generally secret -- but then, without that aspect, there'd be no movie.

Also, to return to the thread subject, I'd like sometime to scour Miss Windsor's credits to uncover other movies she should have been more ashamed of than this poor, little, fun film!

[–] guanche 15 years ago

Not to go on endlessly, but I do feel compelled to make a few remarks. My personal experience is indeed that the PC types (who are, ironically, usually better educated) are less tolerant of criticism. And I say this as a "liberal" with some leftist views. Nat Hentoff, quite a leftist himself, has written a number of columns on this issue. And yes, Pat Buchanan is a despicable fascist and anti-semite who also finds common cause with Islamofascists. What a creep!

This nation has definitely supported some horrible world leaders with abominable human rights records. BUT no one ever made folk heroes out of them a la Che Guevara or Mao. I don't recall seeing anyone wearing a Franco or Pinochet T shirt. And ACORN and Al Sharpton type race racketeers are guilty of the same tactics you ascribe to right wing headcases.

It seems logical that Marie Windsor had some close dealings with Reagan, since she eventually became a director of the Screen Actors Guild---where RR got his political start. Although I didn't vote for him in '80 I did in '84. Definitely flawed but probably the right man at the time. Even Barrack Obama says as much in his book The Audacity Of Hope.

I don't remember which guy Marie ultimately ended up with after her close shave with the Catwomen. Captain Kirk was never concerned about interglactic DNA. I guess that makes Catwomen from our neighbor the Moon like hillbilly kissin' cousins by comparison. I'm not knocking the Narrow Margin too hard. A great film in many respects, but some of the realism could have been tightened up without diminishing it's entertainment value.

I can't think of any "worse" MW films. Swamp Women comes to mind, but even that one is better done than "Catwomen", much funnier, and Marie has a much more suitable role. However it's her worst looking movie. She never looked as good as a blonde, and her hairstyle is atrocious. Usually I rate her as an 11 or a 12, but in that film she goes down to an 8 or a 9. Her best looking film was Outpost In Morocco, a 1949 Foreign Legion movie. Her leading man is George Raft who was half her size and at least twice her age. It's humorously obvious that he's standing on a box in the love scenes. Marie plays an Arab princess in one of her earliest leading roles and she is absolutely gorgeous. There's even a rather risque scene of her bathing nude (so it seems) in an oasis pond. Definitely a 12+ in this one! You oughta see it if you haven't. Rather inane in many respects but punctuated by what appears to be documentary footage of the Rif Wars of the 20s and 30s. In fact, it seemed that she's wearing the same negligee she wears in the Narrow Margin. She also seems to wear the same get up in Two Dollar Bettor. Another great one where she leads a good family man astray. And he's got to stand on something to make out with her too!

[–] hobnob53 15 years ago

Well, we're on the same page regarding what's usually called the "PC types". As I said, I have no regard for people who can't use the brains they were born with, and distort truth to suit their own prejudices or agendas. (As to fascist fashion, the rightist nutcases aren't prone to the sort of T-shirt wear favored by the sloganeering left, although many of their paid-for protesters today bear shirts and signs with pretty psychotic sayings.) The left is loud and hypocritical, but the right vastly more numerous and in many cases positively deranged. (I mean the fringes, not mainstream liberals or conservatives.)

I do think each party needs a walloping from time to time (1946, 1958, 1964, 1972, 1980, 1994, 2006, 2008, etc.). Reagan did a number of good things, especially on foreign policy, where I'm much more conservative than domestically. In the latter field he was not so hot. As to the 1984 race, the Dems' VP nominee is a neighbor of mine (she also succeeded my great-uncle in Congress), and I think she was not only unqualified (though not as bad as Sarah Palin), but I happen to know how nasty, vindictive and self-righteous she can be. Her family isn't much better, either. Her son is a congenital liar. But...they're fellow Democrats! Go figure. But while I'm unhappy at many things with the party, I could never side with a party that is drifting off the charts to the right and embarces ignorance, fanaticism and know-nothingism. I'm really appalled at what's happened to the GOP. We need a credible, sane, honest and informed opposition.

Okayyyyyyyy........

Funny you mention Two-Dollar Bettor, because I became aware of that film just a few months ago, and bought it. I posted a review and comment on its site. Marie was her usual slinky, seductive, semi-treacherous self in that one. Not a bad movie at all, and that role was tailor-made for her. Although it was certainly above and beyond for her to have to lure John Litel onto the wrong path! Yeesh!

I know of Outpost in Morocco but have never managed to see it. Your description makes it a definite must for me. Have you ever seen Bedtime Story (1964)? It's the original version of the later (and far better) Dirty Rotten Scoundrels, and starred that scintillating comedy team of David Niven and...Marlon Brando! (In the Michael Caine and Steve Martin roles, respectively.) Marie has a brief role at the beginning -- I think even before the opening credits, but right at the start -- as a wealthy woman gladly handing over her valuable jewels to David Niven for his "worthy cause"...and so taken with her suitor that immediately after she removes her dress and stands before him ostensibly nude, offering her body to Niven "for the cause"! Of course, this being 1964, no nudity was actually shown, but Marie's creamy shoulders and her demeanor in undoing her clothing and letting it drop onto the floor is quite something, all things considered. Not bad for a 45-year-old babe, I must say.

I always found it a pity that Marie passed away on Dec. 10, 2000, one day before (really, only hours before) what would have been her 82nd birthday on Dec. 11. (I think IMDb gives a different birth year than 1918 for her, but I believe '18 is correct. Throughout her active career, Marie's YOB was always given as 1922.) Anyway, she was one of several stars who passed away the day before their birthdays and so missed joining that tiny, elite group who actually died precisely and evenly on their birthdays (Ingrid Bergman, Otto Krueger, Edna May Oliver, among others). Kind of rounds things off neatly, I think. On the other hand, missing by that single day, Marie was only 81, not 82. Forever young!

I'll be away for a few days so see you later. By the way, I ran a double feature of both Cat-Women of the Moon AND its remake (!), Missile to the Moon, for my girlfriend several months ago. She was, shall we say...umm...impressed. But she does concede they're the best pair of lost-civilization-of-moon-maidens-luring-Earthmen-to-their-doom films she's ever seen.

If Marie had done Missile, that would've been her worst film!

[–] guanche 15 years ago

In the first place, have a great trip! And see "Outpost In Morocco". "Missle" wasn't quite as bad as "Catwomen" and at least as funny. Even worse was "Queen of Outer Space" with a masked Zsa Zsa Gabor ruling a world of futuristic fashion model types. The concept was funnier than it's execution.

It is interesting that you point out that Marie Windsor seems to have two birth years---1919 and 1922. I checked a celebrity grave site and a picture of her tombstone confirms the earlier date.

Two Dollar Bettor was great. Especially with Alfalfa as the daughter's boyfriend and June (from leave It To Beaver) as the chump's secretary. Why did you demote Marie to "semi-treacherous"? After all she started his downfall in that very negligee by suggesting that she could make his consolation drink over losing $600 "worth it"---as the lights go out. A real hoot!

[–] hobnob53 15 years ago

Well, true, at least Missile did have rock men and escaped '50s JD's piloting a spacecraft by learning where the ON/OFF button was.

Actually, give Marie three birth years -- besides 1919 and 1922, at the time of her death almost all obits gave 1918 as her YOB. I said I thought '18 was correct. Any year notwithstanding, all agree on a birthday of Dec. 11 and her passing on Dec. 10 (2000).

And to think -- she missed the gala, all-night Hollywood observation of Cat-Women's 50th anniversary in 2003. Sigh.

I'm glad Marie isn't around to see you describe my referring to her in Two-Dollar Bettor as merely semi-treacherous as a "demotion"!! But didn't she sort of have a change of heart late in the game, or at least begin to question her treacherousness, even if she went through with the scam? Just trying to give her the benefit of the doubt. But I did find TDB pretty tense in most spots and surprisingly compelling dramatically. Except for the parts with Alfalfa, who seemed most concerned about dancing. What an idiot.

Oh, Zsa Zsa was not the titular (you should pardon the expression) "Queen of Outer Space" (in reality, only Venus). Laurie Mitchell played the masked queen Yllana. Zsa Zsa was merely the treacherous (!) traitor/patriot Talleah, who led the final revolt against the masked queen to restore male domination. The only Venusian with a Hungartian accent. They said they learned Earth's languages by the usual alien ruse of "monitoring your radio broadcasts for many years". Z-Z must've been tuning into Radio Lugosi or something.

Have a great weekend!

[–] guanche 15 years ago

Always entertaining and informative to hear from you. I surrender! You know much more about astro-feminism than I do. Did you ever see "Galaxy Quest" with Tim Allen as the "Kirk" character? It was made about 10 years ago. A great satire of the whole "trekkie" thing. A group of real (but good) aliens disguised as humans kidnap the has been actors of "Galaxy Quest" at a "questie" convention, believing them to be real astro-heroes from monitoring Earth's TV transmissions, and hoping that they can help them fight some bad aliens. It's very funny and well done. I'm sure you'd like it.

Marie was definitely (as I recall) a full fledged villain in TDB, passing off her boyfriend as her brother and getting the patsy to embezzle a large sum from his bank. As I recall she only felt like renouncing the crime when the fall guy wised up and pulled a gun on her and her "brother". I think she'd be more pleased with my characterization. She did actually make some films where she was a more sympathetic character. "The Jungle", and "Outpost In Morocco" come to mind. And of course the twist at the ending of Narrow Margin. That one actually made me angry as a kid. I used to imagine capturing the killers myself and throwing them live into the steam engine's coal furnace. She also did a great job as an anti-hero in one of her earliest roles in the 1947 western "Hellfire". If you haven't seen it I highly recommend it.

Once again, Bon Voyage!

[–] hobnob53 15 years ago

I agree with you about Galaxy Quest. Very nifty idea, funny and in parts rather genuinely touching. (I'm sure William Shatner didn't appreciate it!). The one who struck me most in that movie was Sigourney Weaver. I thought she was a knock-out as a blond, and of course they did everything possible to emphasize her breasts! She showed she had a sense of humor (and comedy) and once again proved her versatility -- and demonstrated how to be gorgeous at 50!

I was kidding about Marie's taking umbrage at being termed "semi-treacherous". You're right, of course, her last-minute reluctance in TDB was due to her "brother's" gun and the notion that things were going too far. I bought this film after reading something vague about it and, checking it out, found that Alpha Video had ground out a DVD. For $7.99, not bad. Haven't seen Hellfire, but it's on the MW-list!

However, The Jungle is one of the earliest movies I remember watching on TV, decades ago. It was actually produced by the father of one of my high school teachers -- he told us his father was an Indian film producer and to give us an example of his dad's output asked us, "Have you ever seen a movie called The Jungle?" I laughed and exclaimed, tactlessly (I was about 13), "Oh, my God, that is the worst movie ever!", which was a bit unfair because even then it wasn't. Do you have the DVD of TJ? An excellent print of the film is available from VCI on a double bill with a truly lousy (i.e., priceless) picture, King Dinosaur. In the extras they have a printed interview with Marie Windsor discussing making that film, including on how nice the producer, Mr. Sundaram, was! (Apparently the Indian print of the film ran over two hours -- vs. the American's 74 minutes -- the bulk of that filled with that inevitable Indian film staple, loads of singing and dancing. I somehow have no desire to see that version.)

The Jungle, weak as it was despite its location filming, was technically probably a "better" film than Cat-Women. But I think its superiority was very much only technical. CWOTM was much more entertaining. But what must Marie have thought about the trajectory of her career at this time -- going from chasing elephants dressed up as woolly mammoths in 1952 to cruising to the moon being chased by an overage lothario and a drunk in 1953?

[–] guanche 15 years ago

It's been many years since I've seen The Jungle. That movie was my first exposure to MW when I was 8 or 9. Monster movies were my favorite at the time, and mammoths kind of qualified. For some reason I was more interested in her than the beasts. All at an age when I had a "normal" aversion to girls. Of course, In time I developed a 'big boy" crush as well which was easier to understand. Somehow I just knew she was really the nice, stand up person she seemed to be in that movie rather than the villains she usually played. What I've read about her seems to bear this out, although I don't of course have any personal knowledge in this regard.

I recall reading that she was very friendly with Cesar Romero, the Snidely Whiplash of "The Jungle" and in her early years, often acted as his "beard" (he was gay) at parties and social events. The Jungle wasn't nearly as bad as Catwomen. And much less insulting to MW, who played a totally out of character helpless airhead in the latter. I think she was more ashamed of her character than of the movie. I'll have to try to get that VCI dvd, especially since it has an MW interview. If the overage lotharios of 1953 could score with a number like her, maybe there's some hope for this one!

[–] hobnob53 15 years ago

Oh, I never heard that Marie was anything other than your standard nice gal. Probably one reason she could so effectively (and willingly) play so many tramps and vamps was that they were the antithesis of her true nature. Actors usually excel at playing against type. But like a lot of actors and actresses, she too often did get stuck in one or two niches, and that's how producers thought of her. Not to mention she was mainly caught in B movies, seldom in "big" pictures. This was the fate the whims of H'wood dealt her. Of course, today there's no onus attached to someone who starred mainly in such second features, but back then there was a definite hierarchy in the film community and while many of her peers doubtless respected her (and others in similar stations), she could never escape the pocket Hollywood filmmakers decided best suited her. Unfortunately, this entailed starring in Cat-Women of the Moon, The Jungle and other such low-brow stuff as well as better-received things like The Narrow Margin, The Sniper and The Killing.

By the way, she studied acting under Maria Ouspenskaya and was a champion horsewoman. Even though she did a number of westerns, it seems her equestrian talents weren't as often called upon as were her seductive, brassy abilities.

But to return to Cat-Women, I can't at all agree that Marie played a "helpless airhead" in that film. Au contraire, she was supposedly a genius astrophysicist or something, with a knowledge of interplanetary flight (at least as practiced in this movie, lawn chairs and all), and quite a cool, collected character. In fact, she seemed to me to be the smartest person on the entire trip, technically and professionally. Her being hypnotized by the moon maids wasn't a sign of mental weakness of any sort. By contrast, in The Jungle, while she certainly was no "airhead" -- did she ever play one of those? -- she was too much the damsel in distress, needing to be saved by Rod Cameron or Cesar Romero: a powerful woman in title, but one still needing the firm hand of a protective male to save herself and her state from the mammoths.

Sci-fi was also my favorite growing up, and I still haven't outgrown the habit. (Obviously!) But I do think the younger generation really missed out by not being weaned on low-budget stuff like this, which if nothing else was usually fun...something you really can't say in regard to the CGI-laden eye-candy that passes for entertainment today. After all, here we are, 56 years later, still talking about a thing called Cat-Women of the Moon. As I said somewhere, that must say something about these films' entertainment value!

[–] guanche 15 years ago

Maybe I'll have to give Catwomen another watch. Even though my VHS dollar bin copy is in pretty bad shape. As I recall in The Jungle she was more of a conventional action movie heroine. But still an assertive one. I seem to remember that she was a scientist of some sort searching for botanical jungle cures and was resigned to an arranged marriage to the much older, lecherous Romero "for the good of her people". I guess the fact that she still needed to be protected and "rescued" appealed to my little boy's need to imagine myself as a hero. And, at the time, I didn't realize that I would end up being relatively short and, like some of her leading men, probably also have to stand on a box to kiss her. In fact, there's a really funny scene in "Abbott and Costello Meet The Mummy" where she's got Costello literally pinned to the wall with her jugs. Lou sees thru her faux seduction, and is terrified of her. I think she's a Mata Hari type who wants to cut him open to retrieve something he swallowed. This is a reasonably funny movie with some good MW material. It also features Richard Deacon (Lumpy's dad) as the High Priest of the mummy cult.

Maybe the Catwomen really know if she remained a practicing Mormon.

[–] hobnob53 15 years ago

I should think a re-look at CWOTM is definitely in order. Maybe treat yourself to a DVD copy. If you do, allow me to recommend the version produced by Image (labeled as part of "The Wade Williams Collection" -- it's the one whose cover is reproduced on the home page here, at upper left). It's by far the best print available -- in excellent condition. Other versions would be pretty poor transfers. There's also an excellent Image release, under the same Williams label, of Missile to the Moon. Amazon is pretty much the sole locale to obtain both these DVDs nowadays, for less than $20 total last time I saw. Definitely a bargain, and the one way to make sure you get the optimum prints.

Now, in The Jungle, Marie isn't a botanist but a Maharani, the ruler of her princely Indian state, who has Rod Cameron brought in for his big game hunting skills and to lead their expedition to uncover the truth behind these woolly mammoth reports. Rod was the sole survivor of a previous expedition that saw the mammoths, and has been blamed for the deaths of everyone on that excursion. Marie isn't interested in science, only in protecting her people. She isn't betrothed to Cesar Romero; he's just her closest advisor (though he clearly wants to wed and bed her), with a grudge against Cameron about Cameron's failed expedition to mammoth country, because Cesar's brother (I think) was on it and was killed. You should organize a small expedition to the Amazon and get the DVDs of Cat-Women, Missile to, and the double-feature of The Jungle/King Dinosaur.

I was thinking of A&C Meet the Mummy while writing my last post. Not a bad film, for very late A&C, and Marie's exotic looks once again stood her in good stead, this time as a mysterious high priestess...a position she couldn't attain with the Mormons!

Perhaps the Cat Women had her join the LDS church on Earth as cover for her work down here. Once back on the moon, she rejoined her "native" church -- notice all those temples in their moon city? Just a different LDS: Lunar Deity Society.

"Lumpy's dad"! Great!! Now that's a reference!

UPDATE! I just checked Amazon and found that CWOTM is on sale for $7.49, MTTM for just $5.49 -- $12.98 combined. The The Jungle/King Dinosaur DVD is $13.49. Great deal for the lunar duo. You can buy both moon pictures in one click on the Cat-Women site, where they're offered together. By the way, beware a colorized version of Missile to the Moon that was released last year. Colorization is lousy, and robs us of the original's glory. Anyway, thought this information might be useful.

[–] guanche 15 years ago

Thanks for the info. I already ordered Jungle/King Dinosaur. I haven't seen The Jungle in many years. I knew that MW was a maharani but I thought she was a scientist too. I'll soon see how deteriorated my memory is.

As an authority on Interplanetary Feminist Civilizations, you're probably right about the Lunar(atic) Deity Society. It seems they sent a male incarnation back to Earth to further enlighten us---Sun Myung Moon.

I saw A&C Meet The Mummy recently. Marie wasn't a high priestess, but a regular old murderous International Woman Of Mystery. The mummy is named "Klaris". AND on Leave It To Beaver, Richard Deacon is ClarENCE B. Rutherford Jr. and Lumpy is Clarence B. Rutherford III!!! (fade in to Twilight Zone music...)

I'd better stop now. This is starting to make too much sense!

They're coming to take me away haha
They're coming to take me away ho hee haha...

[–] hobnob53 15 years ago

Right, my dopey error -- Marie was yet another schemer in A&C Meet the Mummy. I guess she just seems like a high priestess -- she certainly had the inscrutable (again, pardon the expression) look of the sloe-eyed femme fatale just waiting to preside over a human sacrifice.

Talk about deteriorated memories!

May I put in one more plug for the purchase of that Moon duet? You won't regret it. Sonny says so.

Say, by the way -- what was a guy named Sonny doing on the Moon??

Figure that one out, Clarence!

...To the funny farm,
where life is....

[–] guanche 15 years ago

Tod igress a bit, I should say that in interviews MW in retrospect seemed a lot less resentful about her career beig largely limited to B movies. She seems to have liked most of her colleagues and maintained real friendships with some of them. She makes it seem as if the "B" community took care of it's own and that most of the actors were decent, humble folks.

I think you put your finger on why Sonny Tufts went to the Moon and vanished from filmdom. He had to have extensive plastic surgery, forget English and learn flawless Korean. I'm sure it took some time.

What color is the padding in your cell? Where Life Is Beautiful All The Time!!

[–] hobnob53 15 years ago

Padding? PADDING??!!

When I bust out of this joint I'll kill EVERYONE who called me insane!!!!

Sonny's crazy -- but I'm not. He told me so.

But I like your idea about that Korean aspect. Somehow I can't imagine naming that school in Boston "Myung University". (Tufts really is named after a more respectable member of the family.)

By the way, who is this guy 'Tod igress'?

Quick! Sonny! A showgirl! Get those dentures in!

[–] guanche 15 years ago

Tod Igress sounds like the guy who put me here. I've got to thank him sometime. I really like the orange with green polka dot padding. But the piped in theramin muzak is a bit much. Did you ever hear the Carpenters on theramin?

Uh oh! Hope they realize I'm OK now and send me home. If I'm late again I just know Marie will have one of her brothers kill me!

[–] hobnob53 15 years ago

What else could you expect from such a semi-treacherous tramp?!

Have a good weekend. Luna 1, over and out.

[–] The_Dying_Flutchman 15 years ago

You two guys are Gods of the Bs! I love your vast knowledges of tiny trivia. Why don't you partner up on a history of the immensely small? It would be so great!

What is the sound an imploding pimp makes?

[–] hobnob53 15 years ago

I guess it would have to be a little teeny weeny book, like the one the Amazing Colossal Man tried to read in his circus tent, to accommodate the subject.

Whence the pimp quote? It's great.

[–] The_Dying_Flutchman 15 years ago

Not so tiny if you include all the various excitements and tales from other web threads. I consider myself quite knowledgeable when it comes to movies, but you hobnob53 sir, are a veritable fountain of information. I am curious, do you like any of the current sf tv shows? My sig comes from myself; glad you enjoyed it.

What is the sound an imploding pimp makes?

[–] hobnob53 15 years ago

You are very kind, Yodzingie. Actually, someone else has urged me to undertake the exact same project. Well, we'll see. But I thank you for your generous compliment.

I have to admit I don't really watch any of the current sf shows on TV. I have a bias towards the old sf series of my youth (some of them in repeats), stuff from the 50s and 60s, so I guess I'm hopeless in that regard. Star Trek, obviously, and The Twilight Zone, The Outer Limits, Voyage to the Bottom of the Sea...not to mention real creakers like Science Fiction Theater, or the long-lost Men Into Space...remember that one?

God, I think I'm imploding!

[–] The_Dying_Flutchman 15 years ago

Yes, I recollect Men into Space. You must also have connexions most of us don't to be able to see these ancient things after all these aeons. I suppose you are in touch with those who own copies or originals of these old, crumbly thingies. Remember "Captain Zero"? How long ago was that?

What is the sound an imploding pimp makes?

[–] guanche 15 years ago

Glad I decided to revisit this thread! I'm sure you guys know a lot more than I do, but I'd be willing to help with any project about seemingly small minded things that have such a massive, and long term effect on the psyche.

Maybe I'm denser than I thought, but what sound DOES an imploding pimp (or as they say in the 'hood "mack daddy") make? Is it the same as the sound of an exploding white balloon tire?

I don't remember Captain Zero, but I do remember Captain Video projecting Flash Gordon flicks through a robot's belly. AND I once saw an episode of Tom Corbett Space Cadet being filmed when I was about 5 years old. The studio was in New York and my mother's cousin, Al Aley, was one of the writers. The cast members were very nice, particularly the "Astro" character and let my brother and I monkey around with the props.

I like some of the old sci fi stuff but my main reason for starting this was my long term crush on Marie Windsor. That's how I ended up in the booby hatch to begin with. They finally let me out. So, now I can get home early and meet some more of her brothers. I seem to meet a different one every time I do.

[–] hobnob53 14 years ago

Hi, Yodzingie -- No, I don't remember "Captain Zero" -- who was he?? Alas, I have no connections with anyone of interest. About ten years ago I managed to tape some of Men Into Space (and also Science Fiction Theater) when they were rerun (between 3 and 5 AM!) on the Sci-Fi channel (now, pointlessly, rechristened "syfy"), and while I haven't watched them in eons I still have the tapes I made, somewhere. But it was great to see the show again after forty years!

I guess you've already seen our friend gaunche's post below. He also doesn't know of Captain Zero. Please, enlighten us.

From your spelling ("connexions", "aeons") I surmise you're in Canada or the UK or some wonderful locale wherein they use English English. Where, may I ask?

hob

[–] The_Dying_Flutchman 14 years ago

Ha, Ha!! I am neither Canadian nor a UKer and I think you will be surprised when I tell you where I am. I am seated in Montana! I always play around with words as I enjoy word play and often times just being silly. My handle is what I presume my god to be. I have used it for over forty years. Here we are, all us silly boomers writing about tv shows that disappeaered a million aeons ago. I am a new comer to MT as I lived in Calif most of my days, but have semi-retired here in the state my mother was born and raised in. Much cheaper but nowhere near as warm.

Anyhoo, Captain Zero may have been a local show from my kidhood. Can only remember the guy was a time traveler and had a cadet with him who was a kid about 10 or so. I saw something on it on line when I was still in Calif. but they only said it was one of those 15 min. wonders on everyday. I remeber Zero had some kind of a floating ball that followed him around. The show was live not filmed. I have always been a Space Patrol adorer and have read everything I could about it as well, but I assume you guys know all that. Gotta blast off now and shut down my smokin' rockets!

What is the sound an imploding pimp makes?

[–] hobnob53 14 years ago

Tricky Montanan-by-way-of-California!

[–] The_Dying_Flutchman 14 years ago

What's the story of yer arrival on Terra?

What is the sound an imploding pimp makes?

[–] guanche 14 years ago

You still didn't tell us what an imploding pimp sounds like. Does Captain Zero know? If Marie was still with us she'd probably know. She played a madame at least once that I recall (Two Gun Lady).

[–] guanche 14 years ago

Does your handle "yodzingie" mean you are a Yezidi (who claim to pre-date both the Jews and Zoroastrians) from Iraq or Northern Syria? I understand that most of them now live in Detroit. If so, you're about as rare as a Catwoman (or man).

[–] The_Dying_Flutchman 14 years ago

You sound like an ok guy the kind that might understand my babblings. I may have heard of them peeps what are old jew imposters and that's how I came upon the great god Yod. Either that or I experienced gas one night and it lit me up. Both could be close to the trooth. And the sound an inploding pimp makes is rather the same as one hand clapping. Where does guanche eminate from? The far side of ziti?

What is the sound an imploding pimp makes?

[–] guanche 14 years ago

It was Captain Z-ro. I think the first show was in 1955.

[–] hobnob53 14 years ago

Me? I was sent here by the Lido to hobnob with Earthlings so as to discover their weaknesses and pave the way for a reverse invasion. Please note the 53...a coincidence that that was the same year as CWOTM? I think not.

Anyway, I ran afoul of the Lido when she discovered that I'd stolen her private cookie recipe and sold it to Pepperidge Farm. Right now I live off the aptly-named royalties, but when the spaceship is completed and I've trained enough cons to fly the thing I'll return to report the results of my hobnobbings and get back in her good graces by bringing back the recipe for gingerbread men to fight the rock men. So, I'm pretty clear on things.

[–] The_Dying_Flutchman 14 years ago

You're not only clear, you are transparent! Has there ever bin an old sf movie or tv show you thought was KRAP? Now you can see gaunche solved the mystery of Z-ro along with green things in general. Watched "Frankenstein Meets the Space Monster" recently after many years and it still stinks. Must fly now off to the semi-annual cave of the ancients convention in Trollenberg. Cheery bye!

What is the sound an imploding pimp makes?

[–] hobnob53 14 years ago

Of course, much 50s/60-s low-budget sf was awful. But there's fun-awful and really just bad, un-fun-awful. And even the latter kind of films are a bit excusable in comparison with stuff by some idiot who spends $150,000,000 to produce something lousy (the 1998 Americanized Godzilla comes to mind, but there are lots of others). At least the guy who spent $18,000 to film, say, The Astounding She Monster (or the not-much-higher budget for Cat-Women) had no pretentions to greatness, and probably had more fun trying to make that thing than teams of big egos have in shooting some $200 million piece of overblown trash (sf or otherwise...Amelia Earhart, anyone?). It isn't a question of quality so much as it is one of enjoyability.

[–] The_Dying_Flutchman 14 years ago

Right you are and I enjoyed the overblown newer "Godzilla" so I am a shanker potomus. Enjoyability is sacrosanct. Long live the Giant Crab Monsters!

What is the sound an imploding pimp makes?

[–] hobnob53 14 years ago

Ah, yes, I found Attack of the Crab Monsters quite enjoyable and scary in parts, not to mention its somewhat unusual (for a low-budgeter) plot line about the minds of the crabs' victims becoming absorbed into the crab and now taking their side against the remaining humans. Plausibility aside, it's an interesting, offbeat premise.

To return to Cat-Women, and per our conversation over on Invaders From Mars, I assume you know that CWOTM was not only filmed but actually released in 3-D. Some of the sets do give the appearance of having been designed for the process, but overall I'm not sure the effect really added much to this film. (The same holds true for that infamous but hugely enjoyable 3-D epic Robot Monster...like these other two also ground out in 1953.)

[–] The_Dying_Flutchman 14 years ago

I saw "Robot Monster" in 3D. Truly rewarding!

What is the sound an imploding pimp makes?

[–] hobnob53 14 years ago

Wow! Now that is a rarity...although I vaguely recall there was one VHS or DVD release of it in 3-D, complete with glasses -- am I correct? I understand there was one portion of the movie, the stock footage from One Million B.C., that was not in 3-D, which if true must've made for added viewing pleasure.

I'd like to see that, and Cat-Women, and some of those other old 3-D'ers in 3-D, just for the experience, and to see whether the process really made them more fun. (I hesitate to go as far as saying "better".)

[–] The_Dying_Flutchman 14 years ago

Get your droolers on --I saw it in a small arthouse cinema back in the mid-60's so cannot remember the dinosaur stuff. Back in them days, as you know, everything was on film. Saw some fascinating stuff at that place including the entire Lugosi "Chandu", King Kong with the actual armatures presented at a talk after the movie, the Captain Marvel serial, tons of Charlie Chan including "Black Camel" on and on. And tomorrow for Hellholeween, we're going to watch another very good Marie Windsor marvel -- "Chamber of Horrors". Got yer drool cup full yet?

What is the sound an imploding pimp makes?

[–] hobnob53 14 years ago

You lost me with Chamber of Horrors, which I saw in the cinema when it came out in 1966 and thought lousy then -- particularly that scream siren alert or whatever they called it. That was actually intended to be one of the first made-for-TV movies but was thought too gory and released theatrically instead. Marie did better with the cat-women, I think.

But your mid-60s movie experience sounds very cool-drool indeed.

Happy Halloween!

And, in honor of the day as observed by the Cat-Women of the Moon:

[–] The_Dying_Flutchman 14 years ago

Obviously I disagree about CofH, but then that makes the world the bottomless sewer of mediocrity that it is. Cheery bye.

What is the sound an imploding pimp makes?

[–] babettegillette 14 years ago

That Corman cheapie had much more mysogyny than CWOTM?

[–] guanche 14 years ago

Perhaps. But it was much funnier, and her role as a lady crime boss fit her much better. I don't know what her personal opinion was of the movie. The basis for my starting this thread was an interview in which she stated that "Catwomen" was the only film she was ashamed of. She did actually mention "Swamp Women" in that interview---saying that it was her most physically demanding movie, actually pulling those boats through a real bayou in oppressive heat with a real danger of gators and water snakes.