MovieChat Forums > Umberto D. (1955) Discussion > For anyone who is Italian or been to Ita...

For anyone who is Italian or been to Italy:

posted 17 years ago by EnemyOfTheState
9 replies | jump to latest

I am curious here.

This film really showed what a wretched society that Italy was. For instance, people on fixed incomes can be evicted from their place and had no place else to go.

Is this really accurate? Has the society changed that much?

I am particularly interested because I have relatives who live in Italy and tell me how Italian society really takes care of its poor and elderly. I do not necessarily believe them.

But I would definately say that that film was heartbreaking. I doubt if a film like that can be made in Hollywood.

[–] Milton_Hall 17 years ago

But I'd say things are probably quite different in Italy now from what they were then.

Remember, that movie was made and takes place in 1952, when Europeans were still trying to recover from the devastation of WWII. Have you seen Two Women with Sophia Loren? It dovetails nicely with this film, I think.

[–] EnemyOfTheState 17 years ago

No but I love Sophia Loren. She was the sexiest woman of her day. I will look for that one.

[–] cobram-1 17 years ago

Grapes of Wrath (or any of hundreds of others) showed what a wretched society...etc. etc. etc. Times change as the other poster noted.

Today just about everyone in Italy is on, or has someone in the family on a government pension. Tax rates are very high, unemployment very high, they still work under "Article 19", which is the labor law put in place by Mussolini. The labor law is incredibly favorable to the employee (not as bad as France, but close.) If you have a job, you’ve got it for life, if you have an employee, you’re pretty much married to them; it's cheaper to keep on an employee who does nothing than to fire them.

Just about every enterprise or business in Italy is subsidized, financed and backed by the government. They'll loan you money for you enterprise, and you're basically only obliged to pay back only 30% or so, but with the high cost of labor and just about every thing else (because of taxes) many find it hard/impossible to even pay back the 30%. The EU and the Euro has saved Italy's bacon for the time being, but sooner or later (as with Social Security here in the US) the pyramid scheme of social programs will break under their own weight. The Northern industrial cities pay in MUCH more to the system then they'll ever get in benefits, those in the South benefit MUCH more from the system than they pay in.

But for the time being, life is pretty sweet for the majority of Italians, when was the last time you met someone who is a recent immigrant from Italy? You don't leave when you've got it good.

[–] manutwo 17 years ago

I live in the so-called rich North-East of Italy. I agree with you that our Social Security system is in a terrible situation and the recently elected government is having a bad time trying to fix the situation. It's not true that EVERY enterprise gets easy money from the government. The 30% loans you are talking about are granted through a EC (European Community) law and they are usually given to the biggest companies. The small enterprises upon which the Italian economy is founded are not financed by the government. There are a few loan-programs but they are simply "on paper", because bureaucracy is overwhelming and you'd always better rely on yourself.

The notorious "article 18", which prevents companies to fire an employee unless they've got a VERY GOOD reason was approved in the seventies. Laws on motherhood and work are from the Mussolini's regime. Trade unions are very powerful and we are stuck in a situation where everyone wants to retain their privileges (trade unions, companies, workers, political parties, and so on).

Retired people are still in a bad situation today. Those who live in small towns or in the country are luckier, because their relatives take care of them. Those who live in big cities like Milan, Turin, Rome, find it difficult to survive to the end of the month, when they are given their money. This morning I read a survey: older people get poorer and poorer because of the medicines they have to buy. If there is a retired person in your family, you have half the chance to become poor, if you have two retired persons you're almost certain.

If you find my answers frightening, Vincent, you should cease askin' scary questions. Pulp Fiction

[–] EnemyOfTheState 17 years ago

A guy I work with was from the Northeast. He said things were really good until Berlesconi (excuse the spelling) took charge. He seems to think that the Socialists will make things better.

As an aside he told me that the Brigada Rosa (Red Brigade) did a lot to help the workers. Though it was portrayed elsewhere as a terrorist organization, they actually scared lots of employers into treating working people better.

[–] manutwo 17 years ago

Well, I have a "leftish" political preference, I hope you get what I mean, but your friend seems far more "leftish" than I am .
I think Berlusconi is just a good entertainer and I like him only because he is the president of my favourite soccer team, but as a politician he just cared about his legal problems and the legal problems of his friends and did not make much for my country. On the other hand I owe him that Italy entered a period of economical crises when he was elected and things seem to be a little better, and I don't think it's happening because of six months of a different government. Italian newspapers are packed with articles about how much Italians hate THIS government, which is literally asking for blood, sweat and tears. Anyway I'm crossing my fingers and hoping for the best.

The Red Brigade? Really, it's difficult for me to think about Brigate Rosse as a positive thing. I do think they were terrorists, and I also think they somehow stole some of the best young minds of the period. They wanted a revolution that the majority of the Italian people did not understand and they KILLED those who openly rejected their theories (professors, policemen, judges, they kidnapped and killed the Italian Prime Minister Aldo Moro, who was trying to get the Communist party to share the Government). I don't know, I prefer fighting for my ideas with arguments than with weapons, even if it might take longer.

If you find my answers frightening, Vincent, you should cease askin' scary questions. Pulp Fiction

[–] RagingBull24 17 years ago

Basically you just have to remember that this film, like other films of the Italian Neorealist movement, set out to accurately and realistically depict what was going on at the time. As for how things are today, I don't know.

[–] nutsberryfarm 7 years ago

yep, it's about to change...

🎄Season's Greetings!🎄

[–] freejunkmail2004 17 years ago

If you watch the special features on the Criterion Collection disc, you'll hear Maria say that nothing has changed since then.