MovieChat Forums > I Love Lucy (1951) Discussion > Lucy and Fred

Lucy and Fred

posted 7 years ago by [email protected] (5497)
18 replies | jump to latest

Did anyone ever notice how affectionate Lucy was with Fred in the first season ? No not like she was flirting with him. But she hugged him and gave him a few kisses on the cheek. Lucy seemed to have a great affection for Fred.

I read that Lucille Ball had a brother named Fred. I'm guessing that's where the name of the character came from.

Lucy Ricardo looked at Fred like an older brother or uncle. She was very sweet to him in a number of early episodes. Later on that behavior was dropped. Lucy treated Fred almost the same way Ethel did. lol

But still, early in the series, Lucy seemed to be very devoted to Fred as if he was her uncle. Did anyone else notice how sweet she was to him in a few early episodes?

[–] [email protected] (1732) 7 years ago

I do, but I feel that Lucy always had an underlying affection for Fred. Lucy's the one who shows sympathy for him after
that old car debacle ("Gee, I felt sorry for Fred"). Also feel that after a fight Lucy missed BOTH Ethel and Fred, not just
Ethel. Ricky, too, could be a bit eye-rolling at Ethel, but deep down, had great affection for her as well.

[–] [email protected] (5497) 7 years ago

Yeah Lucy does show sympathy for Fred.

Lucille Ball did use a lot of friend and family names on the show. Like I wrote, she had a brother named Fred. I can't help but think that Fred Mertz was sort of a brother figure to her.

Lucille Ball also lost her father at a very young age. On ILL Lucy has a mother, but obviously her father has passed away. Interesting how Lucy used elements from her real life in Lucy Ricardo's life

[–] [email protected] (1732) 7 years ago

Well, it's more than obvious that Ethel's mother has passed away in "Ethel's Home Town." We don't KNOW this
a hundred percent, but I doubt they were separated or divorced and lived in two different states!

It appears Lucy and Ethel had no siblings, but it's mentioned that Ricky has several brothers, and Fred has at least
one brother.

[–] [email protected] (5497) 7 years ago

The Ethel hometown episode made me wonder about a few things! Ethel's father says, "We kept your room exactly the way it was since you left."

So Ethel never went home for a visit in over twenty years? Boy, I knew her dad couldn't stand Fred but that was kinda extreme. lol

That brings me back to an early episode when Ethel went to visit her mother. If they had been keeping her room just the way it was, where did Ethel sleep when she visited? hmmmm

I really do get a feeling that Ethel's parents were divorced (or separated) and her mother lived on the east coast. Just can't see Fred, cheap as he was, willing to pay for Ethel's transportation out to New Mexico for her to make a trip alone. Of course Ethel's parents may have wanted to see her real badly, so they sent her train fare.

Yeah I remember Fred had a brother who was arranging the fishing trip for him and Ricky. Too bad we never got to see him or Ricky's brothers. But in a thirty minute sitcom there wasn't time to introduce a whole lot of characters.

[–] [email protected] (1732) 7 years ago

Well, they're not real people, so it's all in our imaginations, but I see Ethel's mom passing away between
"Lucy Does a TV Commercial" and "Ethel's Hometown." Don't sense divorce whatsoever. To each his own.

What I think is weird is Ethel mentioning how FRED'S MOTHER (!) does a heavy cleaning inspection every time
SHE comes to visit. Wouldn't this lady be in her 90's???? The line would've read better if Ethel had said,
"Every time Fred's mother CAME to visit...."

Death /divorce weren't big on sitcoms then, even though the women's gossip always centered on which
couples had broken up ("There was just no other way for that marriage to go").

[–] [email protected] (5497) 7 years ago

Yes, it's all in fun speculating and using our imaginations.

Maybe not divorced, but I can picture Mrs. Potter leaving Ethel's father. I mean, it's said that girls often marry men who remind them of their fathers, and I sure can see Mr. Potter being as crotchety as Fred.
Of course his "Ethel Mae" was the apple of his eye. But maybe he didn't treat his wife so nice so she finally picked up and moved back east to be with family. Remember the Ed Warren interview episode? Ethel's Aunt Martha and Uncle Elmo wanted an apartment in the building. I like to think Aunt Martha was Mrs. Potter's sister.

Of course I have nothing to go on but my fevered imagination! ha! It's true that sitcoms didn't mention divorce in those days. Wasn't Vivian Bagley the first divorced main character on a sitcom?

As for Fred's MOTHER visiting every year! Yeah, I wondered about that for a number of reasons. Like you said she would be quite elderly.

Ethel was just trying to give Lucy a heads up since it was her mother-in law's first visit. But definitely her comments would've made more sense in the past tense.

"Before you and Ricky moved into the building, Fred's mother used to come every year for an inspection, etc..."

I just don't see Ethel having to explain to Lucy that Fred's mother comes every year to visit. Wouldn't Lucy KNOW that? I mean the two women knew each other's business only slightly less than they knew their own. lol

Ethel would be in Lucy's apartment bemoaning the fact that her mother-in-law would be arriving AGAIN! And I'm sure the Mertzes would have introduced her to the Ricardos. They were best friends.

TV shows are never able to satisfy their diehard fans with enough facts. I am a Star Trek fan and you wouldn't believe the number of fan fics that I have read over the years!!

[–] [email protected] (1732) 7 years ago

I also think it's weird that Fred INFORMS Lucy that Ethel is out of town in "Lucy Does a TV Commercial."
Wouldn't have Ethel TOLD Lucy that??? Makes me think Ethel was called away suddenly, alhtough
Fred is a bit too jolly in the scene for something of that nature to be going on.

I also find it funny in "Madame X" that Lucy and Ricky didn't know that Fred had "a birthday coming
up." I think the line should've been Lucy saying, "Oh, that's right, it's your birthday this month,
isn't it?" And then Fred saying, "Yep. A week from Thursday." Sometimes the writers seems to forget
how truly close the couples were.

After watching "No Children Allowed" for the third time in a month, I thought it odd that both Lucy
and Ethel had a four-person table of bridge planned, but neither KNEW about it? Were they THAT
exclusive with their friends???

[–] [email protected] (5497) 7 years ago

Yes that moment when Fred is telling Lucy that Ethel went out of town never made sense to me. Even if Ethel was called away suddenly, she'd take a minute to tell Lucy and probably ask her to invite Fred to dinner.

For one thing, Fred couldn't cook! Remember in 'Redecorating the Mertzes Apartment' he had a salami sandwich and a bottle of beer for breakfast! But then again, in 'The Diner', we learn that he and Ethel had experience working in a diner. Of course he may have never worked behind the grill.

I've seen moments in other sitcoms where one character is informing another of something the other person would obviously know. That type of exposition is more about informing the audience.

But it would've made more sense for Lucy to ask Fred something like, "Did Ethel say how long she'd be visiting her mother?"

Yes the Ricardos would've known Fred had a birthday coming up. But they acted like they never knew when his birthday was.

And both women having a table for bridge! Every other time they played bridge, Lucy and Ethel were together.

I think they wrote it that way so Ethel could storm out while saying, " My half of the party, come downstairs" and "THAT"S my sandwich!" as she grabs it away from one of Lucy's guests.

One other thing I wonder about in that episode, Lucy had a newborn who was keeping her up nights, but she seemed full of energy. She planned and hosted a bridge party. Yet in the next episode 'Lucy Hires a Maid', she falls asleep setting up the card table for their bridge game.
But we had to see an exhausted Lucy as a reason for her to get a maid.

[–] [email protected] (1732) 7 years ago

Well, she wasn't exhausted every single day - newborns don't cry EVERY single night. They are
unpredictable. That I know.

But you'd think Lucy would find it risky to have EIGHT women - plus Ethel - over in that small
apartment, chattering away, when the baby could interrupt things at any moment, starting to
wail, with all that CHATTERING! Then Lucy would have to leave the game, change diapers,
feed the baby, ugh! (all this is reminding me how happy I am I never went through all this....or
losing teeth, or bad grades, or my kids getting bullied, or high school, or college....No, thanks).

[–] [email protected] (5497) 7 years ago

Yes true, little babies don't cry every night (if you are lucky!), but new mothers are exhausted every day regardless. The exhaustion usually only lasts until the kid goes to kindergarten. LOL But I exaggerate... Gee you aren't sorry that you missed out on the "fun" aspects of parenting? ha

However you did hit the nail on the head, Lucy hosting a party with a sleeping baby in the next room. HUH??

Every mother I have ever known with a sleeping baby usually says the same thing. "SHhhhhhh, be quiet. Don't wake the baby!!!"

But Lucy invites eight chattering women into her living room. Well it was a sitcom.

Going back to birthdays, I have to wonder what possessed Lucy to buy those goofy pants for Ethel's birthday. She knew Ethel for years, surely she knew her taste in clothes.

Okay, she didn't want to get the toaster Fred suggested. But she should have known what her friend would like! I know what my friends like and would prefer as a gift.

Ethel would never need those "checkerboard britches" for the "smart dinner parties" which Lucy knew she never gave. Sometimes I think it was passive/aggressive on Lucy's part.

[–] [email protected] (1732) 7 years ago

Ethel never really got a chance to HAVE taste in clothes, as Fred was so cheap, and all
she wore were those UGLY house dresses (except when Ethel would suddenly be seen
in a FUR coat in "Vacation from Marriage" or that beautiful dress at the end of
"Lucy's Club Dance").

The hostess pants were a bit far out, and I think Lucy knew she was taking a risk. But
one can see why Ethel was scowling (then howling) when she saw them and thought
Fred bought them.

[–] [email protected] (5497) 7 years ago

I think Ethel had some taste in clothes, she just had NO money to buy them. LOL

Like she told Fred about buying her clothes at Hansen's Dress Shop. "I bought all my dresses there since we've been married. All THREE of them."

As Lucy told Fred when she made the bet to tell the truth, "If you weren't so cheap, Ethel wouldn't have to go around looking so tacky."

Of course Ethel's character exaggerated a bit for the comedic effect. She didn't have the stylish clothes that Lucy had. After the first season, Lucille Ball's wardrobe was created for her by Elois Jensen, a professional designer. Vivian Vance got 'off the rack' housedresses. But Ethel was about as well groomed as one could expect since she was on a budget.

But those hostess pants! ha! Maybe Lucy was trying to give her a makeover.

But speaking of clothes again, I don't wonder that Ricky blew his stack over Lucy's $50 hats! Today that seems like a lot of money for a hat. I'd NEVER pay it. But in the 1950's that was a week take home pay for working class people. I wonder why the writers settled on that amount?

My grandmother got a factory job in the fifties and she brought home $30 a week. In today's money Lucy would probably be spending about $500 on a hat. No wonder Ricky lost his temper. Lucy was lucky that Ricky was so generous.

[–] [email protected] (1732) 7 years ago

My feeling is that because LUCILLE BALL WAS A BEAUTIFUL STAR, they sort of made
it part of the comedy that Lucy Ricardo was soooooooo obsessed with clothes (and
definitely appearances - like telling Cynthia that Ricky was "loaded"). Ball wore
a lot of the same dresses over and over (the polka dot house dress comes to mind,
as well as the white dress that sort of looked like a VASE with all the flowers in the
middle!).

Some of the most beautiful gowns were (oddly) only worn ONCE. One that comes
to mind is the dress Lucy wears to be interviewed in By Alvia Allman when they
return to New York. It is STUNNING in design, and absolutely complemented
Ball's (then) gorgeous body (she was at her slimmest in seasons four and five).

BTW, Elois Jensen stated that she was fired without warning at (I believe) the
end of season four. She was quite devastated, as nobody gave her a reason. She
claimed she called Ball personally about it , and (according to Jensen), Lucy started
to cry, stating she didn't even know why!! Not sure I buy that, but Ball DID give
in to Arnaz and Jess O when it came to business dealings. Lucy and Desi were
also known to be extremely tight, and it's possible they were trying to cut corners,
and increase their personal wealth. The richer people get, the more heads that
seem to get lopped.

[–] [email protected] (5497) 7 years ago

I think I was obsessed with Lucy's clothes too. Ten years ago I bought a Lucy paper doll book on ebay. It contains some of her more well known outfits and the number of times that she wore them. And in color too, so you can see what they looked like.

According to the notes in the book, Lucy wore off the rack clothes in the first season. The show didn't have a big budget. When Elois Jensen came onboard, she had to start from scratch. The show had NO wardrobe department.

I love the white "vase" dress. Lucy wore it six times. But Elois Jensen said that it made Lucy look "too statuesque" next to her co-stars, so she added the flower pattern to de-emphasize her height.

The polka dot dress was a popular dress in the fifties. It says, "Variations of this dress were featured in more than 25 episodes!"

Lucille Ball did like to repeat outfits because it seemed normal that a housewife would do that.

One of my favorites is the dress she wore at the beginning of 'The Black Wig'. It had a blue bodice and a red and blue striped skirt with a red petticoat. (worn 4 times)

The gown Lucy and Ethel wore in the 'Friendship' song was designed to break apart. I thought so!

But interesting that Ethel was able to buy the same gown as Lucy. Fred was cheap but obviously Ethel could spend money on clothes sometime.

I read elsewhere that Elois Jensen asked for a raise after three season and that's why she was let go.
Yes, Desilu could be tight with the budget!

If I was Desi, I'd say, "She makes my wife look great, give her a raise."

[–] [email protected] (1732) 7 years ago

Yes, that dress Lucy wears in "The Black Wig" (and in the "There's No Business
Like Show Business" audition song in "Eyes Examined") is unique and lovely.
I also love that sort of black "robe" Lucy wore a lot (welcoming, say, Eleanor
Harris in "Fan Magazine Interview"). It really showed off Lucy's lovely body.

Funny how people view things. My mom always comments that Lucy was "not
slim", while my friend Janice always commented that Ball "had a gorgeous
body" (and she was NOT and ILL fan). Lucy said in the '80's, that every time
she ran across a rerun, all she saw was a lady who was "fat" from having babies
and who had a funny hairdo!

Truth is somewhere in the middle. While Vance was usually considerably
heavier than Ball (Vance was at her slimmest in season two; her heaviest
in season four), Lucy was chubby in the first two seasons, due to her
pregnancies (her weight gain is actually written into several scripts). But,
yes, her gowns STILL look stunning and have held up well over time.

[–] [email protected] (5497) 7 years ago

I can't believe Lucille Ball thought she was fat! Sure the first few seasons she didn't have her showgirl figure from her MGM days. But she had two caesareans almost back to back. Not easy to spring back from that right away.

I love that outfit in 'Fan Magazine Interview' when she "isn't trying to impress" the writer. (ha)

Mrs Ricardo do you always dress like that while getting breakfast?

Yes, I don't like to wear my good things just puttering around the house.
That outfit was worn by her in ten episodes.

The "robe" is actually called a housecoat. I learned that from the paper doll book!
That was a very popular style back then. I'm sure I've seen other actresses wear something similar in movies. My Barbie doll had that outfit! it was my favorite. Only the housecoat was gold lace.

Lucy had another housecoat number which she only wore twice (I would've worn it more!), both times in L.A. It's beautiful in the color picture, red roses and sprigs of greenery with red piping.

Some of Lucy's wilder outfits were re-used and I never noticed until I saw them in the book. For instance , the
gown Lucy wears after her charm school make-over is worn again when she is a "wicked city woman" enticing Cousin Ernie.
In the second episode she doesn't wear the long gloves and puffy detached sleeves. She wears many strands of beads and pearls instead.

There's one dress that isn't shown in the book, but it's one of my favorites. In 'The Business Manager' when Lucy "went into the market" Ricky asks her if she's wearing a new dress. It's a beautiful brocade material.

Lucy sure could make almost anything look good.

In the Connecticut episodes though, Lucy and Ethel seem to be dressing more casually in keeping with the country setting. Vivian Vance was finally able to scrap most of those dowdy housedresses.

[–] [email protected] (1732) 7 years ago

Lucy also wears the the "beautiful brocade" dress at the dinner table in
"Ethel's Birthday." The dress she wears as "the wicked city woman", she
also wears early on in the series. The episodes is "Be a Pal", and Lucy
dresses up for Ricky's breakfast, trying to capture his attention.

I feel the dress isn't particularly flattering to Ball, and she looks rather
thick-waisted in it.

Yes, in those country eps, Ether traded in her dowdy house dresses for
those dowdy jeans skirts and sandles.

[–] [email protected] (5497) 7 years ago

Oh yes, forgot that Lucy wears the brocade dress in the birthday episode. I do like that dress so much.

The 'wicked city woman' gown really was not very flattering to Lucy, I agree

A gown I thought was very flattering was the one she was seen in briefly at the very end of 'Lucy's Club Dance.' It had a full skirt and was off the shoulders.

Poor Ethel, from dowdy housedresses to dowdy pants! lol I did think her "glamour" dress in 'The Country Club Dance' was more becoming than Lucy's though. Lucy's dress was waaay too tight to be flattering. Of course it was made that way so Lucy could do her shtick about not being able to sit down and sliding across the living room floor.