MovieChat Forums > The Women (1939) Discussion > What's the deal with the one scene in co...

What's the deal with the one scene in color?


Is it just me or did that scene feel really out of place with the rest of the movie? I realize that it set up a great showdown between Norma Shearer and Joan Crawford, but it felt really long and tedious, and I really didn't understand why it was in color.

Minus that one scene, I absolutely adored this movie. Another great Hollywood bitchfest, and almost as good as All About Eve.

I need to get my drink on- Pearl http://www.imdb.com/mymovies/list?l=8093247

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I am not 100% sure of this but I believe it was a tribute to Adrian the famous clothing designer at MGM. He had been complaining about the lack of glamour in movies, he was not selected to costume any characters in Gone With the Wind which MGM released later that year - thus he was given his own fashion show in color for the movie.

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Interesting... okay, well I guess in honor of Adrian, I will have to appreciate the scene.

I need to get my drink on- Pearl http://www.imdb.com/mymovies/list?l=8093247

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The real reason has to do with the contract that the studio had with the Technicolor company. Certain studios contracted with that company and were required to shoot so much footage using their process. Therefore, many studios first started using color in short films. (MGM was a frontrunner in using color for their shorts in color in the early thirties. Of course that color was two-strip rather than the three-strip that became the norm after 1935.) In the early thirties, MGM would film certain musical scenes in color for some musicals. For example, 1929's Broadway Melody showcases "The Wedding of the Painted Dolls" in color (although you'd be hardpressed these days to find a print that contains the color sequence).

After the process of three-strip was used for the short La Cucaracha and the feature Becky Sharp, both 1935, studios started to take an interest in color features, but they were still a bit wary of using it because of the expense and the difficult conditions of filming in color (large camera, extreme heat, extra attention paid to color schemes). So, by 1939, the year of The Women, only a few films in color were released: Drums Along the Mohawk, Four Feathers, The Mikado, The Private Lives of Elizabeth and Essex, The Wizard of Oz, Gulliver's Travels (an animated feature), and of course, Gone With the Wind, each from a different major studio. There may have been a couple of others. This was also the first year that the Academy created a separate category for color cinematography, which had been a special award between 1936 and 1938.

I guess the point I'm getting to is that major studios fulfilled their contracts at this time with special color sequences in big budget black and white films rather than use it on too many features. So, they always found scenes that would be enhanced by the use of color, and that is certainly the case with The Women.

"That was a good movie. You should have been in that movie."

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Also, if you go waaaaay back to the sensibility of the 1930's, I imagine promoting a major motion picture in Technicolor- even partial Technicolor- probably spelled huge box-office sales back then. Color in movies was as new then as it would be in television twenty years later. So anticipation on a film that could promote itself to be "partially shot in Technicolor" would go through the roof!!

Can you imagine the gasps from the 1939 audiences of TW when the curtains part at the start of the fashion show, and the film goes to color?!!

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Thanks for the background information, creightonhale.

Tell me, wasn't there a 1939 film that MGM had originally planned on filming in color but had to go to black and white because of the production of "Gone with the Wind" using up all the color film stock?

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I don't know about 1939, but when Irving Thalberg was going to produce "Marie Antoinette" starring his wife Norma Shearer, it was supposed to be a lavish Technicolor picture. After Thalberg's death, MGM changed it to black and white. All the money spent on details in both costuming and backgrounds to take advantage of the Technicolor were wasted. The film is still lovely but I wish it had been done in Technicolor.

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Creightonhale: Thank you for the detailed explanation. It's greatly appreicated. I also thought the fashion show filmed in colour was a nod toward Adrian. I have always loved this film and it was a joy seeing it again this evening.

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I liked it a lot. Maybe color was superohmygod expensive in 1939... and they wanted to be prudent. Whatever the reason, I thought it worked.

Yes, almost as good as All About Eve ... which is one of my all time faves.

Bambi

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Also, ladies of their social status had nothing to do but "do lunch" and
fashion shows, among other things. I think the fashion show in color, was very creative as well as inventive, and gave us some insight as to how women of stature spent their time.

"OOO...I'M GON' TELL MAMA!"

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I know lots of people who watch this movie JUST sit and wait for the fashion show. guys, mostly. well, gay guys. yeah, all the guys I work with.

my goal as an actress? to remain on payroll

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I think the use of Technicolor in this film was something of a test run for a bigger project- THE WIZARD OF OZ.

And while GONE WITH THE WIND ended up being released by MGM, the technical decision of filming in color was not Mayer's, but Selznick's- that was his production, not MGM's.

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I think the fashion show is a hoot. Those clothes are hideous!! I love when the monkey is wearing the same outfit as the model....I laugh my head off every time!!!

nice socks, man.....

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I agree that it felt strange; however, color footage was new and one of MGM's focus at that time was to showcase the fashions that could rival the imagination of the magnificent Edith Head - call it a small "FU" shot at "Vogue" Magazine and "Harper's Bazzar" - seems to me that they ere getting a little tired of being disregarded at the Ball of the "High Fashion" ...... jmho.

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What I want to know is if the names of the fashion models in the color section are listed anywhere. They don't appear to be on IMDB. One of them, the striking lady in the red and white outfit who throws the flowers at the "bull" in the picnic scene, looked a lot like Ruth Hussey, who plays Stephen's secretary in the regular part of the movie. If it isn't her, I'd just like to know who she is. All the models were gorgeous, but this one really stood out. Anyone know where a list could be found? I'm tempted to write to TCM's Robert O., but they probably are too busy to reply.

Katie Sloan
Eugene, OR

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First time I saw The Women the colour sequence, to me, felt shoe-horned in. It was meant to showcase the new Technicolour technology, but it was now the one part of the film that looked dated, and slowed the pace of the film.

Seceond time round I found it fitted in better.

The only decent suggestion I read regarding a remake of The Women was that the fashion scene should be shot in black and white.

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Did anyone else find that swimsuit cover with the hand hanging off it to be creepy in the extreme or is it just me!?!

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Some of the fashions are amazing - some of the hats were almost like the stereotypical witches hats.

The severed hand seems to have been inspired by Dali. I can't imagine too many people wanting to wear that though. It's not easy to catch this on a tv, but there are also hands on the inside of the wrap and a hand just above the model's pubic area.

That was very interesting about studios having to use so much Technicolor footage. I wonder if that was part of the equation during pre-production of "The Wizard of Oz".

I have no idea what was on the back of the last model's gloves - kind of looked like door stops with a cut glass bauble on the end.

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I thought it was weird too! I LOVED the black dress though. It was sparkly and had black teulle on the shoulder. I thought it looked really modern. I thought the bathing suits were really odd. Most of the fashion show made me laugh.

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This movie was created for a female audience during the depression, and that scene was clearly put in so the audience could go, "ohhh! ahhh! Look at the fancy dresses!" This is a movie about wealthy socialites, and there would be much admiring by the audience of a lifestyle that was way beyond their budget. But yeah, the scene is totally out of place and doesn't do anything for the movie.

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The color sequence is garish and AWFUL and completely takes the viewer out
of the movie. It's also pretentious as hell and I highly doubt that this
was Cukor's idea. I'll bet he hated it. This is pure executive MGM. Some
non-artist thinking that, with "The Wizard of Oz" (doing the same thing -
only EFFECTIVELY) and "Gone With the Wind" soon to be released with color,
this was a cute gimmick to announce more technicolor films on the horizon.
Well, WHO CARES? Black-and-white is NOT inferior to color; it's merely
a different art form. The fashion show would've looked just as effective
in B & W and shoving the intense technicolor in our eyes just for a gimmick
was a poor choice at best. Today, on TV, it looks like someone accidentally
hit the remote and changed channels. Pointless, bad mistake.

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what everyone on this post is failing to mention is that the fashion show was filmed in both Technicolor and B&W with two different cameras. The studios knew that not all theaters would be equiped to run the technicolor segment and that the average middle class movie goer wouldn't care all that much about a 4 minute color segment.

Please remember that movies were presented to the public then in a much different fashion (no pun intended) than today. There were big releases and general releases. The big releases were the top dollar A-list films and they were released to the palaces first before going to the general public. The movie palaces of the day could not be afforded by the average middle or lower class citizen thereby ensuring that the big name films would only be seen by the 'right type' of people during the first release. After the run in the palaces, the bigger films would then go on roadshow engagments. Kinda like a traveling show, they would go from small city to city and present the film for a premium price (but no where near as high as at the palaces)to the average folk. After the roadshow it would go into general release at the local theaters at normal price.

The color segment in question here was pretty much only screened at the palaces and roadshows so most people never even got a chance to see it. For many,many years TV only screened the B&W version.

It is only now in modern times during the information age that an interest in how films were originally presented is becoming commonplace and these types of curio's and anamolies are coming out of the proverbial woodwork more and more.

ENJOY!

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Sorry, but the DVD of The Women has, as an extra, the fashion show in black-and-white ... diffent angles, shots, different everything, except, of course, the models in the same outfits. It was filmed as an option, in case the movie was entirely presented in black-an-white. Remember, color and B&W had their own lighting, makeup, etc. -- and just printing color to B&W made everything look pretty bad.

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Technicolor sequences in movies had a long history going back almost 20 years to the days of two strip Technicolor. I really don't understand the complaints, Technicolor is an attraction in itself even if the subject matter is worthless.



Tell me, wasn't there a 1939 film that MGM had originally planned on filming in color but had to go to black and white because of the production of "Gone with the Wind" using up all the color film stock?


Technicolor films are shot on three strips of black and white film. If there was a limiting factor it was the number of Technicolor cameras.

The studios knew that not all theaters would be equiped to run the technicolor segment and that the average middle class movie goer wouldn't care all that much about a 4 minute color segment.


The projector doesn't care whether it's b&w or colour film running through it.


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This is exactly the case with "Sex and the City"......a fashion show/fantasy put on for a female audience. On this board, most people seem to understand that....thank you!

At the Sex and the City board, it's become bloodsport, with many vile things being hurled around.

I love fashion/money/fantasy movies whether they were made in 39 or 08.

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