MovieChat Forums > Murder! (1930) Discussion > Question about the 'half-caste.'

Question about the 'half-caste.'

posted 19 years ago by jtf1972
32 replies | jump to latest

**Spoilers ahead***

I just finished watching Murder! for the first time. Handel Fane is "half-caste," meaning of corse he has mixed blood. I am unfamiliar with English terminology of 1930, but I was wondering if half black (as is said in the film) actually meand what it does today, or if the term "black" just meant a sort of unsavory blood line (as Irish might have been seen by the "proper" Englishman.

I believe that the term "black" when used to describe a person of African ancestry was actually seen as insulting in America in this time, and Negro was prefered. In 1930 England was this also the case? Sir John was certainly shocked by the revelation that the man he sought was "half-caste," but he didn't seem to be put off by this and his "half black" comment did not seem to be degrading or insulting in any way. In 1930 this lack of a great reaction would lead me to believe that he meant "black" as to be Irish or something similar. In much the same as a "black mark" has nothing to do with anyone of African ancestry, it is quite possible that Sir John's comment about Fane being half black may have had nothing to do with his parent's races.

This may just be a simple misunderstanding due to changing terms over decades...

[–] 19 years ago

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[–] 19 years ago

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[–] piet-vandenbrande 17 years ago

I do not believe that is should have something to do with "Irish" descent.
I think one should take it literal. But if he is of half black descendancy, it should be visible. Of course, he could use make up as an actor. It still remains a question why nobody could "see" that he is brown as one should expect from a mulatto. In French, "mulâtre" means "half-caste". But is it true for all languages? F.i.: a person born from Indian and Black parents is called "Zambo". It is a Portuguese word that is used in South-America but which is not used in North-America.

[–] flan99 17 years ago

"half-caste

Half caste is a term used in the United Kingdom and other English-speaking parts of the world. An example is a child of black African and white European parentage.

The term originates from the Indian caste-system, where a person of 'lesser' or half-caste would be deemed to be of a 'lower class'."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Half-caste

[–] TimesSquareAngel 17 years ago

Considering that India was still part of the British Empire when this film was shot or just about to liberate itself from colonial domination, I think Handel Fane is half-Indian (south east asian variety). "Black" is very much a term used for Indians by British colonials. Watch "Staying On" or "The Jewel in the Crown" and "half-caste" and "black" have very definite usages and connotations.

[–] marbleann 17 years ago

Yes exactly it means a person is half East Indian.

[–] jmasalle 17 years ago

Listen. Half-caste was a common term up until the 1970s in the English world including the caribbean to mean a half black (African) and half white (European) person. Period.

[–] PACman66 16 years ago

Actually this is really interesting, as this is the first time I had ever heard that term was in this movie (Watched it on 11/12/07).
Thank You.

P

Trust me,
Swan

[–] segh 16 years ago

In the book Handel Fane is half Indian - the word "Eurasian" is also used.

[–] saralindaroberts 15 years ago

Actually the English often referred to East Indians as black (a specific example is in one of the shows of the 'Fawlty Towers' series), so Handel Fane could very easily been half Indian.

[–] annisgian 16 years ago

This term was also applied to half asian-half english offspring as well.

"I want to be able to trust you. You know; It's about trust". -A.Rothstien

[–] morgana-31 16 years ago

I'm interested from a genetics point of view.
The term half-caste was in popular use until the 60s to mean someone who had one black and one white parent. I would expect such a person to exhibit characteristics of both - but in old movies the person frequently gets away with looking totally white. (Showboat's character Julie being another example.)
I think there might have been some sort of ban on hiring genuine half-castes in the 30s. Would anyone know if this was the case?

Love is never having to say you're sober.

[–] FuturePrimitive666 16 years ago

I suppose what all of YOU are saying is true, but it is my opinion that the 'Half-Caste' remark was referring to the obvious homosexuality of Hanel Fane. I mean, he was a female impersonater in the film. Although, it would be a bit odd for a homosexual to fall in love with a woman, but I am certain that happens on occasion. He is supposed to have killed said woman, because she found out from Diana Baring that he was 'Half-Caste'. I guess 78 years later, I myself, cannot understand the fuss that would be made over a man who would be half-Caucasian and half-Indian/African or whatever. Thinking of the likes of Freddie Mercury, etc., this would seem to be quite an archaic mentality. Just my thoughts! FuturePrimitive666.

"*bleep* it all and *bleep*ing no regrets!"

[–] morgana-31 16 years ago

I appreciate that in 1930 you were not allowed to openly allude to homosexuality in a movie so it could have been slipped in another way.
But Fane was not exclusively a female impersonator. Those traveling theatre troops would have had a limited number of players and many would have to play multiple parts. It's not unusual for a man to portray a woman and vice versa.
And as you pointed out yourself it is unusual for a homosexual to fall in love with a woman, so I'd take it as read he was a half-caste.

And being a half-caste was reason enough for Diana to reject him. Mixed marriages and the offspring of such were very much frowned upon in those days.

Love is never having to say you're sober.

[–] Jumbajookiba 16 years ago

Totally wrong on that one, it was never a term used with regards to homosexuality. I'm sick of people out there who seem to want to bring in a question of sexuality no matter when it is obviously not an issue as in this case. That goes for all the biographers who, if we belive them all would have us think that all Hollywood stars from before the 1960's were gay or lesbian, I even read that Clark Gable was a 'gay for pay' a book whatever that is meant to mean. Yes, there were gay stars, Ramon Novarro and William Haines were known to be as was Raymond Burr, all fantastic actors, but, not every actor was or is.

I am a four eyed evil genius.

[–] FuturePrimitive666 16 years ago

I could care less who is actually Gay or not in Hollywood, as long as the subject doesn't always play such a prominent role itself, as it does in many Hollywood comedies, these days. I only said, that I felt that the way I understood the film, was that the women would have had more a problem dealing with the fact that Fane was Gay then with the fact that he may have had a non-Caucasian parent. But, YOU are right, Jumbajookiba, in yet once more proving to me and many others, that the racial issue is still more a stigma in Hollywood some 78 years later than is the sexuality issue, which in Hollywood has probably never been an issue at all. FuturePrimitive666.

"*bleep* it all and *bleep*ing no regrets!"

[–] Ruckmaker 16 years ago

The term half-caste was used in England more often than not in reference to Indians -- that is, people from India. Believe it or not, Indians were called blacks, darkies, and the dread "N" word by the British for many many years. I've seen the term used often in books from the 30s. Agatha Christie's book Ten Little Indians was originally called Ten Little *beep* The British may have been high and mighty about racism in America, but they were more than guilty of it themselves when it came to the empire. That is why Merle Oberon had to hide the fact that she was part-Indian because it would have ruined her career. I doubt that this character was meant to be part Caribbean, as someone here suggested. Also the name Fayn seems to me to be used as a pun on his "fay" character. He is definitely played as a homosexual in the film. It was common -- and still is, alas -- to use transvestites and homosexuals as deranged killers. Hitchcock used the device again in Psycho many years later. Silence of the Lambs is a good modern example. But the question raised here in this post is whether Fayn was of African or Indian descent, and I think it is absolutely clear that he was half-Indian regardless of his sexual orientation.

"It is a very sad thing that nowadays there is so little useless information." Oscar Wilde

[–] slbbooksmusicfilm 16 years ago

From an interview with Alfred Hitchcock by Francois Truffaut:

FT: ...let's get back to Murder which in essence is a thinly disguised story about homosexuality. In the final scene at the circus, the murderer is shown as a transvestite as he confesses he killed the victim because she was about to his fiancee all about him, about his special mores. Wasn't that rather risque at the period?

AH: Yes, in that sense it was daring.

(page 75 of the 1985 edition of Hitchcock-Truffaut).

[–] cmbrower 11 years ago

I don't think that Sir John would have been so shocked to find out that Fane is gay!

[–] J. Spurlin 16 years ago

I think we can take "black blood" literally to mean what it seems to mean. How shocking would it have been for someone to have Irish blood?

But the half-caste business is a red herring. I understand what another poster said about modern viewers reading sexuality into old movies when it doesn't belong. But Murder! is very, very clearly about a homosexual who commits murder to avoid exposure. Sir John says half-caste and black blood because the censors wouldn't have allowed him to say anything else.

...Om

[–] jrhpax 15 years ago

Finally, J. Spurlin, someone gets the point. "Half-caste," which means "Eurasian," or part-Indian, part-Brit, is also used as a euphemism for "homosexual" or "transvestite." The man is supposedly the "boyfriend" of the accused killer, but he has many effeminate mannerisms, so whether he's a homosexual or a transvestite, the point is that Hitchcock was exploring areas of human behavior that most filmmakers weren't touching at the time -- as he would in such films as "Rope," "Strangers on a Train," "Psycho" and many others.

[–] KenanP 15 years ago

I agree with every word that J. Spurlin said.

In the original novel (which I haven't read, just read about it) the killer's secret is his homosexuality, but this had to be downplayed in the movie, something Hitch confirmed himself in later interviews. So he focused on the mixed race issue and only hinted at the sexuality. But we know.

--------------------------------
Oh you mad cuz I'm stylin on you

[–] jagiordanomirschwa 12 years ago

Sorry, but I understood "half-caste" as a shorter word for "half-castrate", like a "eunuch".

[–] whisperhog 11 years ago

I think we can take "black blood" literally to mean what it seems to mean. How shocking would it have been for someone to have Irish blood?

I think you have not been around many English persons. Many English have great disdain for the Irish. My English ex-wife always referred to them as "Navvies," a term of derision stemming from the fact that many Irish workers were hired in the 19th century to work on the "navigation waterways" in England. The stereotype was a gang of Irish workers standing around and doing nothing. In modern parlance, "Navvy" seems to be used as a term for a worthless loafer.

In 1930s Britain, "half-caste" or "black blood" very much meant East Indians. Britons (including Winston Churchill) held most Indians in contempt. Also, many East Indians are truly black in the literal sense because of the initial migration from the African continent across the Asian sub-continent some 40,000 or so years ago.

[–] slinter 11 years ago

Hitch would be smiling, that 83 years later, people are still talking about his films, and what they supposedly really meant.

[–] franklinlj 8 years ago

No. The book is quite clear that half-caste ( also called chi-chi) means just that. No suggestion of homo in the book.

Maybe hitch snuck a little of that in? He did like to change things around.

[–] JackBluegrass 11 years ago

I've just watched the Netflix DVD of Murder! on the 2007 Westlake Entertainment label. Westlake must be the bargain basement of the DVD industry.

As you mention, the sound is terrible with scratchiness, and difficult to understand dialogue. How much of that is due to early recording techniques in Britain (a British subsidiary of RCA is credited) or to poor transfer from film to DVD is debatable. The quality of the image is also terrible.

I often watch British movies with English subtitles, but this movie had none.

If any classic film deserves restoration, it would be this one.

[–] John-367 8 years ago

Murder! is in the public domain so there are a lot of very bad, very worn copies around. However the Canal Plus copy of the film is excellent for a film of its age. The sound recording of the time is obviously not comparable with later technology but isn't any impediment to appreciating the film and, for my money, adds its own period atmosphere.

[–] JackBluegrass 8 years ago

Thanks, John....!

I'm in the US and searching for that Murder (1930) DVD turned up Studio Canal (United Kingdom) 2008 DVD as the most likely source. Is that the one you're referring to? I want to get the best quality restoration, if possible.

E pluribus unum

[–] John-367 8 years ago

Hi Jack
Sorry, I wasn't very clear.
I did mean Studio Canal.
I saw Murder on a UK TV channel very recently with the Studio Canal logo at the beginning so I assume that their DVD copy is from the same source, but obviously can't guarantee it.
The image quality was very impressive, crisp even on a non-HD channel and with little visible damage. It's difficult to imagine a much better restoration for a film of that age.

Regards
John

[–] greenbudgie 9 years ago

I was wondering about the half-caste wording as I watched this film for the first time. Fane didn't look of mixed race. I kept wondering if it was a sly reference to the character's transvestism. Typical of Hitchcock to tease us this way.

[–] 8 years ago

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