Without checking, I believe "The Immigrant" was made in 1916, only two years after Chaplin made his first movie and fourteen years (not "thirty") prior to "Animal Crackers."
As I have heard, there was much amicability and mutual admiration between Chaplin and the Marx brothers, so I doubt he was bothered by Harpo's card shuffle gag in Animal Crackers. But it's likely that the gag originated with neither Harpo Marx NOR Charlie Chaplin; both Chaplin and the Marx brothers had spent many years in vaudville before they went Hollywood, and many of the gags we see in classic comedy films came straight out of vaudeville. Another case in point:
There's an episode of "I Love Lucy," guest-starring Harpo Marx. The big gag scene of that episode is when Lucy is wearing a Harpo costume and is "playing" with what she thinks is her reflection in a mirror--except there ISN'T a mirror! It's Harpo, staring right back at Lucy through the doorway (or window? I can't remember which) and mimmicking her every move and expression nearly flawlessly and "in sync" with Lucy's movements. But let's go further back:
In the Marx Brothers comedy "Duck Soup" (1933), Harpo is an undercover spy who impersonates Groucho; Harpo and Groucho do "the mirror trick" here, too! But wait:
Someone correct me if I'm referring to the wrong movie, but I believe it's in 1916's "The Pawn Broker" (starring Chaplin) that Charlie does "the mirror trick" in this one, too! (I haven't seen "The Pawn Broker" yet but I'm recalling what's been said of it and "the mirror trick.")
The mirror trick or gag is another old standard of vaudeville, but Chaplin is believed to be the first to bring it onscreen; if someone else had done this in an earlier film, that film didn't survive, as the majority of movies made before the 1930's have been lost or destroyed.
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bradford-1
12 years ago
If you can find one of Bert Williams' existing silent shorts, you'll see that he does a card-shuffling routine WITHOUT real cards. Who knows who actually devised the card material?
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TheAntiJohn
12 years ago
This is getting weird man, are you following me or something? hahaha just playin. But you've answered like five of my threads/messages. hahaha
Anyway, thanks for all the info. I guess we can never really know where certain jokes originate and I guess it doesn't really matter. I was just curious. I didn't mean to say anything against Charlie or the Marxes. It is an interesting thing to know though. Because there are countless jokes that have been recreated in countless TV shows and movies, and I've always wondered where they originated. I actually have a few more threads on the subject on some other Chaplin film boards, but you'll probably find those eventually hahaha. Oh, and I guess I got confused with the release dates, sorry about that.
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vinidici
12 years ago
Yeah, you might say I've been "trolling" you, but it's only because you've been asking some pretty good questions and making some interesting observations--and because, as you've stated, you're at least relatively new to comedy / comedians appreciation; I'm one of those guys who likes to help people along those lines with what little I know.
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vinidici
12 years ago
OK, back again for corrections to my first post:
(1) It's "The Pawnshop" (NOT "The Pawn Broker," which is a 1965 drama starring Rod Steiger).
(2) "The mirror gag" appeared NOT in "The Pawnshop," but in another fine short by Chaplin, "The Floorwalker" (1916).
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TheAntiJohn
12 years ago
Haha I don't mind. Actually, I wanted to thank you for all your help and I really appreciate it all. :D
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