Music Scores


I read that the new Criterion Collection that was just released has four different music scores.

Does anyone happen to know if one of the scores is the haunting piano score from the VHS release of the film from the 1980's. That score is absolutely haunting and dark and I feel fits the film perfectly, much like the score of the film The Piano and it's haunting theme.

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I have been wondering the same thing. Somebody please post!!!!!

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I got the Criterion set and the score from the VHS tape release, the haunting piano score, is sadly not included in the set. The set is fantastic but I was very disappointed because I was really hoping it would be a part of it.

Personally, I feel that this score captures the feel and darkness of this film perfectly and have always thought it was the best one for it.

I emailed Hugh Munro Neely, who was listed in the credits as being part of the project, and he stated that he was not familiar with the score I am referring to, and he basically said that he was not contacted at all by Criterion, they went through the licensing company he is with, so he was never consulted at all regarding the project.

Does anyone happen to know who the composer of the VHS tape release is? That score fits this film, just like the score for the movie The Piano. The score compliments the film and has a life of its own.

Sad to sad I will be holding onto my VHS copy solely for the score.

I am going to email Criterion direct and see if I can find out just why they left it off.

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[OKAY, I'M A KNUCKLEHEAD. AFTER SUBMITTING THE BELOW MESSAGE, I DISCOVERED SOME NOTES I MADE AEONS AGO, NOTES I HADN'T EVEN REMEMBERED MAKING. SO I MADE SOME CORRECTIONS.]

The piano score you praise was by Stuart Oderman, composed, recorded, and copyrighted in 1983 for the Janus reissue of that year. That was the score used on the 1986 VHS from Embassy Home Entertainment. However highly you may regard that score, it has one insurmountable obstacle: It accompanied the film as projected at 24 frames per second (90 feet per minute), which gives a running time of about 1 hour 50 minutes. Later video issues of PANDORA'S BOX were all transferred at 20 frames per second (75 feet per minute), which gives a running time of about 2 hours 12 minutes.

By the way, the 16mm Janus print that I saw in 1985 had a piano score by Karl Salke. I don't know when Salke's score was recorded or released, though it certainly pre-dated Oderman's score. The Janus catalogue from 1975 mentioned that PANDORA'S BOX had a running time of 110 minutes (at 24fps) and that it had a recorded music score. Perhaps that score was by Salke? Incidentally, the score appeared only on the 16mm prints; the 35mm prints have always been full-frame silent. If memory serves, Janus once offered a cassette tape of Salke's score to those cinemas desperate/foolhardy enough to think that it would hold synch with the film. I can no longer remember Salke's score, and would love to hear it again.

Some years ago the Zurich-based Stella Video created a VHS edition (which seems never to have been released except as a screener) of the 1997 restoration by the Moscow State Archive, and the accompanying orchestral score was a modernistic creation of Peer Ruben. This transfer and score were later issued on DVD by Umbrella in Australia, and, I think, by Second Sight Films in the UK. The Moscow restoration curiously divides the film into eight acts. There is no indication of such a device in the published script, and it is highly unlikely that the film was originally released with Act numbers. It was surely issued, though, with Part Titles, indicating the beginnings and endings of reels, which don't and can't correspond to any natural divisions of the narrative. (Yes, Part Titles were usually shown on screen, despite what the modern authorities say.)

The Italian restoration (35mm full-frame silent, without, of course, a canned music score), which toured about two or three years ago, seems identical in every way to the Moscow restoration, except that the titles were all put into Italian (some of which seemed to have been mistranslated from the German), and that there were no Act numbers. (Should we ask the logical question about why a restoration should be performed if it is not in any essential way different from a previous restoration? I leave that up to you.) When I saw it, the projectionist set the speed at 21 frames per second (78.75 feet per minute), and that, I think, is just about right, though Kevin Brownlow argues for 22 frames per second (82.5 feet per minute). Official (though certainly not actual) projection speed in those days was 80 feet per minute.

The four scores that accompany the 20fps, 132-minute transfer of PANDORA'S BOX for the new Criterion release are:
(1) An orchestral score by Gillian Anderson. She noticed that contemporary reviews of the film mentioned that the music score derived from classical as well as pop pieces, and Anderson imitated this combination as best as her imagination would allow.
(2) A score consisting of cabaret music, composed by Dimitar Pentchev.
(3) The aforementioned modernistic orchestral score by Peer Raben.
(4) A piano improvisation by Stéphan Oliva.

By far the best score I have ever heard for PANDORA'S BOX was a piano improvisation by William P Perry, which was recorded for a PBS transmission on Christmas Eve 1977. (The best and only time to watch PANDORA'S BOX is on Christmas Eve, with all the lights out and the phone shut off.) Perry's is perhaps the most seductive and haunting music I have ever heard accompany any film, sound or silent. As far as I am concerned, this is the only score that should be used for PANDORA'S BOX. Amazingly, and unusually for the time, PBS ran the film at 20 frames per second, and so Perry's score would almost exactly fit the current video releases. Sadly, this PBS version was broadcast only once. By the time I located the master 2" quad tapes at the Great Amwell Corporation in New York City, almost eight years later, they had already begun to disintegrate. Nonetheless, the folks at Great Amwell graciously agreed to run off a VHS for me, which is one of my prized possessions. The print used for that video transfer was Jim Card's 1973 restoration, which had some missing titles, newly invented titles to cover the missing titles, the final shot of Lulu swinging on Alwa's clothes rod missing, and much flopped footage in the last reel (lefts and rights reversed).

Janus's subsequent reissue, with the Karl Salke score, was essentially the same as Card's restoration, except that it restored the missing shot of the swinging in the closet. The wording in the titles was seldom corrected. By the time of the 1983 release with Stuart Oderman's score, the titles were reset in a somewhat more authentic-looking type font, and Dr Peter Schoen's name was mysteriously changed to Dr Ludwig Schoen. The published script gives the name as Peter.

As the anonymous sex murderer wanders through the London streets, he runs across a public bulletin board announcing: "ACHTUNG! An die Frauens Londons...." That was for the German version. The bulletin board was also printed in English, and it was the English-language poster that was used in the international prints. You can see a publicity still of the English version in the published script (Lorimar, 1971, rev ed 1984, p 117). A bracketed note in the script indicates that the English-language print held at the UK National Film Archive has only a portion of this particular shot. Who wants to search for a better print? (And, no, despite the writings on the film, and despite the inauthentic opening credits at the beginning of modern prints of the movie, there is nothing to suggest that this strange man who wanders the streets at night is Jack the Ripper, who was probably long dead by 1928 anyway. Remember, the movie is not the stage play. Not at all.)

The Jim Card restoration of 1973, the slightly revised Janus restorations over the next few years, the Moscow restoration of 1997, and the more recent Italian restoration, all have some of the same mistakes. For instance, all give the name Alice Roberte as Alice Roberts. This would seem a simple thing to correct, especially as the Louise Brooks interview used as a supplement in the Criterion edition explicitly makes note of this error. The poster, which is briefly shown in the Criterion edition, also gives Roberte's name correctly. There is also still about 800 feet of film missing, mostly during the gambling-boat sequence, which explains why the narrative gets so choppy. The buckling, resulting in wavering focus in a few sequences, as well as the occasional double frame lines, derive from an earlier intermediary print, and can no longer be corrected, unless, of course, more authentic materials are located.

I have never seen the earlier prints of the film. I had a chance, a long time ago, to see the print from Janus that ran about 90 minutes or so, but declined, for I couldn't bear the thought of the film being so cut to ribbons. (That one, too, had a canned music score. By whom, I don't know.) Surprisingly (or not?), even after Jim Card restored the film for Janus in 1973, Janus did not withdraw the earlier and inferior prints, and continued to offer the shorter version. No programmer could know in advance which version of the film would arrive at the cinema!

Not to take anything away from GW Pabst's masterful direction, but I must say that this is not really Pabst's film. Pay attention to the credits: "Manuskript: LAD. VAJDA," which, translated, means "Written by Ladislaus Vajda." Why does no one ever speak of him? Even the published script, which makes it clear that Vajda wrote every word of it, gives the author's name on the spine and cover as GW Pabst. Why? If anyone could tell me more about Herr Vajda, I'd be all ears.

Now you know more than you ever wanted to know about PANDORA'S BOX.

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Thanks for the informative research. You've really done your homework.

One question and it's probably a silly one. One of the scores you mention is by Gillian Anderson. Is this the same Gillian of "X-Files" and "Bleak House" fame?

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No, alas, this is a different Gillian Anderson, and you can read about her at http://www.victoriasymphony.bc.ca/media/index.asp?ID_ArticleIndex=157

In my notes above, I mentioned that the Stuart Oderman score was issued only in 16mm and VHS. Janus's 35mm prints remained full-frame silent, which, of course, left no room for a music score. That was much appreciated by the several folks like me who get irritated when silent films are reduced to a smaller format (usually Academy) or, worse, when the left side is simply cropped off to make room for a soundtrack. The minus side is that there are probably not even 15 cinemas on this planet that are set up to run full-frame silent prints properly. Such a set-up is not at all difficult - a simple calculation will tell you the required focal length for the lenses, an aperture file can cut through the soft brass of some spare aperture plates (measure your progress with a pair of calipers: .6796" tall by .90625" wide), and lens shifters are rather easy to come by. But are there more than 50 people anywhere on earth who know about these things? And so these things never get done. And silent films are routinely massacred. And if I should ever again hear that silent films used the Academy aperture, I shall get violent. (Criterion's latest DVD release of "M" made an even dumber error in a supplement, arguing that the Academy and silent apertures are identical, and that the outmoded MovieTone aperture was smaller than the modern Academy. It's astounding that people who have never handled a film in their lives are entrusted to explain the technicalities to the rest of us: The projector aperture for MovieTone should be .6796" tall and anywhere from .8" to .825" wide; the Academy projector aperture should be .607" tall by .825" wide. The newer Academy standard of .6" tall doesn't work for older films and should never be used under any circumstances. Most cinemas these days use widescreen apertures measuring, at the largest, .446" tall by .825" wide, but frequently as small as about .34" tall by .63" wide. That's supposed to be an improvement? Yechhhhh! And if you complain about it, the manager will bar you from the cinema and might even try to have you arrested for criminal trespass. And people wonder why I don't go to the movies anymore.)

All in all, the new windowboxed Criterion DVD set is the best video version yet. My only gripes are
(1) that the fragment of the English-language "NOTICE To the Women of London...," which still survives in the NFA print (which I would love to examine), was not included as a supplement,
(2) that there was no supplement explaining what is still missing from the film (unless we are told that a movie is incomplete, we won't search other prints for the missing bits),
(3) that Alice Roberte's name is still misspelled,
and, more than anything else,
(4), that William P Perry's beautiful score was not used.
And I still don't understand why Peter was changed to Ludwig. Maybe the name was indeed Ludwig in the original release prints, but I don't think so. Does anyone know for sure?

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Ok...so...you have really done an extensive research. I am sure it is appreciated by a lot of viewers (including me).

So to make it simple, there are no DVDs out there that have the score identical (or similar ) to the score from the VHS???

THat is really dissapointing. I understand that the technical differences in the frame rates and such caused a huge obstacle, but there could have been something that was at least Kurt Weil insired, no??

What about this DVD?
http://www.amazon.com/Pandoras-Box-Digitally-Remastered-Special/dp/832 0815029/sr=1-9/qid=1167520367/ref=sr_1_9/103-4050452-8063839?ie=UTF8&a mp;s=dvd

I know it is PAL region 2 but it does say it has "the mono soundtrack brings out all the detail of Peer Rubens' Kurt Weill-inflected score, stylishly performed by the Kontraste Ensemble".
Is this as close as it gets??

Please let us know
Sorry if I missed something in your previous post. It is a little technically beyond my grasp.
Thanks in advance.

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Hi d_chatterley,

Sorry to disappoint you, but no, there is nothing quite similar to Stuart Oderman's score. Nor is there anything remotely similar to my personal favorite, William P Perry's score. But the Weill-inspired Peer Raben score that you mention is included as an option on the Criterion DVD set. You just might like it. I found it a bit too heavy-going, but that's simply my personal taste, not an objective criticism. (And I don't recall it being Weill-inspired. Dimitar Pentchev's cabaret score might be Weill-inspired, but I can't say, as I haven't had time to listen to it yet.)

I strongly recommend the Criterion version of PANDORA'S BOX to everyone who loves movies. I recommend it even more strongly to everyone who hates movies. Despite its shortcomings, which I detailed in an earlier post, it is, overall, simply the best video release of that movie yet.

But, yes, hang on to your VHS tape, because the Stuart Oderman score may never be reissued on home video, simply because the difference in speed (and therefore running time) makes it unusable. Maybe you can start a petition to have Criterion, or some other company, pay Oderman to re-record his score to accompany the superior restored copy of the film, and then release it, at least as a supplement. Anything's worth a try, yes?

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I really appreciate all of your knowledge regarding the Oderman score and your personal favorite.

Do you happen to know where one could obtain the cassette of Oderman's score or at least contact Oderman directly about it?

What about contacting William P. Perry to obtain his recording of his score as well?

Any information would be much appreciated! I would love to get cassette or CD versions of both scores.

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Hi mcade!

Please send me a private message through IMDb and we'll continue this off-line. After you send the private message, inform me of it on this bulletin board, so that I'll know to check.

Last I heard, Stuart Oderman is still alive, and I think I know someone who could contact him for you. And you can probably still find the VHS of PANDORA'S BOX, the one with his score, on eBay. As for William P Perry's score, well, that's a little more difficult, but not impossible.

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I did a live improv score to this fairly recenty with The Cube Orchestra at The Cube Microplex here in sunny Bristol. Great film to play to, audience appreciated it too.

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Did you ever get the clean copy of Pandora on VHS from Hugh?

I believe you told me he was going to be out of the country for a while and then you would get it when he came back. My email was purged and I lost your email so I am sending this to you via private message.

Stuart will be so thrilled when you get this on DVD and sent to him!

Thanks!

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>>The piano score you praise was by Stuart Oderman, composed, recorded, and copyrighted in 1983 for the Janus reissue of that year. That was the score used on the 1986 VHS from Embassy Home Entertainment. However highly you may regard that score, it has one insurmountable obstacle: It accompanied the film as projected at 24 frames per second (90 feet per minute), which gives a running time of about 1 hour 50 minutes. Later video issues of PANDORA'S BOX were all transferred at 20 frames per second (75 feet per minute), which gives a running time of about 2 hours 12 minutes.

No big deal at all. All a competent DVD expert has to do is customize the piano score for the 20 fps instead of the 24 fps and multiplex it in. It's time consuming but not impossible to do at all. That's what I did for my own copy of Buster's The Cameraman. I hated the new cartoonish soundtrack on the DVD box set version, so I took the wonderful piano score that I fell in love with which was on the original VHS and originally broadcast on TCM before the new DVD collection came out, and I customized it for the new restored print on the DVD and multiplexed it in. I've also done this with several sound films that have only been released on PAL at 25 fps, adjusting the vocal track to 24 fps and multiplexing it into a re-encoded NTSC version.

It's only something a true film fan who loves old movies will do. Most DVD companies today can't be bothered.

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What bugs me about it is the fact that they went to the trouble of having four composers write four new scores for the DVD release by Criterion and in my humble opinion, NONE of the new ones are nearly as good as Oderman's score.

Instead of going to all that trouble, why didn't they just contact Stuart and have him re-record his score for the DVD release? His score perfectly fits the darkness and hopelessness of the film.

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A lot of people have biases against piano solo or organ solo soundtracks for silent films, and only like orchestra scores. I personally don't mind either way, as long as the music fits the mood of each scene and the instruments sound good (not a tinny upright piano but a nice Steinway or Yamaha Grand played expressively) I'm fine with it. Look at the classic The Third Man, all you ever hear is a zither played by a genius. One instrument. And it was a huge, unforgettable hit.

People should dare to be different and follow their own vision. And if companies don't want to put the best score on a disc learn to do it yourself. Then once you do you have a real sense of accomplishment.

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My question is since they had four scores on the DVD Criterion set, why not include the Oderman score and the William Perry score for fans of both of these as well?

It couldn't have been that expensive to obtain the rights to have these scores re-recorded and included.

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I watched this movie with a live musical score just today. It was incredible, there was alot of accordion, clarinet, piano, and cello.

_______
"There's nothing you can know that isn't known."
-John Lennon

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"Most cinemas these days use widescreen apertures measuring, at the largest, .446" tall by .825" wide, but frequently as small as about .34" tall by .63" wide. That's supposed to be an improvement? Yechhhhh! And if you complain about it, the manager will bar you from the cinema and might even try to have you arrested for criminal trespass."

What a wonderful and informative thread! You're my kinda guy!

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The folks at Criterion should have contacted Mr. Oderman to re-record his haunting score for the DVD release in addition to the other scores commissioned for the project.

Mr. Oderman was kind enough to send me a handwritten copy of the score, including the haunting first chord that sets the dark foreboding tone of the film.

I think his score fits the film perfectly.

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I have had conversations with a couple of friends about this as well as Hugh Munro Neely who runs Timeline Films. When Criterion got in touch with Timeline about putting Pandora on DVD, they never asked for any input from Hugh at all and did exactly what they wanted. I think they should have obtained other input from persons who had been involved with the film and its history.

A friend of mine was able to take the score from the VHS and put it on a DVD copy for me and it seems to be at the correct speed. I am not sure how it was done, but it gave me the score that I wanted with the film on DVD.

This same friend told me of another score for this film, even more rare, by William Perry that appeared on a public television airing of the film in the late 1970's. This is also quite good but I still think the Oderman one is the definitive one.

I think Oderman's music in the comedic scene involving the stage director with the uneaten sandwich is perfect, a complete contrast from dark to light, with the portions of the scene involving Lulu and Dr. Schoen going back to the dark music again.

I have to watch the Criterion DVD again and give the other score you refer to another listen to refresh my memory once again.





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I'm not really sure how he did it.

I know that the movie print he used had some extra footage in it that I was not used to seeing, in particular footage at the beginning that explains who that guy is that Lulu is paying at the beginning and assorted other scenes that have footage that I don't recall seeing in the original VHS release from 1983. He might have used the European DVD version of the film that came out before the Criterion set.

Maybe because he used a print with additional footage, it was more in sync with the film. I would really have to ask him how he did it.

If you want, I could, just let me know.

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I've never seen this film, but I am a fan of silent cinema. Reading all this talk about all these different scores makes me want to see the film with all of them...

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If you want to view the best (in my humble opinion) version of this film, please get the 1980's VHS release of the film with the Stuart Oderman soundtrack which perfectly fits the theme and dark tone of the film.

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[deleted]

I will see what I can find out.

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[deleted]

I just sent another inquiry to him with our string of responses attached. I have asked him if he can give any insights or if I should have you get in touch with him directly.

I will let you know if he responds.

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[deleted]

I just replied to it.

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I just watched PB again the other night after getting the Criterion DVD and I really have to say that the scores they included with the film do NOT do it justice. Actually, I can only claim that for the first 3 scores (the orchestral, the jazz, and the artsy/"moderne" one) because after trying the first three with the beginning 30-40 minutes of the film and all of them coming up wanting, I threw in the towel on trying the last (piano-improvisational) score.

Eventually, I got more satisfaction from just watching the film totally silent because the musical tracks Criterion commissioned for this film ill-serve it.

I'm glad I see others had issues with these tracks, although until I read through this thread I was unaware that many fans of the film hold in high regard the score that accompanied the film on a VHS release.

However, I have one pertinent question about the film and it's musical score perhaps someone above would know the answer to, and that is:

Was there ever an actual written score composed for this film to be played during it's initial premiere in Germany, one that Pabst commissioned and approved as, in effect, the original score for the original first run of PB? And if so, who was the composer? I'm supposing that if there was, no trace of it remains since otherwise it would have been used to re-record the score for some version of the film?

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I don't know if Pabst had a score commissioned for the film. This would be a great question to submit to the Library of Congress' Ask A Librarian feature on their website. The service is free and they usually respond within 48 hours, either getting the answers or pointing one into the right direction.

A friend of mine, who has posted in the first couple of responses on this thread under LHL as his username talks about a William Perry score which is a great score but not very well known. It's a shame because both the Perry score and the Stuart Oderman score are the best I have heard associated with the film.

I contacted Hugh Munro Neely of Timeline films about this because Timeline had the rights to the film at the time Criterion did their collection. The folks at Criterion did not get any input from anyone including Hugh about this project which is why no one was asked why Oderman wasn't contacted to re-record his score for the DVD release.

I told Hugh about the Oderman score and he went out and got the VHS tape. He agreed that it was the best version he had heard associated with the film. For this very reason, I won't part with my VHS copy of the film because the score perfectly sets the dark tone of the film.

I would be most interested in your opinion of the Oderman score. If you get in touch with LHL through the contact feature on this site (send a private email) he might be able to get you a copy of the Perry score so you can judge for yourself.

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Hi, thanks for the prompt response!

That was an excellent suggestion of yours to send an email to the LOC and let the "Pro's From Dover", so to speak, get to the bottom of this matter. Here's is the question I just sent to them:

This question concerns a 1929 German silent film, PANDORA'S BOX (Die Buchse der Pandora), directed by G.W. Pabst and starring Louise Brooks. My question (2 parts) is:

Was there an original musical score commissioned for this film by the director for it's premiere and/or German release, and if so, who was the composer and does any remnants of this score survive in either written or recorded form?


And (since my curiosity monkey is now perched squarely on my shoulder and will not relinquish his grip) I also will take your recommendation of contacting your friend LHL about the previous musical scores. After my previous post, I actually did a search on Ebay and Ioffer to see if anyone had the Kino score for sale, but there were no copies on other site (just some old public domain tapes). Last night I listened to the Criterion commentary track for PB and noticed the Orchestral Score was "forced" into the background of the audio, and even in the background at low volume I still found it intrusive and ill-fitting.

I will return once I get the reply from the Library Of Congress and post their response.



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You won't find any copy of the music score by Stuart Oderman as it was never published or commercially released. I contacted Mr. Oderman myself via email and he was kind enough to send me a handwritten copy of the score including a special sheet with the haunting piano chord that starts off the dark tone of the music and sets the tone of the film. I had it framed and it hangs on my living room wall.

If you want a copy of the VHS release, I believe it was a Janus Films release from 1983 if memory serves, you can check out Ebay, Amazon or ioffer and see if you can find it there. The other place that would have it would be through your local library. Have them go through WorldCat/Firstsearch, the library worldwide database system and request it from there, making sure they send the VHS copy of it and not the DVD version. You would almost assuredly get it that way.

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Just an update--

The Library of Congress never responded to my inquiry about an original release score for PB. I don't know what their average time period is for replies to questions, but it's been 6 weeks and no reply at all...

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I would send another inquiry stating that you never received a reply and that you weren't sure if your first inquiry went through properly.

Good Luck!

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I contacted Hugh Munro Neely of Timeline films about this because Timeline had the rights to the film at the time Criterion did their collection. The folks at Criterion did not get any input from anyone including Hugh about this project which is why no one was asked why Oderman wasn't contacted to re-record his score for the DVD release.

Criterion didn't contact Oderman probably because they weren't interested in the Oderman score, which was composed for the wrong running time. With the speed correction, the running time was lengthened by almost 20%, altering tempo everywhere and thus the overall tone and atmosphere, and that would make recomposing the score very difficult even if Oderman were to do it, because what works in one tempo may not work in another. For instance, if you sang "Jungle Bells" in the tempo of "Silent Night", you'd realize it just would not work no matter how hard you try.

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I actually asked Stuart Oderman about this myself when I contacted him and he was kind enough to reply to me. He told me he wished they would have contacted him because he would have liked to have been able to see if he could have done some revisions and changes to accommodate the score to suit the change in speed.

A friend of mine was able to take the VHS version of the film and incorporate the Oderman score into the DVD version of the film and it seems to work pretty well. There are some glitches but not very noticeable. I am not sure how he did it, but I think if given the chance, Mr. Oderman could have stepped up to the challenge.

BTW, he is a very nice person and was kind enough to handwrite the score out for me and send me a very nice handwritten letter because of my interest in it.

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Have you tried contacting Criterion? Jon Mulvaney ( [email protected] , listed at http://www.criterion.com/contact_us) is the point man over there. I would ask him myself, but you seem to have much better knowledge of the situation and history on this subject so you may form a better inquiry. They probably won't redo the DVD score, but at least they may give you an answer.

What is the running time of the DVD your friend made for you? Did you friend just convert the VHS into DVD?

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I have no idea how he did the conversion, I would have to ask him what he did. I had no idea he was doing it until the DVD showed up in my mailbox one fine day. He knew how much I loved that score. He told me of a score by William Perry and included a version with that score as well. The Perry score is much more rare than the Oderman one.

Thanks for the information on Criterion. One interesting note that I forgot to mention. In my last conversations with Stuart Oderman via email and snail mail, I learned that he had composed the music score for the DVD release of the Houdini serial, The Master Mystery with me in mind because I loved the Pandora score so much.

I have to say I was speechless and had to go out and get the DVD set to hear it. It is very reminiscent of the Pandora score.

Mary Ann

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The running time of the disc your friend gave you should tell you whether he converted the VHS straight on to DVD, which is a fairly straightforward job. Also, the picture quality should indicate the source he used. The VHS is scratchy and blotchy, but the Criterion DVD is restored.

Thanks for info on the Houdini DVD; I'll check it out.

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I think he may have used one of the European DVD releases if I remember correctly. I will have to check again to be sure.

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Hate to necro this thread, but I wonder... is it possible, mcade, that you could get Stuart Oderman's permission to either publish or re-record the score?

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I believe that Mr. Oderman still works for the Museum of Modern Art (www.moma.org).

You might try contacting him through their site. At one time, I had his email address but he prefers to correspond through snail mail and his wife would be the one who would reply via email when I sent inquiries.

I don't know if anyone has ever inquired about re-recording the score. I do not believe it was ever published which is why I cherish the handwritten score he sent to me.

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Hmmmm... a re-recording would be something to cherish, don't you think? I'd be very eager to buy a copy, if it came to pass. Really seems like a worthwhile endeavor.

...of course, it'd have to be one hell of an undertaking, too.

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I would too because I think his musical score perfectly captures the dark subject matter of this film.

BTW, if you like this score, have you heard the score he wrote for the Houdini serial The Master Mystery? He wrote to me and told me that he had the droning chord from Pandora in the back of his mind when he composed it. I think you would like it as well.

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Didn't you say the score was no longer available on VHS? Maybe you should make an audio transfer, for the time being, in order to share it. Really seems like it'd go so much better with "Pandora's Box" than the score TCM just showed it with.

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If you can find a VHS Kino release of Pandora, the Stuart Oderman score is on there. I believe I have been told that the synchronization is off when you compare the VHS to the DVD because they run at different speeds.

This is why I believe that Criterion should have contacted Mr. Oderman to have him re-record his score when they remastered it and released in on the DVD set a few years ago.

Frankly, I believe the Oderman score is the best for this film because it perfectly captures the hopelessness of the characters' lives and how each one is ruined in one way or another by Lulu (Louise Brooks) until she meets her end at the hands of Jack the Ripper.

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I'm sure I could find a VHS, but the problem is nowadays in playing it.

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I just checked Walmart.com and they have some DVD/VHS combo players for as low as $79.00. I also went to Amazon.com and they have some VHS releases of Pandora for as low as $3.40.

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Hmmmm... I shall have to see, then. Thank you. Hope that helps me, for now.

Could I give you my e-mail? Think I'd like to keep in touch.

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Sure thing.

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The Oderman version is on youtube as Il Vaso di Pandora https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7l9y4VwG1bI - don't worry, the intertitles are in English. If you have a youtube downloader, you're in business.

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Just watched the TCM showing and was so disappointed by the score, since I had such great memories of the haunting VHS version. Had to come here to see if it was available. Bummer.

Here is a link to an interview with Oderman:

http://www.examiner.com/article/stuart-oderman-talking-to-the-piano-player

"Oderman’s accompaniment to silent films can be heard on various VHS and DVD releases. Of them, one stands out. This reviewer considers Oderman’s accompaniment to the Home Vision Cinema release of Pandora’s Box one of the finest soundtracks of all time."

"Another once forgotten actress Oderman encountered was Louise Brooks (1906-1985). The pianist met her in 1967 after a screening of Pandora’s Box at the George Eastman House in Rochester, New York."

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I also have a version from an internet friend with a very obscure score by William Perry. This score is right up there with the Oderman version, if you are lucky enough to find it. I remember the friend telling me that he had seen this version on a local television station aired sometime during the 1970s and was lucky enough to locate it some years later. He was kind enough to send me a copy of it.

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One vote for the cabaret score. It's quite nice and gives such an authentic period feel.

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