OSCAR SNUB C AU S E OF RAC IS M ?
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Not having seen it, I can't say for sure. But this really does sound like butthurt to me. Perhaps she was just ignored, not snubbed.
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MovieChat Forums > Danielle Deadwyler Discussion > OSCAR SNUB C AU S E OF RAC IS M ?
Danielle Deadwyler: "I didn't get nominated for an Oscar because I'm a black woman."
Me: "Then why did Angela Basset get nominated?"
Danielle Deadwyler: "Shit".
Two different categories.
Deadwyler would have been eligible for Best Actress. Bassett is nominated in the Best Supporting Actress category.
Now, I don't know if racism is the root cause of Deadwyler's omission, but it still seems from an outside perspective, that Black actors aren't being allowed to sit at the big kids' table (i.e. with the lead actors).
The people who vote for best actress are the same people who vote for all acting categories. If a black woman is good enough for one category, why does she think her not being a nomination is racism?
shareBut the functions of a supporting actor/actress who is their to support the leads, is different than a lead actor/actress, who is the film's focus. Plus, Till is a true story about racial injustice. It's not a feel-good film for many white audience members, whereas Black Panther, although a film that focuses on Black characters, is set in a fictional universe.
share2 black actors were nominated in lead roles last year, which one of them won. 3 black actors were nominated in lead roles the year before that. Maybe she doesn't want to admit that she, as well as the film, wasn't good enough.
share98% Fresh on Rotten Tomatoes would suggest otherwise.
shareRotten Tomatoes isn't a good indicator of how good something is.
It works on a binary system where they consider something that is a 6/10 as good. That's why you see strang escores for bad movies like "Teeth" (2007) 80% and "Sharknado" (2013) 74%
Out of all the films nominated for best picture this year, all of them have a higher IMDb score than Till.
I understood that Teeth was genuinely regarded as good (Sharknado, admittedly much less so).
I don't know if I particularly trust IMDb scores, seeing how bigoted many IMDb voters can be (and yes, I realise that's not very democratic of me, but I also know the type of people who flood certain film boards to down-vote 'woke' films), but I entirely understand how RT works, and that a 98% Fresh film doesn't indicate a '98% quality' but could simply mean that 98% critics thought it was simply better than average (maybe they *all* thought it was merely a 6/10, although I seriously doubt that). Still, although it isn't a perfect indicator of universal praise, it's a better indicator than most, and I do know that a lot of critics particularly praised Deadwyler's performance, and that she was recognised by other award guilds, like the National Board of Review and the Gotham Independent Film Awards, for instance.
IMDb scores are nonsense for many reasons, but Metacritic (79) matches the average Rotten Tomatoes score 7.9 -- good, but not stellar.
shareWhat is stellar?
Blonde has a 50% Metacritic score.
Also, as an aside, should Michelle Williams have been nominated in the Best Supporting Actress category?
Like I mentioned elsewhere, I'm a bit behind, as usual. I haven't seen Blonde or The Fabelmans. But the latter will be seen soon.
Sometimes films are mediocre when the performance is great, but that isn't your contention with Till, hence the 98% you brought up.
To be fair, its ave score was 7.9, which is good, but doesn't automatically mean it should be nominated. And critics have never been more aware of the issue, so, if anything, they tend to come down favorably on films like these. 98% simply means that 98% thought it was better than bad, so you need to look at the ave RT score to get a more meaningful measure.
I haven't seen Till, but I thought she was great in Station 11. So maybe I'm half-racist, or just way behind on my "films to check out" list, as usual.
No, I understand samoanjoes and your point, and 100% understand how RT works. I get that 98% doesn't mean it's 98% good, but only that 98% of critics thought it was *at least* say a 6/10 (i.e. above average). Still, I do tend to find that films with RT scores *that* high (i.e. 95%
shareYour post is cut off, but I think the climate has inspired a lot of critics to endorse films like Till simply due to the subject, and that the director is a black female. Some just don't want the racist or sexist label affixed to them, while others consider it their duty to use their critic's voice as a form of social activism.
shareFair enough. I guess we'll never know, but just as one cannot categorically say that Till was denied any nominations because of racism, we also cannot categorically say that Till garnered great reviews because of its subject matter/the identity of its director. It's all speculation, isn't it?
Thank you for pointing out that my post cut off. I don't know what I did there. But I was in the process of saying that I tend to find that films with scores of 95% + usually merit high praise, because it's unlikely that a remotely flawed or even average film would garner such a high RT score, without at least 5% or more of critics regarding it as mediocre or bad, although I'll admit that's as arbitrary an observation as any. Still, it makes sense to me. And like I say, in my experience the vast majority of films with scores in the high 90s tend to be significantly better than average, whether or not one agrees that they're '98% good'.
There are some critics who wear their support on their sleeve, but yes, it's mostly speculation -- but I include Deadwyler's assessment with that as well. I find it strange that there's an implicit idea baked into those assessments (like with The Woman King or Straight Outta Compton). The idea is that it can't possibly be that my performance or my film is anything less than making the cut of the final nominations. But there are many films/performances that are "snubbed" every year -- and we don't know if it was by a little or a lot. It's just that in these cases, there's a charge levied -- but what of the others? Do we hear a din from those filmmakers and actors saying, "What about me?" -- with their own 7.9 ave score -- every year? I assume they loved the quality of their projects as well, right?
shareLike I say, I don't think we can categorically say that the omission of certain Black-themed films is 'racism', but nor can we categorically discount the possibility.
Unfortunately, a lot of racism is intangible and hard to pin-down, but that doesn't mean it doesn't exist.
Well, samoenjones dismissed the film, as well as the performance, although I do agree that the performance is the real focus of this thread, and I am more surprised that Deadwyler wasn't recognised than I am that the film as a whole was snubbed.
shareWhilst I sympathise with Deadwyler, since many observers predicted she would receive a Best Actress nomination for this critically well-regarded film, and it's entirely possible that racism or misogynoir had a part to play in her snub, if she wants things to change, I'm not entirely sure that blaming people for choosing not to see the film before proceeding to say "The question is more intent on people who are living in whiteness, white people’s assessment of what the spaces they are privileged by are doing," will help her case, even if she's right.
White people have a duty NOT to be racist. No one, however, has a duty to see a particular film, especially if the suggestion is that the film is going to make them feel bad. No one likes to feel bad (which is one of the many reasons why white people shouldn't be racist; racism makes POC feel bad).
I mean, it's unfortunate and unfair, but whilst it's important that honest and potentially difficult films about systemic racism, like Till, are made, in promoting them, you have to sell people on why they should see a given film, and saying "This film will make you feel bad about being white," is not a big marketing draw for many people, rightly or wrongly. That's not a judgement. It's simply a reality.
She did not get nominated. It sucks but it tends to happen. She should have received a nomination rather than De Amares for Blonde. However, her saying it’s due to racism is wrong and makes her seem like an ungrateful sore loser.
share"She should have received a nomination rather than De Amares for Blonde."
Well, quite...
Anyway, bear in mind that I haven't categorically said it was 'racist', but I am open to that being a possibility, particularly in view of how well-regarded Till and Deadwyler's performance is.
What I will also say is that I certainly don't think Andrea Riseborough is to blame here (as some people at least seem to be implying). In fact, it would be unfair to blame any of the nominated actors in this category (including de Armas). Even if the decision of the voters was racist, that's not the fault of the nominated women.
Understood. I was not saying you said it was racist, just the the director and actress are claiming that. I saw Andrea Riseborough’s performance and it was great. But that is after I saw she was nominated. I see about two new releases movies a week and I never even heard of the film.
shareI don't think we can categorically discount racism being a possible factor, but, alas, it's impossible to prove, and thus, it's perfectly possible that Chukwu and Deadwyler are mistaken. However, I must admit, I was surprised that this highly acclaimed film didn't receive *any* AMPAS nominations, but since I haven't yet been able to see it for myself, that isn't based on my own appraisal of the film, but just what I've picked up regarding the 'word-on-the-street'.
I wish I still had the case to see two new releases a week, but good on you if you're able to. I don't begrudge you whatsoever. I just wish I was still in a similar position.
I thought Till would have received actress and screenplay. Heck maybe even picture, it’s a far better film than Elvis and Avatar: the way of the water. I saw the director’s last film Clemency. I would not say I enjoyed it because it is a very depressing and dark film. But it was a powerful and emotional film that I will remember, so I do recommend if you ever want to see an earlier work of the director’s. I am sorry to hear you cannot see two releases a week. I guess it is easier for me since I am not married with no kids. But seeing two a week, you do see some astonish ly bad movie at times
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Yo man but, why did wil Smith wins the Oscars in the last year bro?
shareBecause Will Smith is a house n
shareAre you Black, TheArgentinian?
Even if you are, why are you trying to demean Will Smith simply for giving a great performance? The whole point is, we want more Black actors to be recognised, so putting them down when they finally are, hardly seems in keeping with that aim. Moreover, Smith is hardly being treated like the Academy's favourite right now, is he? And that's despite the fact that there are AMPAS members and recipients who've arguably done far worse (albeit, admittedly not live during an Oscars telecast).
I'm latinx.
shareWell, if you're not African-American, I'm not really sure you're in a position to use the N-word.
shareDon't engage the so-called Argentinian if you expect real dialogue. You would get circular "logic" like above.
shareThank you for the advice. I'll give them a chance to explain themself, but so far, you seem to be right, and they appear to trying to obfucate the fact that they used a demeaning term to describe a Black man.
shareI "seem to be right" because I have already learned the lesson you are learning. Your patience is admirable.
shareSays one of the chief troll of Moviechat. Don't you have to complain about something being wOkE somewhere else?
shareIsn't a latinx some sort of cat?
shareIf TheArgentinian is genuinely of Latin descent, it's not my places to tell them how they can refer to themself, but in my experience, many Latinos and Latinas are not keen on the term 'latinx' (although I do appreciate the thinking behind the term, particularly as someone who tends to use gender neutral terms wherever possible).
shareNot to mention, Latinx is pronounced la-tinx, like minx.
shareAnd you're a racist POS.
shareWhites keep the negro down!
shareOh bullshit.
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