anti vaxxer
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Is he an anti-vaxxer, or is he against this specific vaccine? I'm against KISS being an actual band, but that doesn't mean I'm anti-music.
shareThat's an appropriate distinction.
What is really scary are the people who don't understand that the covid vaccine was rushed and has been barely tested.
I got called a conspiracy theorist because I said I didn't trust this vaccine. I told them that cancer has been around forever, AIDS has been prominent since the 80s, the common cold has been around since the beginning of time, same with the flu, and none of them have anything close to a cure. Why would I trust a vaccine that has been out for less than a year that the CDC says is about 90% effective and we're unsure of the long term effects?
shareWhy would I trust a vaccine that has been out for less than a year that the CDC says is about 90% effective and we're unsure of the long term effects?
this^^^
whats going to happen in 5 to 10 years, will kids be born with birth defects? anything that alters your RNA cant be good for you.
I'm no scientist and I'm sure nothing will happen, but how can I be sure? If it was so easy to come up with a Coronavirus vaccine, shouldn't there have been a cancer vaccine out by now?
shareif everyone in the world worked that hard on a cancer vaccine, I am sure they could have something in a year or 2. we all know that finding a cure for cancer is not viable, its a trillion dollar industry...
shareDifferent types of cancer, therefore not one cure.
You're screwed if you get cancer since the new treatments are based on the same medical science as the covid vaccine.
scientists have been working on a cure for diabetes for over 40 years and still have nothing. trillions has been donated over the years and all we have is remote way to check blood sugar. a cure for the deadliest pathogen in history only took 6 months or so... whats the dealio?
shareYour desire for a single "cure" is simplistic. There has been major progress in the prevention and treatment of diabetes in the past 40 years.
Monitor your AC1 level, moderate exercise, eat less simple carbohydrates especially refined sugar and maintain normal weight.
I just successfully helped a family member lower their prediabetes AC1 back to normal with lifestyle changes.
Prevention is key.
Too many Americans make poor choices and want a doctor to cure them. Make the correct lifestyle choices especially if you're in the beginning stages of high cholesterol, high blood pressure or diabetes in order to avoid the need for medication after your health has deteriorated.
Don't be a 350lb sedentary smoker and cry that there's no cure for diabetes.
lowering your A1C only affects those with prediabetes, it doesnt cure Type 2. making poor health decisions has nothing to do with diabetes, cancer and other incurable ailments. like I said before, finding a cure to major diseases will probably never happen. its too much of a money maker, big pharma would go broke and the majority of hospitals would close too...
shareYou must be the 350lb sedentary smoker who is crying about no cure for diabetes.
shareI agree.
I feel like if people want the vaccine they should be able to get it. But those same people should not ridicule and try to make life hard for people who don't want to take an experimental drug whose long-term effects are unknown.
This seems like a clear case of everyone's decisions should be understood and respected. But the camp of people who are gung-ho for the vaccine have no respect for why other people might be hesitant.
Incredible insight. They might award you the Nobel Prize for reaching the bottom of this grand conspiracy to implant microchips into everyone under the guise of something we can’t even see. That’s also why I don’t wash my hands. Can I see your sources btw?
shareYou need sources to know that the vaccine hasn't undergone the normal testing that most medicines have to go through before getting FDA approval?
If you actually need a source for this, then I find your ignorance terrifying, especially since I know that there are many others just like you.
Anyway, here's a source for the usual process:
https://www.uchicagomedicine.org/forefront/coronavirus-disease-covid-19/how-does-the-fda-approve-vaccines
Newsflash: The coronavirus vax did not go through the normal process, which usually takes 5 to 10 years.
Uh, no where in your source did it back up any of your claims. Pfizer went through all the clinical trials, testing, and FDA seal of approval. If you can prove it didn’t I would be forever impressed.
shareI didn't say it didn't have FDA approval. I said it didn't go through the usual process for approval. It received a fast-track pandemic exemption from the usual standards.
As I said, the typical process takes 5 to 10 years. Has the pandemic been going on for 5 to 10 years?
Anyone who takes the vaccine is taking an experimental drug. They simply haven't had the time to fully test it. You don't need me to tell you this. I'm sure you can work it out on your own if you really think about it and if you know anything about vaccine testing.
Okay, tell me what the “usual process” is then? Because it’s pretty obvious the vaccines went through the “usual process.”
Tell me exactly what “standards” did it receive a “fast-track exemption” from, because right now it just seems like your making stuff up and parroting things you’ve heard other idiots saying.
Why does a pandemic need to last 5-10 years for us to develop a vaccine? We already had SARS in 2003. These types of vaccines have been decades in the making.
Again, what “tests” weren’t run exactly? It’s so frustrating because you say a lot of general things without any concrete and specific examples.
The link I posted earlier explains the process. Note the first line in that article:
"The process of getting a vaccine approved for use in the general public is no picnic and can take several years."
My stat of 5 to 10 years comes from this article:
https://coronavirus.jhu.edu/vaccines/timeline
Again, note the first line:
"A typical vaccine development timeline takes 5 to 10 years, and sometimes longer, to assess whether the vaccine is safe and efficacious in clinical trials, complete the regulatory approval processes, and manufacture sufficient quantity of vaccine doses for widespread distribution."
Regarding fast-tracking approval, you can read this:
https://www.fda.gov/patients/fast-track-breakthrough-therapy-accelerated-approval-priority-review/fast-track
We did not already have a vaccine waiting in the wings that had been developed and approved. They had to create one specifically for this virus.
What kinds of long-term effects might the vaccine have on people? They don't know, because it hasn't existed long enough for any kind of long-term observational studies to be done. However, one thing we're already seeing in some people are heart issues:
https://www.nbcnews.com/health/health-news/evidence-grows-stronger-covid-vaccine-link-heart-issue-cdc-says-n1270339
What other side-effects might rear their heads in the next, say, 10 years? Who knows, since the vaccine hasn't been around long enough to actually do a 10-year study.
If people want to get it, let them get it. I think they should have that freedom. But it's reasonable to be cautious. Frankly, I'd rather take my chances with covid, especially since data suggests that covid-recovered people actually have stronger immunity to the virus than those who are vaccinated. And furthermore, the vaccine's usefulness in combating the Delta variant is questionable as it is:
https://www.science.org/news/2021/08/grim-warning-israel-vaccination-blunts-does-not-defeat-delta
Your patience in spelling that out repeatedly to someone is astounding.
shareUnfortunately his IQ level doesn’t match his tenacity. Most of what he’s saying is lies parroted by conspiracy theorists, don’t pay him any attention kiddo.
shareI don't share his views on the vaccine. I'm pro vax.
But you've demonstrated that you have no idea how to defend the vaccine.
Having people like you on my side of the debate does the vaccine a disservice because you don't know what you're saying, and you're coming off ignorant as hell.
His original, basic point about the "usual process" is true. It doesn't change my views, and I have my own thoughts in response. But you're just a superficial arguer.
Hell, I don't even know why you're responding to me. I didn't reply to you. You didn't get a notification.
If you were actually “pro-vax” you would not be defending these complete lies. I think you’re an anti-vaxxer that moonlights as a “pro-vaxxer” on message boards to cause confusion and muddy the waters. Nice job.
Also I am neither pro nor anti anything. All I’m concerned about are facts. If someone can’t provide facts then they are wasting everyone’s time. Tell me genius, what exactly is the “usual process” and what “corners were cut”? Or are you just another mouth-breathing charlatan?
The coronavirus vaccine took about 10 years to develop. When Covid-19 came, they were able to quickly adapt it since covid is a coronavirus.
Israel is saying the booster shot is working well.
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This
It's not like the coronavirus is brand new. It's just this strain of it. So they built a vaccine off of what they already knew and had approved.
I fully understand being wary of what a person puts in their body. But I also believe that we have an obligation in society not to harm others. So if a person chooses not to vaccinate then they are also choosing not to fully partake in society.
Again, where is your evidence that a “fast track” vaccine is unsafe? Where were these alleged corners cut, because your source is, again, not verifying what you’re claiming. There is nothing about “fast tracking” on that deems it less effective.
If you knew anything about the history of these vaccines, you would know that the technology behind it had been developing for decades and that we already had years of prior research into a coronavirus vaccine thanks to the SARS epidemic in 2003. There’s nothing “unsafe” about its development.
You claim there are “heart issues” with people taking the vaccine. Less than 300 people have been diagnosed with these side effects. That’s a .000001% chance of getting this problem you’re talking about.
The vaccine is also still 76% effective against the Delta variant, and a booster shot remains more effective than not getting vaccinated at all.
At this point I’m going to give you another chance to polish your responses after I’ve debunked all your claims
You're clearly just trolling at this point so I'm going to cut you loose.
Be well.
I don’t know what that word means. I guess you admitted defeat?
shareIt's obvious by your tone and responses you're not actually trying to learn. So I will not waste my time. As the poster above said, I have already been enormously patient with you. That patience has run out.
shareYour gaslighting to an intelligent reply makes you appear very ignorant and small. You didn't even attempt to defend your position. If you feel the other poster made good points, then you should be big enough to admit it.
shareI feel like my main point has already been made and that poster keeps moving the goal posts.
The main point is that we have no idea what the long-term consequences of the vaccine might be because we haven't had a chance to do those observational studies.
It's obvious that the poster knew nothing about the vaccine regulatory process, fast-tracking, the length of time it usually takes to get FDA approval and so on. I'm surprised after reading the whole exchange you would say that I am the one who appears ignorant and small.
The poster basically said that I myself have to somehow prove that serious long-term consequences will arise before I (or anyone else) can validly have concerns that such consequences may occur. Does that sound like good logic to you? Or are you not aware that not all drug side-effects occur in the short-term?
Your concern about the development timeline was already addressed. Johnson & Johnson is a traditional vaccine unlike the others. I'm not sure why you would fear that one.
Getting covid can have long-term effects. People have lost their sense of smell and taste which can be permanent. Others have lung, brain or heart damage. And there is long covid. Or you can end up in the hospital or die. You can't know how your body will respond to covid.
At least the vaccine gives you a chance to be around for the long-term. I never take vaccines, but made an exception for this one. I did the research and delayed taking it to see how others did.
Anyway, thanks for your civil reply to my post.
What's most fascinating is that it's the Chinese vaccines that's the traditional one - every other vaccine has a gene therapy element in them.
I'm still astounded that PMX held out so long to your troll posts.
I know that you are trolling because he is providing you with tons of research links while all you do is state your disbelief and absolutely no research data.
Imagine getting a surgery - a 6 hour surgery fast-tracked into 1 hour surgery. But wait - you'll ask, where is your evidence that 1 hour surgery is more risky? Others will say - check the VAERS data! But wait, you'll say, anyone can submit those reports to VAERS!
So, here we are - lol The only way of tracking side effects of the vaccines is now being labeled as fake - and there is no way of proving shit to trolls like you.
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Then the unvaccinated need to wear a fucking mask! Stop breathing on all of us who are trying to do right by society!!
shareVaccines and cures aren't the same thing. A vaccine is to prevent something you haven't had. A cure is to get rid of something you've already got.
Sure there's no cure for AIDS, but these days it's super treatable. Not only that, but cancer isn't a virus so I don't think it's comparable.
These people will never understand.
shareWhy would I trust a vaccine that has been out for less than a year that the CDC says is about 90% effective and we're unsure of the long term effects?
It's not even 90% effective, it's less than 42% effective:
https://www.yahoo.com/news/pfizer-covid-19-vaccine-just-143124782.html
So less than 1 in 2 chance of it actually doing anything at all, but if the messengers get into your bloodstream there is a 6 in 10 chance that you will develop SAEs or will eventually die of clotting within a few year's time.
What person in their right mind would run those sort of odds for something with a 99.7% survival rate? share
It's says Pfizer is 42% effective. Maybe the one the CDC said was 90% was another brand.
shareLOL... Moderna was rated as only 76% effective and the numbers keep dropping each month.
Then again, the CDC has been lying nonstop throughout this entire debacle. So the 90% was probably pulled out of their butthole since ZERO longitudinal data has been available for these RNA drugs, and the first Phase III clinical trial test won't conclude until May, 2023. So I have no idea how CDC could have come up with 90% effective when the availability of the data to make that conclusion is still two years out... at the least.
Swing for the fences
shareWe've seen this before. You didn't vote for Hilary? You hate women! You didn't vote for Obama? You're racist! You don't want to be injected with an experimental drug? You're an anti-vaxxer!
shareFDA approved drug.
shareIt's an experimental drug that hasn't been tested in even close to the same manner as any previous vaccine, and instead was rushed through approval primarily for political reasons. Also worth noting: it's the first mRNA vaccine to be given to humans. We have no idea what the long-term effects will be.
If you want to be a guinea pig and be injected with an untested, experimental drug, go for it. I have no issue with anyone who doesn't want to participate, and believe it's wrong to mandate people join the experiment.
Some other food for thought:
Vaccinated people are contracting covid at the exact same rate as unvaccinated people. We don't have any data yet on whether or not being vaccinated decreases one's chance of dying from covid.
Covid itself is not particularly deadly. Since many, likely most, people who contract it don't get sick, we don't know how many total cases there have been, but even based on how many have tested positive, the chance of dying if you catch covid is less than 1%... approximately 3 in 1,000 who catch covid die from it. Again, since many people who caught it were never tested, the 3 in 1000 number is exaggerated, but we don't know the real, smaller, number.
Hospitals are filled with anti-vaxxers which prove that the vaccines do work. 648,000+ dead Americans prove you're wrong about it not being deadly. And it's an ugly way to die. Sometimes you just linger for weeks or months gasping for air. Or you may get long covid and be too sick to leave the house. Or you may lose your sense of smell and taste -permanently.
It was tested and now it's approved. Research lasted around 10 years.
Your math is ridiculously bad.
You watch too much television.
sharePeople in my workplace lingered for weeks before they died. It's an ugly way to die. After a temporary lull, many workers are getting sick again.
shareIt's terrible when anyone dies, but that doesn't justify mandating an experimental and barely tested drug. If some want to take it, they're free to do so, but there's no reason to insult or discriminate against those who don't.
And just as food for thought, here's an article from 1989 (reprinted in 2015) that may feel familiar. A brief summary: in 1989, the FDA was pushed by Dr. Anthony Fauci to race a drug called AZT through to approval for treating AIDS, primarily in order to reward the drug's patent holders with vast wealth. Eventually it became evident that AZT was killing people faster than AIDS and approval was revoked.
https://www.spin.com/featured/aids-and-the-azt-scandal-spin-1989-feature-sins-of-omission/
Your blind faith in your television is your own business, but don't force anyone else to play guinea pig in this experiment.
The same anti-vaxxers complaining about the vaccines being experimental are taking hydroxychloroquine, remdesivir, ivermectin or disinfectant most of which were promoted by QAnon, therefore I consider your excuse to be false.
Furthermore, if you were concerned about "experimental" then you'd fight against genetically modified plants and chemicals in your food. And fight against the pollutants in your water and air which are known carcinogens. And not smoke cigarettes.
Your complaint rings hollow.
Anti-vaxxers also denounced masks, social distancing and mandated bans on all protective measures while holding mass gatherings. Let's face it, you are a death cult. Your casual shrug at 648,000 American deaths proves that.
There's every reason to discriminate against those not vaccinated since they are spreading the virus.
Go look at how the CDC defines unvaccinated, then you'll realize you've been cheated. They are changing definitions in order to divide people and mislead people to take 3,4, who knows how many boosters that are not working now anyway. And don't come back all guns blazing unless you've read what the CDC has published with how THEY define vaccinated.
shareLink?
shareYou'll find it here - https://www.cdc.gov/vaccines/covid-19/clinical-considerations/covid-19-vaccines-us.html
Look.on the page for text "A person is considered fully vaccinated against COVID-19 ≥2 weeks after"
Nobody is misleading anything. Johnson requires one dose to be fully vaccinated. Moderna and Pfizer require two doses to be fully vaccinated. I had the Moderna one month a part in order to have full vaccination.
Because of mutations, we may need a yearly booster.
Why you running cover for them?
shareYou should educate yourself with the facts. Just discuss your concerns with your medical doctor.
shareThe CDC are adding two week period after, by when you say they are "fully vaccinated", totally misleading..Any adverse reactions of which there are plenty are being reported as "non-vaccinated", they should be using the terms - non, partially and fully - doing as they are is totally miss miss-representing the public. In Israel their definition is 3 jabs..
shareOK, I get your confusion. It wasn't the CDC. Each drug co. researched the effectiveness of their drug. It takes your body a few weeks to slowly build up immunity after the jab. With Moderna, the first shot gives 50.8% effectiveness after 14 days. You wait one month to take the second jab which gives 94.1% after two weeks when it''s considered full immunity.
Pfizer is similar. Johnson is one jab with 74% effectiveness after a few weeks. All vaccines prevent hospitalizations and death.
After the jab, you wait around for 15 minutes to make sure there are no adverse reactions. I never witnessed anyone with a bad reaction. Most people have a slightly sore arm where jabbed for two or three days. Maybe a slight headache and tiredness for some.
Over time, the vaccine will lose it's effectiveness. Also, the variants will make it less effective. That is the third jab or booster shot you're talking about in Israel where they took Pfizer. Moderna is still 93% effective after 6 months.
Johnson is a traditional vaccine unlike Moderna and Pfizer. You should talk to your doctor if you have questions.
Exactly. This is why I choose not to label myself as a liberal or conservative. Once I choose a side, the other side attacks.
shareI don't agree with either side on all issues. However, I am fully aware that lately it's much riskier to espouse right wing views than left. Anyone who expresses left wing ideology is lauded by the mainstream, and worst case will be mocked by those on the right. Anyone expressing right wing ideology is likely to be physically assaulted, in some cases killed, and probably "canceled," i.e. rendered homeless and unemployed for having expressed an opinion.
share100% agree.
shareconservative
sharehttps://i.kym-cdn.com/entries/icons/original/000/021/818/hitlerbook.JPG
shareLOL! You just insulted yourself and conservatives. I only called you a conservative. You made the leap by attaching Hitler. Tsk, tsk!
Anyway, some of the things you wrote in your post are typically conservative. It wasn't an accusation, just an observation.
Wow, no one seems to have read the article. He also refused to get a covid test before coming on set. I’d say all signs point to him being a covid denier or just an all around selfish p’k. Hope they deduct the money lost from closing set from his pay.
shareA Covid denier is still different than being an anti-vaxxer.
shareSo much crossover nowadays. Agree the antivaxxers were around long before covid, but their message seems to have been swept up by the antimasking, covid-is-a-hoax-believing, ivermectin-taking, hydroxychloroquine-swallowing, bunker-building, sage burning, establishment-fearing folk.
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