Lizzie trailer is finally here - Kristen Stewart Discussion

[–] Ron2011 (907) 6 years ago

From the trailer:
"The chemistry between Chloe Sevigny and Kristen Stewart is electric."
"The Lizzie Borden story for the modern generation."

This looks like an excellent thriller! The trailer gives a good insight into the drama of the story and characters.

reply

[–] Mody (183) 6 years ago

Yes i agree. The trailer looks so much more promising than i expected!! This movie seem really good and one that would be so interesting!!

reply

[–] LLOwens (983) 6 years ago

"The chemistry between Chloe Sevigny and Kristen Stewart is electric."

Kristen's chemistry with every single one of her costars is electric IMO--especially when it involves an onscreen love interest. Yes, even in The Twilight Saga films, her chemistry with Robert Pattinson and Taylor Lautner was undeniable. Earlier today I uploaded my most recent edit which showcases her deft ability to realistically portray this with several of her costars throughout her career from Speak to Lizzie: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ox82vCG6FTs

reply

[–] Ron2011 (907) 6 years ago

Thanks for another excellent video of Kristen movie flash backs. Great choice of music - especially the (Italian I think?) version.

Yes, she always seems to have great chemistry with her onscreen love interests. That must have a lot to say of her ability to portray her characters so realistically.

reply

[–] LLOwens (983) 6 years ago

Great choice of music - especially the (Italian I think?) version.

From the very first time I heard the original version of Ed Sheeran's single Perfect, long before it became a chart-topping hit, I wanted to use it in one of my music videos--the main reason being, great contemporary love songs are becoming increasingly rare nowadays unlike during the '60s, '70s, '80s, and '90s when it seems that dozens of love songs ranging from good to awe-inspiring were released each year. I'm pretty sure Carved would agree. Unfortunately, the copyright owners of this song are not allowing unaffiliated users such as myself to use the song on YouTube.

But low and behold, the duet version of this song featuring Andrea Bocelli is allowed for use in YouTube videos. While I'm not a big fan of opera in general, my fave opera song of all time is "Time to Say Goodbye", which is a duet performed by Bocelli and Sarah Brightman. So naturally, when Sheeran and Bocelli teamed up to do a duet of the orchestral version of "Perfect", I thought it was the most appropriate song released this year to accompany film clips of Kristen at her romantic best.

reply

[–] LLOwens (983) 6 years ago

Yes, she always seems to have great chemistry with her onscreen love interests. That must have a lot to say of her ability to portray her characters so realistically.

Exactly Ron. Those who claim that Kristen is a monotone actress fail to recognize this. If human beings are sexual beings, then shouldn't capable actresses be able to portray this realistically? In my humble opinion, Kristen is light years ahead of the vast majority of the actresses of her generation, even including critically acclaimed and Oscar-nominated/winning actresses such as Jennifer Lawrence and Saoirse Ronan, when it comes to displaying believable chemistry with her onscreen love interest.

If Kristen had merely played nonsexual roles as she did in the first three installments of The Twilight Saga, or if she was typecast as a celibate Catholic Nun for that matter, and her only womanly qualities were frigid in nature, then, by all means, let them call her a monotone actress. But the fact that most of her roles require her to do almost the exact opposite of being frigid, how can anyone say with a straight face that she is monotone?

reply

[–] Ron2011 (907) 6 years ago

"Those who claim that Kristen is a monotone actress fail to recognize this. If human beings are sexual beings, then shouldn't capable actresses be able to portray this realistically? "

I think what she does well is, like you say, shows emotions realistically, not over done. She can show so much with a look or facial expression, and that nicely complements her realistic emoting of feelings and attitude. I think she erroneously gets the label of being monotone for some of these realistic qualities where movie goers might expect a more flamboyant showing of emotion. Either way can work of course but I think Kristen does quite well with her style.

reply

[–] LLOwens (983) 6 years ago

I think she erroneously gets the label of being monotone for some of these realistic qualities where movie goers might expect a more flamboyant showing of emotion. Either way can work of course but I think Kristen does quite well with her style.

Perfectly stated Ron. If this was not the case then why has Kristen won awards from the most prestigious film critics groups in the world such as the New York Film Critics Circle, National Society of Film Critics and the Los Angeles Film Critics Association, while actresses with much more flamboyant acting styles such as Tina Fey, Amy Poehler, Melissa McCarthy, Kristen Wiig, Maya Rudolph and Rebel Wilson to name a few, have not. And from these aforementioned actresses, only one, McCarthy, has received an acting Oscar nom. While judging acting talent, as is true with most art forms, is subjective, I'd much rather go with the top film critics when it comes to analyzing and assessing acting performances than with the average Joe moviegoer.

reply

[–] [deleted] 6 years ago

no link

reply

[–] Mody (183) 6 years ago

Fixed it

reply

[–] CKid (3816) 6 years ago

[deleted]

[–] Mody (183) 6 years ago

Fixed the link now 😅

And yeah it will be released in select theaters! Hopefully it does well and go wide who knows, roadside seem really good and might support the movie!

Hopefully all fans get to see it and enjoy it.

reply

[–] LLOwens (983) 6 years ago

The Lizzie trailer linked on this Facebook page has over 2.5 million views showing there is huge interest in this film: https://www.facebook.com/hashtag/lizziethemovie?source=feed_text

Hopefully, many who watched the trailer will support the film in theaters.

reply

[–] Mody (183) 6 years ago

Yes there is interest in the movie!
I hope so

reply

[–] LLOwens (983) 6 years ago

Since I posted that Facebook link a few days ago Mody, the Lizzie trailer posted on this page has nearly 2 million additional views--bringing the total to almost 4.5 million views in just 4 days! Hopefully, this generates a ton of buzz for this film which is crucial to box office success in this day and age, especially when it comes to indie films which don't have a massive advertising budget.

reply

[–] Mody (183) 6 years ago

I hope so, the movie wasn't heard of until the trailer was released and it was relesed 1 month before so the promo is starting late. I've seen a lot of people sharing the trailer on twitter and talking about it. It certainly sparked interest among people i hope it does well opening weekend that would make roadside to push it into wide release and it would make it also give it a push during award season.

reply

[–] Ron2011 (907) 6 years ago

Wow, yeah, I hope the trailer views show interest in the movie. I think it looks quite good from the trailer. As it says, a new twist for the modern audience. Given the intriguing character back stories that would seem to go with the story line, I figure with the characters will be quite interesting. I think we see some of that from the trailer.

reply

[–] LLOwens (983) 6 years ago

I'm hoping this is a case where the movie is just as good or better than the trailer, not the other way around, as the trailer has several of the elements which make a great thriller such as an engrossing storyline, heart-pounding/fast pacing, the main characters are shown leading a miserable existence, multilayered characters who go through dramatic character arcs as well as the story being told from multiple points of view, while the graphic images pretty much speak for themselves. I noticed the way the trailer paints Lizzie's father as a sleazeball with a penchant for violence, which makes it appear that he is the primary antagonist when it is later revealed that he isn't as he ends up murdered by the real antagonist. For someone with no prior knowledge of the backstory, this would provide quite a wicked twist if you ask me.

After you, Carved and I were discussing Kristen's pre-Twilight roles, Ron, I recently decided to do an edit showcasing all of Kristen's feature film performances entitled: "Kristen Stewart - Versatile Actress" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=afA-_SmdwoI and thought, what better way to cap it all off than to include clips of her from the Lizzie trailer.

reply

[–] Ron2011 (907) 6 years ago

I also commented on the video, well done. I want to add that it's pretty great seeing some of her co-stars, especially in younger movies, who have grown up to have strong careers of their own. Jamie Bell from Undertow for one. Also Max Theriot, Eddie Redmayne. Kind of cool seeing Timothy Oliphant in Safety of Objects in an earlier role, quite different from his Hit Man and Transformers roles.

LL, good summary on what can make a good thriller! You summed up what I feel is good about the trailer and what it shows about the movie's possibilities. I hope the movie lives up to it and I think the characters will be very good, and with lots of twists like you say.

reply

[–] LLOwens (983) 6 years ago

I hope the movie lives up to it and I think the characters will be very good, and with lots of twists like you say.

The thriller genre is one of my faves so I too want this to be as good as advertised Ron. The trailer appears to cater to horror film fans. I'm guessing this has to do with low budget horror films in general usually doing better than thrillers at the box office according to established film data researcher Stephen Follows: https://stephenfollows.com/low-budget-films-make-the-most-money/ I believe this is similar to the way "Get Out" was marketed, as its trailer made the film appear predominantly like a horror film when, in my opinion, it was more of a psychological thriller with horror interspersed. But bottom line, Get Out had a great story, screenplay, direction and acting performances which all contributed to its critical and commercial success. I'm pretty sure Lizzie will have great acting and obviously a great story. Hopefully, its screenplay and direction will do the aforementioned justice, by keeping viewers on the edge of their seats.

reply

[–] Ron2011 (907) 6 years ago

"But bottom line, Get Out had a great story, screenplay, direction and acting performances which all contributed to its critical and commercial success. I'm pretty sure Lizzie will have great acting and obviously a great story. Hopefully, its screenplay and direction will do the aforementioned justice, by keeping viewers on the edge of their seats. "

If Lizzie can capture similar drama and intensity as Get Out then it should do quite well. I think the key is the drama and characters, unlike slasher movies which are mainly about the slash and garish killing.

reply

[–] LLOwens (983) 6 years ago

If Lizzie can capture similar drama and intensity as Get Out then it should do quite well. I think the key is the drama and characters, unlike slasher movies which are mainly about the slash and garish killing.

I believe the biggest mistake many filmmakers in the horror genre make is they forget the roots of the genre--in this case Alfred Hitchcock's Psycho is the film they should be trying to reimagine in new and exciting ways as this is the film which was the trailblazer for the slasher genre and ironic in the sense that Psycho implied bloody violence instead of graphically depicting it as is so common today as you mentioned. Other groundbreaking films horror directors could pattern their films after is The Shining and Rosemary's Baby. I say this because although these films contain acts of violence, they are more about creating an atmosphere and mood of fear, vulnerability and paranoia than they are about depicting bloody graphic violence just for the sake of depicting bloody graphic violence.

reply

[–] Ron2011 (907) 6 years ago

"I say this because although these films contain acts of violence, they are more about creating an atmosphere and mood of fear, vulnerability and paranoia than they are about depicting bloody graphic violence just for the sake of depicting bloody graphic violence. "

Agreed, hence the drama and the intensity of the story line being a draw to audiences. A big plus if the characters are relatable and/or have a compelling personal part to them.

reply

[–] LLOwens (983) 6 years ago

Agreed, hence the drama and the intensity of the story line being a draw to audiences. A big plus if the characters are relatable and/or have a compelling personal part to them.

For me personally, I'm not a fan of horror films in general--that is, unless the main characters are compelling and relatable as you mentioned Ron. This could explain why my fave horror films which I regard as the exception include: The Shining, Rosemary's Baby, Psycho, Misery, The Silence of the Lambs, and Alien. Jack Nicholson and Shelly Duvall as Jack and Wendy Torrance in "The Shining." Mia Farrow as Rosemary in "Rosemary's Baby." Anthony Perkins as Norman Bates along with Vera Miles and Janet Leigh as Lila and Marion Crane in "Psycho." Kathy Bates as Annie Wilkes in "Misery." Jodie Foster as Clarice Starling and Anthony Hopkins as Hannibal Lecter in "The Silence of the Lambs." Sigourney Weaver as Ripley in "Alien."

These characters are so compelling and unforgettable and played to virtual perfection by the aforementioned actors that they don't need an introduction. Hopefully, one day, Kristen will have the privilege of portraying such a character. Speaking of great characters, and not so great ones, unfortunately for her, some refuse to let her live down her Bella Swan character, which some would admit was one of the worse characters ever invented for a female-oriented, young adult film franchise. Conversely, Katniss, played by Jennifer Lawrence, is arguably the best character ever invented for this sub-genre, a near antithesis of Bella Swan--well at least with regard to franchises of the magnitude of say, Twilight, The Hunger Games and Harry Potter. This could explain why JLaw and KStew are two of the best actresses of their generation, yet the general consensus of mainstream moviegoers perception often favors Lawrence above Stewart.

reply

[–] Ron2011 (907) 6 years ago

"These characters are so compelling and unforgettable and played to virtual perfection by the aforementioned actors that they don't need an introduction. Hopefully, one day, Kristen will have the privilege of portraying such a character. Speaking of great characters, and not so great ones, unfortunately for her, some refuse to let her live down her Bella Swan character, which some would admit was one of the worse characters ever invented for a female-oriented, young adult film franchise. Conversely, Katniss, played by Jennifer Lawrence, is arguably the best character ever invented for this sub-genre, a near antithesis of Bella Swan--well at least with regard to franchises of the magnitude of say, Twilight, The Hunger Games and Harry Potter. This could explain why JLaw and KStew are two of the best actresses of their generation, yet the general consensus of mainstream moviegoers perception often favors Lawrence above Stewart. "

Also for Kristen, and in my view to her credit, she favors taking on smaller Indie roles which are good character roles and get her good critical praise for her portrayals. However, those roles aren't as noticeable as the roles in larger movies which get more buzz from audiences regardless of the strength of the story line or character roles. The real winners are the big movies with strong story lines and memorable characters like those you mentioned.

reply

[–] LLOwens (983) 6 years ago

Also for Kristen, and in my view to her credit, she favors taking on smaller Indie roles which are good character roles and get her good critical praise for her portrayals. However, those roles aren't as noticeable as the roles in larger movies which get more buzz from audiences regardless of the strength of the story line or character roles. The real winners are the big movies with strong story lines and memorable characters like those you mentioned.

Unfortunately for Kristen from AMPAS' standpoint, it is what it is as you stated Ron. Like Carved and Mody were discussing on another thread, I too find it increasingly odd that Kristen's best performances post-Twilight (i.e., On the Road, Clouds of Sils Maria, Camp X-Ray, Certain Women, Personal Shopper) were all picked up the same distributor. While these were all low-budget independent films, it's not as if critically acclaimed performances in films can't receive accolades from the Academy.

reply

[–] Ron2011 (907) 6 years ago

"While these were all low-budget independent films, it's not as if critically acclaimed performances in films can't receive accolades from the Academy. "

Agreed, and it seems that even when Kristen gets great praise at several film festivals for a role/film, the academy seems to be looking for the bigger films, or they're looking for some niche or something for awards. I know this has been discussed before and I usually don't worry too much about it, but it seems to be a somewhat noticeable issue.

reply

[–] StarWarsRey (566) 6 years ago

It look very good

reply

[–] Ron2011 (907) 6 years ago

Agreed Rey, the trailer seems to highlight the movie nicely. Movie's story line and characters look good from the trailer. :)

reply

[–] CKid (3816) 6 years ago

The movie poster for Lizzie has just been released and it's effin' great!!!
https://bloody-disgusting.com/movie/3514964/kristen-stewart-chloe-sevigny-cast-murderous-shadow-official-lizzie-poster/

[spoiler]I love how the shadow of Chloe and Kristen forms an ax.
Needless to say, I sure wouldn't want Kristen to use that to carve her name in my face! ;-) [/spoiler]

reply

[–] LLOwens (983) 6 years ago

Must admit that the first thing my eyes zeroed in on, was of course Kristen. A close second was Manohla Dargis' praise of Kristen for proving again that she is one of the great actors of her generation. As far as their shadow shaped like an ax, like a meaningful symbol, this is perhaps what I'll remember most about this poster in the long run.

And yes, I would never have an ax to grind with Kristen even though her badass persona is just a facade, as she's truly a softie at heart.

reply

[–] Ron2011 (907) 6 years ago

Thanks for posting the link Carved. I can't seem to find it among all the other stuff there but that's ok. Really looking forward to this movie. Some may say that it's an old story being rehashed, but it seem a very different take on the story and a new look on it with some good personalities.

reply

[–] CKid (3816) 6 years ago

Ron, are you saying that you can't find the poster for Lizzie???

If you are indeed saying that, just click on the link to bloody-disgusting and then scroll down to the bottom of the article.
The poster is still there -- believe me, I just checked.

reply

[–] Ron2011 (907) 6 years ago

Carved, I found the poster, I just thought there was a film trailer too. :)

reply

[–] CKid (3816) 6 years ago

Ron, the only trailer I've seen for Lizzie is the one that Mody posted at the top of this thread.

That's the one that is being watched by Eric Butts in his "Reaction to the Lizzie trailer" video which I linked to two days ago in my post below.

If you haven't seen his reaction, I recommend that you do.

reply

[–] PaladinNJ (20308) 6 years ago

Another Lizzie Borden remake?????

reply

[–] CKid (3816) 6 years ago

Apparently, Chloe and Kristen have begun promoting 'Lizzie,' thus several YouTube videos of interviews with them have been uploaded. This includes the Entertainment Tonight interview that LL posted in my 'Charlie's Angels' thread which consists of three parts -
a) questions to Kristen about CA; b) questions to both of them re 'Lizzie'; c) a quick discussion about the upcoming 10th Anniversary release of 'Twilight' (I could have done without the last part).

I shall post the links to that one and two more in a moment, but first, since this is Mody's thread regarding the trailer for 'Lizzie', I've got to post a link to a "Reaction to the 'Lizzie' trailer" video. In it, the trailer is shown on the top left corner of the screen while Eric Butts' reaction is shown on the main screen. Although I've never seen this dude before in my life, his reaction to the trailer is kinda cool and somewhat interesting to see. I got a kick out of watching his facial expressions while the trailer was playing and his summation at the end has actually made me want to see this film even more. In addition, I had to laugh when he said during the summation that the trailer had, "almost left me speechless," because he sure was talking a helluva lot at that point.
Anyway, here ya go ... https://youtu.be/7Uc9TUaKlwc

OK, now onto the interviews ...
ET (this is the one LL posted): https://youtu.be/Jxzi5PJM_V0
E!: https://youtu.be/-kMZmDYOGCw
Hollywood XYZ: https://youtu.be/VBtdsox8KY8

reply

[–] LLOwens (983) 6 years ago

c) a quick discussion about the upcoming 10th Anniversary release of 'Twilight' (I could have done without the last part).

If there's any consolation Carved, at least the money she made from starring in Twilight now gives her the freedom to do the things she loves, and what many of us fans love to see her do, namely acting in indie films which oftentimes don't pay very well.

My first impression after watching that trailer review and impromptu reaction from Eric Butts was: He kinda reminds me of Jonah Hill, even if he may not look and act exactly like Hill does. And that initially I mistook him as one who overacts emotionally. But my initial perception of him changed after I watched some of his other reviews and came to the conclusion that he's the type of person who truly has a love for movies and wears his heart, and his emotions, on his sleeve for all to see. In one review/reaction he even became teary-eyed--so he's either a darned good actor or he really means what he says. So yes, I now honestly believe that he appeared to be genuinely excited about the Lizzie trailer and anticipates watching this film.

reply

[–] Ron2011 (907) 6 years ago

" If there's any consolation Carved, at least the money she made from starring in Twilight now gives her the freedom to do the things she loves, and what many of us fans love to see her do, namely acting in indie films which oftentimes don't pay very well. "

Twilight may not have been a strong story or a great cinematic work but it had a broad audience and fans loved it. I remember all the lines outside of events with people waiting for a long time to get into premieres and see the cast. Just by that it was a great success, I'd say. And it did well for many of the cast, especially Kristen, Anna Kendrick and Rob who have had strong careers. Much of their success has also to be due to their own abilities but getting the visibility from Twilight had to help as well.

reply

[–] LLOwens (983) 6 years ago

And it did well for many of the cast, especially Kristen, Anna Kendrick and Rob who have had strong careers. Much of their success has also to be due to their own abilities but getting the visibility from Twilight had to help as well.

One simple way of proving this Ron is by looking at their respective IMDb pages and noticing the films they are most known for. In Kristen and Rob's case, 3 out of the 4 films are from The Twilight Saga. Of course, I'm peeved by this as I strongly believe that one of the films Kristen should get recognition for is Clouds if Sils Maria. Another way is by looking at their filmography and seeing whether or not their acting careers took off post-Twilight, which appears to be the case especially with the newcomers who had supporting roles in this film franchise.

While veteran actors such as Graham Greene, Michael Sheen, Billy Burke, along with Dakota Fanning despite her young age, were quite established in Hollywood before their stint with The Twilight Saga, the exposure it gave to those cast in these films were especially beneficial to relative newcomers such as Taylor Lautner, Ashley Greene, Kellan Lutz, Jackson Rathbone, Cam Gigandet, Nikki Reed, Gil Birmingham, and Mackenzie Foy.

While Kristen was already established in indie circles, her involvement in Twilight has aided her upward mobility in terms of helping her get cast in starring roles in more mainstream, bigger budget fare.

If only Kristen had become a household name via a big budget franchise by portraying a likable character such as Katniss Everdeen from The Hunger Games, Hermione Granger from Harry Potter or even Tris from Divergent, then she wouldn't be getting anywhere as much hate as she has experienced especially during Twilight's heyday. In Kristen's case, she has learned to take the good with the bad.

reply

[–] Ron2011 (907) 6 years ago

"One simple way of proving this Ron is by looking at their respective IMDb pages and noticing the films they are most known for. In Kristen and Rob's case, 3 out of the 4 films are from The Twilight Saga. Of course, I'm peeved by this as I strongly believe that one of the films Kristen should get recognition for is Clouds if Sils Maria. Another way is by looking at their filmography and seeing whether or not their acting careers took off post-Twilight, which appears to be the case especially with the newcomers who had supporting roles in this film franchise. "

I tend to agree with you, as I also think Kristen should get a lot more credit for the many deeper role types she's done, of which there are many.

I've seen Cam Gigandet, Kellan Lutz and Mackenzie Foy in other films after Twilight. How much more visibility and work it got for them I don't know, but of course it certainly had to help. I'd like to see Taylor Lautner get more work but he seems to be doing ok, having a movie roles and in a TV series.

reply

[–] LLOwens (983) 6 years ago

I've seen Cam Gigandet, Kellan Lutz and Mackenzie Foy in other films after Twilight. How much more visibility and work it got for them I don't know, but of course it certainly had to help. I'd like to see Taylor Lautner get more work but he seems to be doing ok, having a movie roles and in a TV series.

Case in point, since signing onto Twilight, all three have been cast in a big budget film: Cam Gigandet in "The Magnificent Seven", Kellan Lutz in "Immortals" and Mackenzie Foy in "Interstellar" as well as the soon to be released "The Nutcracker and the Four Realms".

I doubt any of them would have made it this big had it not been for their involvement in The Twilight Saga, as prior to being cast in this franchise Gigandet starred in only a couple of small budget indies, Lutz in some mid-budget films and Foy only in small roles in TV series such as Hawaii Five-0.

reply

[–] Ron2011 (907) 6 years ago

"Case in point, since signing onto Twilight, all three have been cast in a big budget film: Cam Gigandet in "the Magnificent Seven", Kellan Lutz in "Immortals" and Mackenzie Foy in "Interstellar" as well as the soon to be released "The Nutcracker and the Four Realms". "

Foy seems to be starting off, or on her way, to a good career so far. Time will tell as she's so young. Interstellar is a movie I really liked; very different sci-fi and apocalyptic type movie. She was in that with Matthew McConaughey. In an interview she was thrilled when she heard him say "Alright, alright, alright", one of his trademark phrases from another movie role.

I think Kellan Lutz will be type cast in strong man type roles and action movies, which is ok as there's a lot of call for that kind of movie.

Not sure about Cam but I've seen him in several movies after Twilight. Looking at his filmography and he has a lot of movies before and after Twilight, especially afterwards.

reply

[–] LLOwens (983) 6 years ago

Foy seems to be starting off, or on her way, to a good career so far. Time will tell as she's so young. Interstellar is a movie I really liked; very different sci-fi and apocalyptic type movie. She was in that with Matthew McConaughey. In an interview she was thrilled when she heard him say "Alright, alright, alright", one of his trademark phrases from another movie role.

When Breaking Dawn - Part 1 and Part 2 began filming, Mackenzie Foy was just nine years of age. But it appears she turned ten when her scenes for this film were shot, still very young for portraying a supporting role in an immensely popular film franchise. The funny thing is Kristen was only 20 years of age when most of the principal photography for BD-1 and BD-2 was completed, making Kristen just 10 years older than Foy in real life. Perhaps because Foy looks even younger than her age and Kristen acted more mature than her age in BD-2, was I able to suspend my disbelief and sincerely believe they could really be mother and daughter onscreen.

For her role in Interstellar, Foy was 12 going on 13 as the principal photography started when she was 12 and ended when she was 13, still quite young. So I would have to agree that it's difficult to predict how good Foy will be by merely judging her by the roles she is most known for at this age, just as I had no idea how good of an actress Kristen would become basing this solely on her performance as a 10-year-old budding star in The Safety of Objects. True, she was an immensely talented child star in TSoO and Panic Room--yet honestly, I wouldn't be able to predict that she would make the transition from child star to Hollywood A-lister based on those two roles. However, it should also be said that Kristen did show even more promise as a 13-year-old veteran actress in Speak--so I must say Kristen was light years ahead of Foy at the same stages in their careers.

And thanks for reminding me of McConaughey's catchphrase from Dazed and Confused, as this is a film I must watch again. While director Richard Linklater is probably best known for his romance films, namely Before Sunrise, Before Sunset and Before Midnight, in my opinion, he has directed two of the best coming-of-age dramas of all time in Dazed and Confused and Boyhood.

reply

[–] Ron2011 (907) 6 years ago

That is a great reaction to the trailer! Eric was blown away by it. As he says, more of an adult horror. I take that to mean not gratuitous hack and slash with little story line or character depth. This seems to have story and character depth and intensity with dramatic horror and turmoil. I hope it plays out like that, as it seems it should.

reply

[–] LLOwens (983) 6 years ago

I wholeheartedly agree with Eric who emphatically stated that the trailer is dripping with tension. IMO, the tension was so thick one could cut it with a knife--or should I say, an ax.

reply

[–] Ron2011 (907) 6 years ago

"IMO, the tension was so thick one could cut it with a knife--or should I say, an ax."

Hehe, yes and ax/axe would be more fitting to cut that tension! :)

reply

[–] LLOwens (983) 5 years ago

I take that to mean not gratuitous hack and slash with little story line or character depth. This seems to have story and character depth and intensity with dramatic horror and turmoil. I hope it plays out like that, as it seems it should.

Hehe, yes and ax/axe would be more fitting to cut that tension! :)

While there was a bit of graphic violence in this film, Ron, because of the strong acting performances by both Chloe Sevigny and Kristen, it could be kept to a minimum and still effectively portray the barbaric nature of the Borden murders. And to further demonstrate that because their portrayals of Lizzie Borden and Bridget Sullivan were so convincing, I chose not to include any graphic violence in a video edit I recently did--similar to how Alfred Hitchcock implied violence in his character driven masterpiece Psycho rather than being overly dependent on "gratuitous hack and slash" like you mentioned. So I believe it's fitting to use the theme from the granddaddy of all slasher films to accompany some of my fave clips of Kristen in her role as Bridget in Lizzie: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RZ_ucA0UiD4

reply

[–] Ron2011 (907) 5 years ago

Thanks LL, good video. Kristen has some heavy, emotional parts. That's good, I like her in these kinds of roles, shows what she can do. I didn't watch all the video as I haven't yet seen the movie so didn't want too many spoilers, but I expect it'll come to cable or on demand soon.

reply

[–] LLOwens (983) 5 years ago

While this video does contain a few spoilers, I purposely added the clips out of context and not in chronological order in order not to give too much of the story away--much like how film trailers keep the key parts of the storyline rather ambiguous. The clip revealing who murdered Andrew Borden was also left out as this would have been the biggest spoiler of them all. And as you probably, know, there was also nudity in this film which I did not include.

While this film is currently available to stream in its entirely on iTunes, Amazon Prime, YouTube, Google Play and Vudu, the price is pretty steep at the moment--so if you are budget conscious you might as well wait for it when it's released in a couple of days on Blu-ray and DVD or streaming services.

reply

[–] Ron2011 (907) 5 years ago

"While this film is currently available to stream in its entirely on iTunes, Amazon Prime, YouTube, Google Play and Vudu, the price is pretty steep at the moment--so if you are budget conscious you might as well wait for it when it's released in a couple of days on Blu-ray and DVD or streaming services. "

The film should be available soon, maybe even tomorrow as Tuesdays are usual with new releases coming out to DvD and on demand. I don't yet have others of those services, though I could watch on Google or You Tube but would rather watch on my regular TV.

reply

[–] LLOwens (983) 5 years ago

The film should be available soon, maybe even tomorrow as Tuesdays are usual with new releases coming out to DvD and on demand. I don't yet have others of those services, though I could watch on Google or You Tube but would rather watch on my regular TV.

Same here Ron. And even if you were to hook up your computer to your TV, streamed video is almost always compressed. Some say one can't really tell the difference between compressed and uncompressed video, but for some reason I believe I can. Maybe it's merely a psychological preference that has no basis in reality--yet I swear the image is more vibrant on Blu-ray. So what I usually do is rent a film on Blu-ray using Netflix and if I really want to watch the movie again I either buy the Blu-ray used on sites such as eBay or wait for the price to drop substantially on sites such as Amazon.

reply

[–] Ron2011 (907) 5 years ago

"Lizzie" just came out via On Demand on my cable provider. I saw it today. Very intense movie, which makes sense for it! [spoiler] Acting was good all around, especially Chloe and Kristen. The father was a nasty guy, as was the uncle. I was wondering how the killings would be done and who would actually do them. Would it be Brigitte or Lizzie? Turned out in an interesting way. I found it a bit amusing the reason for the jury's verdict. Not saying too much even though using spoilers, in case others haven't yet seen it. [/spoiler]

reply

[–] LLOwens (983) 5 years ago

Glad you got to watch it Ron. Like I mentioned on another thread, the first time I saw it was on the big screen so you can just imagine how intense it must have been to see Kristen's character Bridget wielding the axe in a menacing fashion--threatening to kill Andrew Borden where he stood. It was interesting and educational to view some of the trial proceedings as well as what might have transpired during the Borden murders, enacted by the actors in this film, to help explain why Lizzie was eventually acquitted. For example, [spoiler]as far as circumstantial evidence, linking the suspected murder weapon, the infamous hatchet head with the sawed off handle, to the Borden murders was inconclusive as forensics revealed that no human blood, only the blood of Lizzie's pigeons was found on the blade. As far as direct evidence, only Lizzie and Bridget could have provided such evidence and testimony that was admissible in court as they were the only provable living witnesses who were at the crime scene, as both Emma and John Morse had alibis. Interestingly, several years later, Bridget made a deathbed confession to her sister that she lied under oath and changed her testimony in order to protect Lizzie. In my opinion, the screenwriter could have used Bridget's deathbed confession as a flash-forward in the film's finale, which could have made Lizzie that much better. But then again, viewers of this film were privy to Bridget's speculative actions around the time of the murders every step, and hack of the axe, of the way--so perhaps this is why there was no mention of Bridget's death bed confession.[/spoiler]

reply

[–] Ron2011 (907) 5 years ago

interesting LL. Yes, it was intense to see both women with the axes, and it made sense that they took off all clothes. I had been wondering about how they would hide the bloodied clothes before they started the killings. Then also, I hadn't known that about Bridget, and it could have gone either way as for the film depicting that [spoiler] deathbed confession. I wasn't sure about the facts of the real case and occurrence before. I didn't know if the film was a speculation on what could have happened, or if it was close to the real story. I was going to do some research on the incident so I assume I would have found out, but thanks for telling that side of things. [/spoiler]

reply

[–] LLOwens (983) 5 years ago

interesting LL. Yes, it was intense to see both women with the axes, and it made sense that they took off all clothes. I had been wondering about how they would hide the bloodied clothes before they started the killings.

Yes Ron, I don't recall a scene where a female murderer took off all her clothing before committing the heinous act--so this was a first for me, which made this scene that much more shocking. Back then, much of the clothing was still handmade by seamstresses. While ready-to-wear clothing was already being mass produced in factories by the 1880s, it wasn't until 1902 when Marshall Field's began selling ready-to-wear "knockoff" dresses to the public. So it appears that Lizzie, least to say Bridgett, being the poor maid that she was, did not own many dresses--so this explains why they both got undressed in order not to get them soiled like you mentioned--they couldn't simply discard/destroy the dress and walk into a department store to purchase a new one.

The painstaking way and attention to detail which Lizzie and Bridget took to hide any incriminating evidence which could link them to the murders and to obstruct justice, in my mind shows that it well planned out and executed the murders to a tee--not on a whim as some theorize that Lizzie committed the murders in a fugue/dissociative/split-personality state.

So I guess fact is stranger than fiction in this case as this could very well be how the Borden murders were carried out. And the rich, illustrious, well-known and notorious aspects of the backstory this film was based upon gave it much more depth and believability than the average horror thriller flick.

reply

[–] CKid (3816) 5 years ago

I completely understood why Lizzie took off her clothes when she killed her step-mother.
Ditto when Bridget tried to kill Lizzie's dad.
But, and this is a big but, after Bridget failed, Lizzie killed her dad while wearing her clothes, thus splattering blood all over them.

So, where did those clothes disappear to? And why did the police fail to find them, if indeed they attempted to at all. The film never goes into that.

I also had a problem with the hatchet handle. After killing her father, we see Lizzie kill a bird and then saw off the handle and put it into the fire. That's all well and good, but a little earlier in the film during the trial, we hear the expert say that the blood found on the axe was that of a bird and not a human. Yet he makes no mention of the fact that the handle of the axe had been sawed off, thus he could not test that part of it.

I just think that finding a handle-less axe would have aroused even more suspicion, yet the filmmakers decided to completely overlook this.

That being said, I must add that like most of the reviews I read, I was very impressed with the performances of all the actors involved.

reply

[–] Ron2011 (907) 5 years ago

I'm assuming that Lizzie burned her bloodied clothes, as we also saw her put the axe handle into the fire. As for the handle, it is a bit curious why Lizzie cut off the handle but apparently to hide evidence. And that could have cast suspicion on Lizzie and/or Bridget but probably not enough given the bird blood and feathers found on the axe blade.

reply

[–] LLOwens (983) 5 years ago

So, where did those clothes disappear to? And why did the police fail to find them, if indeed they attempted to at all. The film never goes into that.

I also had a problem with the hatchet handle. After killing her father, we see Lizzie kill a bird and then saw off the handle and put it into the fire. That's all well and good, but a little earlier in the film during the trial, we hear the expert say that the blood found on the axe was that of a bird and not a human. Yet he makes no mention of the fact that the handle of the axe had been sawed off, thus he could not test that part of it.

I just think that finding a handle-less axe would have aroused even more suspicion, yet the filmmakers decided to completely overlook this.

I believe the reason why much of what you speak of was left out of this film was because till this day, the details remain vague and speculative, as the police who conducted the murder investigation dropped the ball. For example, during the trial the investigators admitted that they did not do a thorough search of the Borden residence because they claimed that Lizzie wasn't feeling well. So Lizzie's supposed bloodied dress could have still been in her room yet they failed to uncover every stone to find it.

Additionally, during the initial search, the police did find tools such as axes, one of which could have been the murder weapon. Yet none of these tools were removed from the house during this time. Only after a later search of the home did police decide to take the handleless hatchet to the police station as evidence. And other than finding the hatchet, the police came up empty handed.

So between the murder and the first search--or perhaps even between the first search and subsequent searches--Lizzie could have doctored or destroyed any evidence connecting her to her parents murders.

reply

[–] Ron2011 (907) 5 years ago

"The painstaking way and attention to detail which Lizzie and Bridget took to hide any incriminating evidence which could link them to the murders and to obstruct justice, in my mind shows that it well planned out and executed the murders to a tee--not on a whim as some theorize that Lizzie committed the murders in a fugue/dissociative/split-personality state. "

Right, and apparently Bridget's death bed confession years later attest to it all. Both had some reason to justify their action in their minds - Lizzie's father forcing sex onto Bridget, and the father being such a nasty person to Lizzie over the years - but of course murder is going too far. Given what Lizzie did was quite heinous, I do wonder if she was a sociopath but with Bridget there and as accomplice, that gave Lizzie the final push to do what was done.

reply

[–] LLOwens (983) 5 years ago

Right, and apparently Bridget's death bed confession years later attest to it all. Both had some reason to justify their action in their minds - Lizzie's father forcing sex onto Bridget, and the father being such a nasty person to Lizzie over the years - but of course murder is going too far. Given what Lizzie did was quite heinous, I do wonder if she was a sociopath but with Bridget there and as accomplice, that gave Lizzie the final push to do what was done.

All things considered after watching this film and reading up a bit on Lizzie Borden, I have a theory that the Borden residence could have been and continues to be haunted. Someone who made a comment on my Lizzie video edit insists that this is really the case. And this theory I've entertained has existed prior to me learning anything about Lizzie. For example, my sister's friend admits to being sexually molested as a child. She also mentioned that all kinds of paranormal activity occurred in the home which she was molested in. Interestingly, she appears to have dissociative identity disorder, like Lizzie might also have had. And yet she hasn't engaged in any violence and certainly not on the level of Lizzie--as violence does not necessarily perpetuate violence among its victims--so thus I previously mentioned that I highly doubt the only reason Lizzie planned and committed murders was because she might have been a fugue state.

I've always wondered why God, if he exists, allows men to engage in such despicable acts--as they often seem to get away with it. Or do they really, get away with it? Maybe God does remove any protection a man might have which then opens him up to being attacked by evil supernatural forces when they hurt innocent children. This might offer an explanation as to why Lizzie and Andrew went to the violent extremes that they did--they may have both been influenced by evil itself. I recall you telling me before that you are a God fearing individual who attends church every Sunday. If my memory serves me well, what are your thoughts on this topic?

reply

[–] Ron2011 (907) 5 years ago

Hi LL, I'm Christian but not an avid church goer, so you may have me mixed up with someone else. I don't know what to think about what happens in the afterlife but I think the belief generally is that people do pay for their sins in life.

I've always wondered about haunted places. There have been some good stories and some not believable about such things. In my neighborhood there was one of the oldest houses in the town, and maybe in the state. I knew one of the families who rented there for a time. They said the house seemed haunted, could talk about a few odd things that would happen. I don't recall those incidents now but the family seemed at least partially convinced. The house has been moved to another site in town and is being preserved as a historical location but I don't recall hearing other similar stories about it from other people.

reply

[–] LLOwens (983) 5 years ago

Hi LL, I'm Christian but not an avid church goer, so you may have me mixed up with someone else. I don't know what to think about what happens in the afterlife but I think the belief generally is that people do pay for their sins in life.

It was probably one of Kristen's other fans who posted comments on her former IMDb board. Anyhow, the reason why I asked is because I might touch on this point in the screenplay I'm currently working on but didn't want to come across as too preachy in order not to offend or be off-putting towards those who may not be Christian. But then again, many of those who are not Christian, believe in karma, destiny, kismet or fate. In my opinion, it wouldn't seem ethical and just if certain ones who are rich and powerful continue to get away with murder and all manner of evil while many poor and innocent individuals continue to suffer and be victims of circumstance. If God, or a higher power, doesn't intervene in mankind's affairs at some point, the long term future does not look so bright from my perspective.

reply