Accents


Is it me, or is the South African accent slightly similar to the Australian and NZ accents? Of course British influence is stronger in the last two.
Wondering why this is, as I don't know much about their cultural histories.

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Not being from an englishspeaking country, and not having seen a south african film for the last 4 years, I couldn't be sure. But as far as I remember, no. To me the NZ and Aussie accents are closer to the Irish and Cockney (London) accent, due to who was acctually sent to those countreis when they were being colonized.

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They blew up Congress!!! HAHAHA!

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Oh dear! Time to learn a little world history.

South Africa, Australia and New Zealand were the three main English colonies in the southern hemisphere, which explains the similarity in accents.

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Thanks for the replies, everyone, but I'm afraid that's not my point, I guess I wasn't clear.

I know that all these places were under British rule; what I find interesting is that Australians/NZ's have a similar accent to South Africans in particular.
Yes, Ozzies have a similar accent to the accent of South-East England, but there's a strong similarity with the South Africans. What I don't get is why Ozzies talk the way they do.
I understand that South Africans have Dutch influence in their accents, so I don't know why Australians have a slightly similar accent to them when they're originally British.

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So you're saying Aussies have a dutch accent?

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They blew up Congress!!! HAHAHA!

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No, but the Ozzy accent is like a combo of South-East-England English and Dutch-influenced South African. Ozzy doesn't sound Dutch in itself, but the intonation is ... well... oh I dunno, go on think I'm crazy, I just can't explain it further. Lool

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Well, as mentioned above, it's a long time since I heard South african accents, but as far as I remember, it didn't remind me of aussie.
I'm not gonna argue about it though.

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They blew up Congress!!! HAHAHA!

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OK, this is quite an obscure point. From my understanding the dutch went out to Australa, South Afria and New Zealand - this point is more easily demonstrated based on the typical appearance of any of the latter three, namely being blonde (that is the Dutch herritage).

True English herritage is red haired and the advent of dark haired/eyed English comes from the invasion of the Romans. This same influence is more dominant in Welsh and Irish (also). However, we are now starting to go back thousands of years and the point of accents becomes redundant - as it only takes several generations for an accent to morph into another one.

For example, in the times of Henry 8th we all spoke with country accents (the way people in Bristol do today). At the turn of the century cockneys in London spoke far more quantly than they do today and now I am watching kids under 18 beginning to talk in 'up speak' where they drag the end of their sentances up - which Americans tend to do, but sounds very irritating when you hear it done with an English accent!

I find that NZ and London accents blend the best together. I have had friends who have come over to London to live and lost their accent very quickly and vice versa friends (from London) who went to NZ and lost the London accent quickly.

Australian accents sit better with either American or Irish accents, as they follow the latters speech patterns closer. Also, Americans always think Cocknies are Australian!

South African accents are very different altogether and have an incredibly blunt speech pattern putting the emphasis on the end of the sentence (as Germans do). However, if a South African spends any time in London its true that the emphasis on the end of their sentences is lost and they start sounding more Kiwi.

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The main colonists of South Africa were British, just as they were in Australia and New Zealand.

South African English and New Zealand English are both more clipped than Australian English.

The influences on South African English are Dutch, which gives a slightly gutteral tone that doesn't occur in Australian speech (except among Dutch migrants). There is a tone and inflexion that comes from the indigennous speech.

The influence on New Zealand English is Scottish, as there was a higher percentage of Scottish immigrants to NZ than to OZ. New Zealand speech respects the consonants far more than OZ speech does. However, the most singular and defining characteristic of NZ English is the manner in which they modify vowel sounds. These are minimised so that many sounds are similar (to the ear of anyone not from New Zealand). It can be impossible to tell whether a Kiwi is talking about a pin, a pen, a pan, a pun or upon. They all come out as a pn. As for six, sex, sacks, socks and sucks.... it can be very confusing! This characteristic in New Zealand English appears to come directly from a similar characteristic in the language of the indigenous Maoris.

In Australia, the bulk of the earliest European settlers were working class people from Southern England and London. This includes convicts, and military personnel who made up a large number of the original settlers. Later shipments of convicts included many from Ireland. There were also Scottish convicts settlers, and in 1810 a Scottish regiment accompanied the new governor, Lachlan Macquarie.

There was a shortage of women, and many of the convicts who had served their term probably took aboriginal wives. There are characteristics of modern Australian speech that have similarities to indigenous speech. One characteristic is that Australians, proabably more than any other English-speaking people, smile while they are talking. If you want to imitate the long flattened vowel sounds of Australian speech, then put your front teeth together, grin as widely as you can and recite the Lord's Prayer (or anything else you know well) making sure that your lips don't touch.

These long flattened vowels, and a disrespect for consonants are the defining characteristics. HOWEVER, Queenslanders, while retaining the length of the vowel, do not define its sound as clearly as elsewhere in OZ, so that many vowels are reduced to "er" or the "uh" sound that occurs as the second vowel in "cabbage" or "apple".

Some years ago a book was published by the mysterious Professor Affabec Lauder called "Let Stalk Strine". For the uninitiated, "Strine" is the word "Australian" corrupted to the fullest possible extent. The book included gems like "Aorta" (through which flows the lifeblood of the community) as in "Aorta do sumpthin about them rye-wyes" and "Bin-bim-by" as in "Arm arm! Eye bin-bim-by a farn webs pider!"

The classic example that I collected was at the soup-market in Sinny. It went like this "Snow ewes both carrin thuh shoppy-gnome. Wecan gome inner car! Isle gome getter car!" to which her friend replied "Jeeez, yor real nize-ter me!"

The capital city is Kairm-bruh, and trains leave Sinny from Sennel Rye-Wye.

Do hope that this simplifies the issue!









"great minds think differently"

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Great post, Mandy.

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They blew up Congress!!! HAHAHA!

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Just in case anyone is having real trouble:

* Affabec Lauder = Alphabetical order
* Let Stalk Strine = Let's talk Australian
* Aorta = They ought to...
* "Arm Arm! Eye bin-bim-by a farn webs pider!" = "Ah, Mum! I've been bitten by a Funnel-web Spider!"
* Snow ewes both carrin thuh shoppy-gnome. Wecan gome inner car! Isle gome getter car!" = It's no use us both carrying the shopping home. We can go home in the car. I'll go home and get the car."
* Canberra has three syllables, but it is nearly always called Kairm-bruh.
* Sennel Rye-Wye is in Sinny = Central Railway is in Sydney.






"great minds think differently"

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LOL. Those are crazy! And elloquent Aussies don't sound like that. Maybe the country bumpkins but even that's a stretch....

To the OP: South Africans generally don't sound anything like Aussies! The dialect has certain similarities with NZ, but regardless they are all separate dialects, even if all of them spawned from certain English dialects long ago. I do, however, understand that people who aren't from Oz, NZ, SA might have a hard time distinguishing between them.

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aniviel_ithilmorn, I don't know where you're coming from, but most of that speech is typically Sydney. Definitely not the way "elloquent" Aussies speak, but.... listen to talk-back radio sometime!

And, honestly, have you ever heard a politician (well maybe Menzies) who pronounced Canberra as three syllables?

It's either Can-bruh, or Kairm-bruh, depending.








"great minds think differently"

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Ok really long time ago I wrote in this thread, but I grew up in Oz so I am very familiar with the accent.



"I think the 4th kind's a butt thing"

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Yes, good post in some respects but misleading! Australia is massive place (infact is just about 20% smaller than continental US) and like anywhere, including the UK and US, accents differ from state to state.

For instance, a western regional Queenslander speaks quite differently to an urban Queenslander and a Queenslander speaks quite differently to a Victorian.

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Oh, do you reeely want me to do a Henry Higgins?

I'm from the Sinny region but I cn communicate with reasonable fluency in the following dialects:

1. Nor Shaw
2. Woo-lar-ruh
3. Penruth
4. Smary's
5. Newtown Gay
6. Erko Dyke
7. Collins Street
8. Beaumauris
9. Worra-gairm-buh
10. Parramadda Orfer-nidge
11. Thuh Bay
12. Green Valley
13. Free-o
14. Moore Collidge
15. Everley Street
16. Lower Mow-ins
18. Upper Mountens
19. K-nown-druh
20. Point Piper
21. Brizben
22. Worrick Farm
23. Sinny University
24. Bathest
25. Larpa












"great minds think differently"

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The book included gems like "Aorta" (through which flows the lifeblood of the community) as in "Aorta do sumpthin about them rye-wyes" and "Bin-bim-by" as in "Arm arm! Eye bin-bim-by a farn webs pider!"

I'm an Aussie and I have NO idea what that means!

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Gawstrooth!

I orlreddy rote it out wunce for yer!

"Aorta....." = "They ought to...."

"Arm Arm......" = "Ah, Mum....."

"Eye bin bim by....." = "I've been bitten by......."

....work out what bit him for yourself....



"great minds think differently"

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Sounds a lot like Jeff Foxworthy's Redneck Dictionary.

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MandyJam

Priceless posts on the differing Ozzie accents!
I have worked with numerous Australians and it has always been fun trying to figure
out what they say...so whenever I see a Ozzie movie, it just amazes me how much my
ear picks up.

Reading out loud your numerous translations made me several times burst out laughing.
You obviously are well informed and a proud Ozzie.

Good on ya!

Keep up the good work and thanks so very much.
:>>

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And Americans sound like Dutch I suppose. I assume you're an American. No one else would think Australian accents sound like southern England accents

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Only to Americans.

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I think with the South African accent a lot depends on if their recent ancestors are Dutch (Boer) or British.

As others have posted the Boer speech seems to be more gutteral than a British based accent.

One thing I've noticed with the New Zealand accent is that they don't all say 'Fish and Chips' as 'Fush und Chups'. I never managed to work out if this was a North or South Island thing.

If you know what you are listening for it's easy to pick up a Kiwi from thier speach to distinguish them from Australians. I was born in the UK but grew up in Australia from the age of 5. I was working in the UK and was told that a person from Australia was starting the next week. When she turned up and started to speak to a work-colleauge it was obvious to me that she was a Kiwi.

One thing to point out with accents is where the person learnt English. When I came back to the UK I did a trip around Europe (1989). I'd been asked by someone to deliver a silver coin to an Italian family based in Pisa. When I spoke to them on the telephone I swear I was speaking to an American. It turns out that they run a garage abd there was a US Air Force Base nearby and they did a lot of repair work on the Air Force personnel's private cars.

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South Arfican accents sound far more British than Australian or kiwi accents

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