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Is there anywhere in Europe that is superior to the US?


Just got done touring Europe. Culturally and historically it was beautiful and fascinating. But as far as quality of life? I did not visit any cities that didn’t seem dirty or disorganized in some way. All cities are dirty in certain areas but Europe being so much older has many places that are beyond repair and get treated/upkept poorly as a result.

I also did not get the impression that the locals were very worldly or interested in anything outside of their cultural bubble. Whereas most educated Americans want to travel and explore other cultures.

Lastly, every last city I visited (10 total in 6 different countries) had inferior technology and resources in almost every way. Of course there are exceptions but it was clear that access to many basic things that are standard in America (free public restrooms, well maintained roads and sidewalks) and the things they did have were inferior (water power in showers sinks and toilets was very weak.)

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Berlin?

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I have never been to the US so i can't tell how much truth there is to it or how wrong it is, i don't know what the purpose of the thread would be though except to boast the ego, even if US really is ahead that much then what does it matter in the end?

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That makes sense, some parts are full of terrible people and others have nice people, an entire nation is never just good or bad, you have to expect to be threated both ways.

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Yeah, i have a little problem grasping how huge it is, going between states is like going across my whole country. Crazy to think about.

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I don’t have wild blind pride at all, in fact I think America is pretty sh!tty in a lot of ways too. I’m just talking about the areas I specified.

This is not an ethnocentric statement in any way, it’s a commentary on my experience in Europe which was great but flawed.

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I LOVE Berlin, but no. It's only recently that they've been upgrading a lot of areas.

Switzerland seems more superior than anywhere else in Europe when it comes to the aspects mentioned by the OP.

Hey, you're Swedish, right? I'm planning to visit Stockholm later this year. Got any tips?

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The Abba museum
Snösätra Graffiti Wall
Mall of Scandinavia
Drottningholms slott
Gröna Lund

I'm not that familiar with Stockholm honestly but i think you might enjoy those. You could also take a trip through the archipelago which is extremely nice in the summer. You don't need to worry about language barrier since almost all swedes are very fluent in english and are usually very helpful to tourists. I promise you're gonna have a nice time and feel very welcome :-)

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No, not the ABBA museum.😑

But I'll definitely check out the rest of your list!

I've already been to Norway and Denmark, which was nice.

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Well, everyone can't like Abba i guess, or maybe you just don't like museums in general :-D

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Oh, I like museums, but ABBA doesn't deserve one.

Waterloo and Dancing Queen are okay, but all of their songs are basically the same song over and over again!

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I've never been to it myself so i don't know what they got in there, most of it is probably old clothes and instruments.

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Yikes, those costumes! Apparently they made them hideous on purpose to get a tax deduction.

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Maybe they didn't think it mattered that much because unless you saw them live you would basically just hear the music, they didn't count on MTV and internet coming around which allowed everyone to see them instead of a selected few, i'm sure they regret most of their wardrobe decisions today XD

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They hurt a lot of eyes beyond repair. They should be sued!

Now if I go there, it's not like they play ABBA everywhere. Right???😱

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Nah, don't worry, but you might hear a lot of Avicii and songs from Eurovision though.

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Eurovison 🤢🤢🤢

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lol, we are crazy about that here, they always play the most popular ones during the summer XD

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Eurovision before 2000 was very entertaining, Mitch.

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So I'm going to hear Duncan as well? I've been trying to avoid him over here.😑

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Count on it :-)

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Good god. I'm going to get myself some ear plugs.😞

Oh yeah, some snack or other delicacy I should try??? (NOT that stinky fermented fish, please!)

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I don't think even we like that fish, it just happens to be a tradition to eat at midsummer for some reason and no one questions it. You could always try smörgåstårta if you want something extremely swedish, it is really meant for many people to share since it's basically a form of cake but can be ordered in smaller portions as well on many bakeries. We also have what we call lösgodis in pretty much all grocery stores which is various candy you can choose from. You might also like to try a semla which is a sort of bun with cream and almond paste inside and sugar on top. Sometimes it can also have vanilla.

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Thank you. Those look good! I really need to go!😁

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We're waiting for your arrival :-D

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Oh, it's going to be something, I promise you!😘

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I like the sound of that :-)

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Bosnia.

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Are you dissing the country of my father???

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He does??? I need to see that!

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i've never traveled & i wouldn't want to speak to specific things like the state of neighborhoods or culture or any such thing.

but there are some facts that might surprise some people.

most european countries, if they were to join the united states, would be rated among the poorest states judging by their median income. germany, sweden & denmark, among the most prosperous euro countries, would be in the 39-41 range, for example. switzerland, norway and luxembourg would be the only euro zone countries that would break into the mid-high range of u.s. states.

http://www.aei.org/publication/us-gdp-per-capita-by-state-vs-european-countries-and-japan-korea-mexico-and-china-and-some-lessons-for-the-donald/

https://mises.org/wire/these-us-states-have-higher-incomes-nearly-every-european-country


also, while sweden is a very prosperous country and their people live among the best lives in the world, it's also the case that swedes who leave sweden and go to the u.s. are better off than those that remain in sweden.

The 4.4 million or so Americans with Swedish origins are considerably richer than average Americans, as are other immigrant groups from Scandinavia. If Americans with Swedish ancestry were to form their own country, their per capita GDP would be $56,900, more than $10,000 above the income of the average American. This is also far above Swedish GDP per capita, at $36,600. Swedes living in the USA are thus approximately 53 per cent more wealthy than Swedes (excluding immigrants) in their native country (OECD, 2009; US Census database).


https://www.cato.org/blog/swedens-big-welfare-state-superior-americas-medium-welfare-state-then-why-do-swedes-america

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and i don't mean any of that as a plea to the superiority of the u.s.
certainly i am not a person who believes money means everything. it's not important to me at all, in fact.
i can certainly believe that a country may be poorer but also may be better off in some ways, more stable, less extreme poverty, more cohesive. i don't know that's the case with any or all of the euro states that are often held up as models for other countries to follow, but i'm willing to believe it's possible.

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I can't believe you're generalizing like that after doing a tour through Europe.😐

"I also did not get the impression that the locals were very worldly or interested in anything outside of their cultural bubble. Whereas most educated Americans want to travel and explore other cultures."

Are you supposed to be an example of one of those "educated" Americans??? Did you ever consider the language barrier??? In my experience, Europeans are generally very interested in and open to other cultures, especially in bigger cities. Europeans do travel more than Americans.

Tourists visiting countries like The Netherlands (my own country), the Scandinavian countries and Switzerland always compliment them on how neat and well-organized they are (yes, even American tourists). Especially public transport seems to be considered superior to that of a lot of other countries.

I think you're looking at the US through rose-colored glasses. I have only visited Disney World in the US, but seeing images of a city like New York, some areas don't seem very developed either. You've got shitholes everywhere. Also take into consideration that some of these cities are centuries old, maintaining them can be difficult and expensive.
 
"(water power in showers sinks and toilets was very weak.)"

Maybe book a better hotel next time...

I'm glad you love your own country. I also prefer my own country to others. But to shit on a whole continent like you did...

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I try not to judge the OP, I can understand feeling that certain aspects of a country are superior to that of another. But his remark about European locals vs. educated Americans was just...weird.😐

Don't worry, I'm not going to judge other Americans based on what this OP says. My stay in Disney World was extremely pleasant and my experience with American tourists hasn't really been negative either.

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You misread it, I am comparing educated Americans to uneducated Americans, not saying Americans as a whole are more educated than Europeans.

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I don't think I did. You were comparing (European) locals to "educated" Americans.

"not saying Americans as a whole are more educated than Europeans."

I didn't imply you said that either.

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So then what was weird about my statement?

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One, it's a total generalization. You haven't met "most educated" Americans or all European locals. When you do a quick organized tour, you certainly don't get to experience daily life.

But it's not fair to compare "educated" Americans to just "locals". Are these locals educated or not? You do seem to make a distinction between educated and uneducated Americans.

Also, I mentioned the language barrier. If you don't speak English very well or are not confident enough about it, it might seem like you have no interest in conversing with foreigners.

So yeah, your assessment was weird and unfair.

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Americans don't tend to travel outside of their own country. Only 36% have passports.

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On the one hand I do get it. In Europe it's much easier to travel to another country with the open borders and shorter distances. Most Europeans are also obligated to have a passport or an ID card. And maybe travelling abroad is more expensive for Americans? You know the statistics for Canada?

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60% of Canadians have passports which sounds low to me. Everyone I know has gone South or been to Europe.

https://www.pastemagazine.com/articles/2016/04/off-the-grid-why-americans-travel-domestic-instead-1.html

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Canada's north is beautiful but largely inaccessible to tourists. Check out the Torngat montains

ttps://www.google.com/search?q=torngat+mountains+national+park&rlz=1C1GCEA_enCA810CA810&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwjB382JoO7iAhUhvFkKHYdgBGYQ_AUIECgB&biw=1242&bih=568

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it is tough to live up there. not offended Moose.

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Toronto is one of the southern most cities in Canada, so I call that Raptor's south. :)

The true north isn't awful, in fact it's beautiful. I live in Canada's most northern major city, and we're still pretty far south, but I think it's beautiful around here too.

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Hmm, yes. Over here it's almost 95%.

Yes, it does seem more expensive for Americans. The US is indeed very diverse, but going abroad is just a totally different experience.

I wonder if the average American just doesn't feel a bit uncomfortable dealing with a culture and language they're just not familiar with. Over here we interact a lot more with our fellow Europeans, of course. I mean, I'd love to go to Japan, but I'm afraid of feeling totally helpless over there!😆

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The OP didn't mention Europe's transit system which is much better than the US or Canada.

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Yes, I mentioned that myself. I have no experience with public transport in the US, but it's a thing I've heard a lot, even about countries that aren't as well organized as Switzerland, for example.

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Go to Japan - it'll blow your mind! My wife & I went there for 5 weeks about 10 years ago and it was just awesome (and weird in a good way). Everyone is really positive, upbeat & really willing to help you. Language is no barrier, even more so nowadays with all the Apps available.

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I've got some acquaintances who are visiting Japan right now. I'm curious to find out how things went. I really need to go someday!

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Definitely do it! I’ll be happy to share our experiences when you’re ready to go.

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That may take some time. I need to save up some money first!😁

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The most expensive bit is getting there. Japan is cheaper than you’d imagine.

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Okay, that's good to know. Because I can't go to Japan and NOT eat all the food they've got.😋

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Food & Saki is cheap if you know where to go.

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i believe the u.s. requires canadian visitors to have a valid passport now, no? that wasn't the case in the past, but i believe that was brought in about errr... 12 years ago, maybe? does that sound right? i don't travel myself (i don't want to leave my apartment) but i remember this being discussed at the time the policy chnaged.

i'd expect most canadians hold passports so they can travel to the u.s., even if only for day trips. certainly many people in my region make day trips to the u.s. to shop. even with the exchange rate at $0.75usd, lots of items are cheaper there i believe.

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I think it was June 1, 2009 that passports was required to get into the USA. With that said Canadians travel more internationally than Americans.

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The Americans I knew and know tend to have traveled to Canada and Mexico, or around the US. But I have known a fair few who have traveled to various points in Europe, to Russia, and even to Australia. One American friend regularly visits a different European country every few years.

What you have to understand, however, is that the US is so far away from everywhere else that's it's expensive to travel to destinations outside of the US. It can't be undertaken lightly or cheaply or regularly by most regular people. It's pricey enough even to make domestic trips far afield in a country that is basically 3,000 miles wide.

So personally I cut Americans some slack if they don't have a passport and have never gone outside of America. It's a big place and it's big financial commitment to have a family holiday in France if you live in California.

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I agree America is a large and diverse country with much to see.

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I have dual UK/US nationality and have lived on both sides of the pond. I am aghast at this post that reads like a poorly written review from Trip Advisor.

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Yep.

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I do. I lived with my uncle in Florida for a time (he married a nice American lady) making his two daughters (my cousins) 'average joe Americans'.

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I would definitely consider myself more a Brit than American, but it does give me a unique perspective on the two countries. As for people passing judgement because of where you come from? I've learnt there's two kinds of people in life; those I like & those I don't like. People's nationality, race, religion, sexuality, politics aren't a concern for me.

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This site is dominated by Americans (or Canadians perhaps???), so I don't think coming out is problematic.

Now admitting you're Russian, on the other hand...🤔

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I actually am from the part called Holland, but secretly we do hate it when you all don't refer to us by our proper name!😜

Ah, but Google offers translation into Dutch, which I prefer MUCH, MUCH more over German.😁

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Ah, ok. Me too!:

"gunter glieben glauten globen"😜

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No, it's the very German band Def Leppard!

EDIT: Google is your friend!😆

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I also know it from that song originally. I like it, it was very popular at the time. Overplayed, though!

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That's why I never participate in those games. I can't do it without Google!😆

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You're talking about the internationally famous, all-male German close harmony ensemble that performed between 1928 and 1934 as one of the most successful musical groups in Europe before World War II? Never heard of them.😆

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Hey Andy, same here, I have lived on both sides of the pond -- I do think that gives you and me a unique perspective on two locations.

I disagree with you about the OP's post though -- while obviously it's very generalized and therefore flawed, I have to agree with him on some points. There are some universal things I can think of that, at least speaking for my one home country (not all of Europe...) are done stupid-badly in the UK, and much better in the US. I did have a better quality of life there in terms of some standards that are just better there. I rue the day I was stupid enough to come back to the UK.

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Are you asking this in response to Americans moving to Europe and crowing about how much better it is over there? I've met a few who talk like that, but frankly, it's all a matter of perspective, and a question of what you're willing to live with in your new host country, and what you're willing to give up that you had back home. I would also advise you to stay away from cities in general. You think they're bad here in the US, they're not much better abroad. You would be better off living in some town outside the cities.

I have heard good things about the Netherlands and Germany as good candidates for Americans to live, but still, even that you will have to take with a grain of salt. Scandinavia might also be a good choice. All three have the natives educated in speaking English, so it would be easier to navigate until you can learn their language.

I wouldn't want to live in Europe right now anyway, not with the migrant crisis going on. Visit, maybe, but not to live.

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We have our own migrant crisis and it's no longer limited to Mexicans and Central Americans:

https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/news/african-migrants-pass-through-san-antonio-and-swiftly-fan-out-across-the-country

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Netherlands
Switzerland
Germany
England
Belgium
many other places (and yes, I've lived there briefly, but if you're born in the US, you're kinda stuck there)

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Most here are attacking the OP, but I'll be honest here - I'm a Brit who lived in the US, and I had a better quality of life there with a higher standard to my housing and everything else, than I have in London, which is supposed to be a world-class city with the best of everything. It's not, and it doesn't, unless you're rich.

I have shitty circumstances here, not least because it's too expensive to have nicer. I had a better life in my mid-size city. Believe it or not, even the shopping was better. Roads were better, even the cheap housing was better designed and nicer in standard than the shit holes of London.

I'm not kidding, my life's sense of comfort and pleasant surroundings and nice housing and better conveniences and amenities took a HUGE step backward when I returned to England. You know even our libraries charge you rental fees for movies when US libraries loan them out for free like the books. That's just a tiny thing but it's an example of how things are here. I don't want to sound like I'm a sock of the OP, because you can believe me, I'm not, but I have to back him up and say yes, general standards here are inferior to what I had in the US for cheaper.

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You exaggerate, no one is "attacking" the OP. The reasons you mention for your quality of life supposedly being better in the US are not the same as those of the OP.

Also, London is not the same as the rest of Europe or even the UK.

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Okay, fair comment on both points; "attacking" was too strong a word, I meant more that many are raising an eyebrow at what he said, one way or another. Which is to be expected because he did make some mildly controversial claims. My own post was only to say he has a point about some of it, and I, like one of the other posters above, have a perspective that comes from living long-term in both the US and in one "European" city.

Which brings me to your other fair point, you're right, I'm only speaking of one city in one country, and can't speak for the rest of Europe or even the UK.

Although I do think most of the UK has just as poorly designed flats and houses that aren't as nice as the ones I've seen in the US, and I've seen plenty, as the ones I've seen and lived in in London, because some things about life in the UK are pretty universal, not just London issues. There ARE London issues that are peculiar to London, that I'm experiencing -- not denying that. But I also think about fairly universal things that are part of any life in the UK. So I stand behind that part. There is a lot about life in the UK in general - and I'm talking about daily things that are universal -- that I do absolutely find to be inferior to the pretty much universal standards in the US city I lived in. There's TONS of stuff the Brits could learn from the American way of doing things, which SOME of it is indeed superior. Sorry but I'm in a good position to have that as my opinion.

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