Okay Folks....You Can Choose To Believe Or Not. - General Discussion Discussion

[–] db20db (16204) 5 years ago

We all know that dreams are mysterious and I believe they can be precognitive. I once had one of a former coworker I hadn't thought of for a long time. We were walking side by side, like we used to on the job when he suddenly veered to the left and disappeared into a deep blackness. It was one of those that lingers after waking and I wondered why I would suddenly be dreaming about him. A couple of days later, I discovered his obituary in the newspaper. His death was unexpected and premature. I can't deny it spooked me. I've had others just as strange.

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[–] kspkap (13025) 5 years ago

These types of dreams are definitely unsettling. Another type which scare the bejeebers out of me are termed “Lucid Dreams”. These are dreams in which you know you are dreaming...and they may be frightening dreams, but you are almost catatonic. You are unable to move, you are screaming for help (actually they are silent screams), but you can’t understand why no one hears you. You keep telling yourself “Please wake up! Please wake up!” I actually pray to God to wake me as I’m so frightened! Eventually through absolute will power....I awaken, but fear going back to sleep.

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[–] db20db (16204) 5 years ago

I've also experienced lucid dreams frequently and they've never scared me but had just the opposite effect. I've always found the awareness that I was dreaming to be a liberating experience.

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[–] kspkap (13025) 5 years ago

You’ve never experienced a frightening lucid dream? If not, you are fortunate. They leave a lasting effect on me for the day.

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[–] db20db (16204) 5 years ago

No, I haven't but they've also had a lasting effect for me the following day but in having a sense of well being, confidence and control.

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[–] olioz (3307) 5 years ago

That is actually 'sleep paralysis' when you can't move and know you are dreaming. That is terrifying, you can feel and usually see the presence of something evil. I used to have 'sleep paralysis' often but I learned to control it, so that now if I feel it coming I can slip into a 'lucid dream'.

Lucid dreams are an awesome experience, you know you are dreaming but you can control your dream. I can fly and move through walls and sealings and do other crazy stuff. I once rode on a armchair inside a hurricane, it sounds crazy I know, but you can learn to control your dreams and do a lot of fun stuff.

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[–] kspkap (13025) 5 years ago

Interesting. I wish I could control the lucid dream, but there have been a few times I have realized I was going into one. In so doing I fight with all my might to stop the process. If I succeed and am fully awakened my heart is racing along with a feeling of dread! My lucid dreams terrify me.

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[–] db20db (16204) 5 years ago

Kap, I'm inclined to agree with olioz that what you're experiencing is not a lucid dream. The way he described one is exactly what I always experienced and why I see it as liberating. It has a sense of freedom and control that is very pleasurable. There are people out there that would love to experience one. This was in my browser's trending just the other day: https://www.wikihow.com/Lucid-Dream

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[–] kspkap (13025) 5 years ago

“A lucid dream is a dream during which the dreamer is aware that they are dreaming. During a lucid dream, the dreamer may gain some amount of control over the dream characters, narrative, and environment; however, this is not actually necessary for a dream to be described as lucid.”

Apparently what I experience are lucid nightmares, which are still lucid dreams.

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[–] db20db (16204) 5 years ago

Fine, if you want to interpret it that way but the very fact that you emphasize a lack of control tells me that's not what it is. I've never encountered anyone before that had a lucid dream that was anything but pleasurable.

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[–] kspkap (13025) 5 years ago

db,
“Fine, if you want to interpret it that way but the very fact that you emphasize a lack of control tells me that's not what it is.”

It’s not what I interpret. Please read my reply where it states being in control is “not actually necessary for a dream to be described as lucid.”

FYI, https://www.world-of-lucid-dreaming.com/lucid-nightmares.html

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[–] db20db (16204) 5 years ago

Ok, kap. This looks very interesting, I stand corrected and I'll have to investigate it further. Just scanning it made me feel grateful I never experienced it.

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[–] twinA (4826) 5 years ago

I've read that people who play videogames or are artistic (like olioz's work) tend to experience the dreams in which they can control. This suggests that outside influences can help us interact with our inner consciousness.

It's also known that smells can effect our dreams too. The fresh scent of brewed coffee might conjure up an image of it in our minds. It's fascinating, ksp.

~~/o/

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[–] GlenEllyn (21078) 5 years ago

I've had at least one episode of sleep paralysis. The devil was perched above me on my headboard, leaning over me like a vulture, evil look on his face with an evil snarl, "I've got you now!"

Like you said, I knew it was a dream but I couldn't move. Freaky, really freaky.

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[–] kspkap (13025) 5 years ago

And what naughty thing or things did you do that day? 😉 Seriously, the sleep paralysis is very frightening. I do everything in my power to awaken. “Wake up! Wake up!” I’m screaming. Why doesn’t my husband hear me. I’m jabbing him to help me wake. Of course none of this is really occurring. Time for the Twilight Zone theme again!☺️

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[–] GlenEllyn (21078) 5 years ago

Oh, gee. I don't remember. I didn't know I was supposed to remember the naughty stuff.😧

Thank goodness it's only happened once. It was scary.

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[–] MovieManCin2 (26342) 5 years ago

"There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, than are dreamt of in your philosophy."

Hamlet by William Shakespeare

😐

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[–] kspkap (13025) 5 years ago

Ah...so..🤔

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[–] [deleted] 5 years ago

Who is that Shakespeare guy? He sure can turn a phrase.

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[–] [deleted] 5 years ago

You are psychic.

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[–] [deleted] 5 years ago

I had a dream once about some girls who were locked in a basement and were rescued by the police. The next morning I heard on the news about some girls who were locked away in a basement and then rescued by police. That was crazy.

It's almost like The Shining.

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[–] [deleted] 5 years ago

Dreams aren't fully understood, it's possible while we dream we are more sensitive and open to pick up on signals and hints from different time periods which are normally blocked from our minds.

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[–] kspkap (13025) 5 years ago

Sometimes people who dream about an event and later see on the news what they dreamed may believe it’s a premonition. In reality the tv may have been on reporting the event. While asleep outside noises, such as a tv, alarm going off, etc. will filter into our subconscious which then incorporates into a dream. An alarm going off could bring on a dream about school bells. Guns being fired (movie or tv program) could be a causal effect to dream about balloons popping.

This was not the case for me (tv turned off) and may not be for you also. As a rule objects in a dream are symbolic of objects in our wakened state. I once had a horrific dream about an event so real, which made me think when I woke, it had actually occurred.

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[–] kspkap (13025) 5 years ago

IDK...🤷‍♀️ I’ve never considered myself as being psychic.

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[–] [deleted] 5 years ago

You should then :-)

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[–] GlenEllyn (21078) 5 years ago

Better than being psycho. 😉

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[–] Catbookss (13664) 5 years ago

I'm sorry to hear there was yet another school shooting 😔

Your dream is interesting, Ksp. I'm inclined to ascribe this kind of thing to what Gedmend suggested, that while we're asleep we're more open to picking up things our minds normally filter out when we're conscious. There's still so much we don't yet know.

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[–] kspkap (13025) 5 years ago

But, it hadn’t occurred yet. So how would I be more receptive to an unknown? As I wrote earlier in this thread if the tv is tuned to a news channel while someone is in a deep sleep, REM is in full force, the words from the tv can become part of a dream.

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[–] Catbookss (13664) 5 years ago

According to Einstein, and others, time is an illusion. "Time is relative, and flexible. According to Albert Einstein, "the dividing line between past, present, and future is an illusion""

As difficult as it is for us to grasp that, I think he was correct. So that would be how. As I said, there's so much we don't yet understand.

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[–] twinA (4826) 5 years ago

Interesting stuff, Cat.
This is kind of related:

After "100 Authors Against Einstein" was shown to Albert Einstein, he is credited with saying "If I was wrong, one would be enough."

~~/o/

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[–] db20db (16204) 5 years ago

Einstein had a number of great quotes. My favorite is, "Reality is an illusion, albeit a very persistent one."

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[–] twinA (4826) 5 years ago

Since you have a running theme going in this thread, here's a few other things Einstein said on the nature between science and religion:

"A knowledge of the existence of something we cannot penetrate, of the manifestations of the profoundest reason and the most radiant beauty - it is this knowledge and this emotion that constitute the truly religious attitude; in this sense, and in this alone, I am a deeply religious man."

"I do not believe in a personal God and I have never denied this but have expressed it clearly. If something is in me which can be called religious then it is the unbounded admiration for the structure of the world so far as our science can reveal it."

"I believe in Spinoza's God who reveals himself in the orderly harmony of what exists, not in a God who concerns himself with the fates and actions of human beings."

~~/o/

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[–] db20db (16204) 5 years ago

Yes, I think the video I just shared with Catbookss is a perfect illustration of most of that quote.

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[–] Catbookss (13664) 5 years ago

😄 Twin, I had no idea Einstein was such a wit! That's a quip worthy of Oscar Wilde.

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[–] twinA (4826) 5 years ago

Not bad for a nerdy man who wanted nothing more than play a violin in his favorite fake bunny slippers on his best days! 🐰🐰

Speaking of Oscar Wilde: (^_~)

"America is the only country that went from barbarism to decadence without civilization in between."

~~/o/

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[–] Catbookss (13664) 5 years ago

😄

He was not only a brilliant man, but a wise one too. We're not in shortage of brain-smart people, but we are in short supply of brain-smart people who are also wise.

Oh, that Oscar guy. He was a real smart arse, he was. Funny, but always with that sharp edge.

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[–] kspkap (13025) 5 years ago

Wow! 😳That is deep thinking, but I understand his reasoning. Maybe because I’m such a sci-fi nut! We can actually slip between times without being aware. In deep sleep with REM we are more susceptible to be able to slip between times. Thanks for the info. Now I feel like playing The Twilight Zone theme again....

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[–] Catbookss (13664) 5 years ago

Right, past/present/and future are supposedly happening at the same "time." Yet, to us, it sure as heck appears that time only travels in one direction. If during REM and at under certain (unknown) other circumstances somehow we're able to step out of this one-directional stream of time, we may be able to access past and future.

I wonder if the phenomena of deja vu is related to this, or, as it's thought currently by mainstream science, if it's just a glitch of our brains.

Same kind of thing relates to space and the material world. We know all physical things are composed of atoms, with *lots* of space between the atoms. Yet if I try to walk through a wall, Imma have a lot of trouble doing it 😀

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[–] db20db (16204) 5 years ago

It's not that difficult for me to grasp because it seems to align perfectly with something I read once which was, in a nutshell, " With God, everything is one eternal now."

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[–] kspkap (13025) 5 years ago

Hmm? Interesting to say the least. Past, Present & Future...one eternal now...
It fits into what Cat wrote quoting Einstein.

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[–] db20db (16204) 5 years ago

Yes. I don't think reconciling science and religion is so difficult at all.

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[–] Catbookss (13664) 5 years ago

I don't think it is either. Not with the basis or core of religions anyway.

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[–] db20db (16204) 5 years ago

How do you suppose ancient peoples would have interpreted something like this?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8GHZOvhxS1E

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[–] Catbookss (13664) 5 years ago

Dunno. It's beautiful.

But it does make sense to me that ancient peoples concluded there were dragons, based on finding larger dinosaur bones.

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[–] db20db (16204) 5 years ago

If there's a group of people that has a strong sense of oneness with all of life and creation, it's Native Americans. The Lakota name for God is Wakan Tanka which is usually interpreted as meaning, Great Spirit or The Great Mystery. I've also seen its meaning as The Power Behind the Sun.

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[–] Catbookss (13664) 5 years ago

Yes, as do Buddhists.

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[–] twinA (4826) 5 years ago

It's easy to overlook that modern science as we know it was heavily supported by Hebraic-Christian ideas that flourished during the 1600s, which aimed to undue age-old superstitions about nature and God. Instead of nature being treated as part of God, it would be seen as part of God's creation. The "creation" part is not to be mistaken for antievolutionist rhetoric.

These founders of modern science, whom all believed their works and championing causes as being under the service of God included: Francis Bacon, Isaac Newton, Blaise Pascal, and even Galileo despite his questioning of the church's stance on the position between Earth and the Sun.

Reference:

Myers, David & Jeeves, Malcolm. (1987). Psychology Through the Eyes of Faith. HarperCollinsPublishers: San Francisco, CA

~~/o/

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[–] Catbookss (13664) 5 years ago

The Big Bang could certainly be seen as a creation. If not a creation, what the heck else could it be called?

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[–] twinA (4826) 5 years ago

Curiously, Georges Henri Joseph Édouard; Roman Catholic priest, mathematician, astronomer, and professor of physics, came up with the Big Bang Theory.

All I can think of is "The Great Particle Expansion."

~~/o/

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[–] Catbookss (13664) 5 years ago

Ah, interesting.

I like The Great Particle Expansion, LOL! 👍

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[–] Catbookss (13664) 5 years ago

I agree with that. Also that we are all one. Everyone and everything. Even though it doesn't *seem* that way.

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[–] ProductionNow (1072) 5 years ago

Yea, that's the problem: too many people filtering out when they are conscious.

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[–] Prelude (1443) 5 years ago

I've had dreams like that, several times over my lifetime. It can be very unsettling when it's about something unhappy. I've had ones about trivial things that happened, ones about happy events, but yeah those ones about horrible stuff are horrible when they come true.

I'm glad I don't get them that often, and glad I've started not to remember my dreams anyway, these days.

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[–] GlenEllyn (21078) 5 years ago

Cue the Twilight Zone theme music.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XVSRm80WzZk

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[–] kspkap (13025) 5 years ago

Gee thanks! It will be swirling in my head for the next few days!🥴 I finally get one tune out of my noggin and you introduce another one!🤦‍♀️

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[–] GlenEllyn (21078) 5 years ago

Sorry KissKap. 😔

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[–] kspkap (13025) 5 years ago

Sure you are! 😉😉 The other day I was checking out Lee Marvin movies when I came across “Paint Your Wagon” Play the following which has been driving me crazy. I even started singing it to my 5 lb she-devil yorkie. The prelude is long, but stick with it. Damn! Now it’s back in my head! 🤯

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=El9eCRisbDo

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[–] GlenEllyn (21078) 5 years ago

I knew it would be this. Dang you! Now it's back in mine. Lee Marvin is no singer, but he did just fine with this.

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[–] ShogunofYonkers (71636) 5 years ago

Interesting topic K...I have some interest in dreams but have never believed they portend the future, I consider them to be associated with the topics we are immersed in combined with our creative minds as we sleep

Case in point, I read a lot of true crime stuff, every once in a while I have a terrible dream and within the next few days some lunatic gets arrested for doing God knows what

Just doing lazy boy math but figure we dream several hundred times a year, a plane crash, mass shooting or serial killer case is bound to happen once or twice in a year

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[–] kspkap (13025) 5 years ago

I agree with your points. There have been many times I’ve dreamed about an event, but realize the news I heard, something I read, had a bearing on the dream. Most of our dreams consist of symbolic items which we can’t understand....gibberish actions, etc. But, this dream was very detailed, not full of symbols. I had not been talking about or hearing about school shootings prior to sleep. I was there, saw the grief with the flowers being placed. I had the feeling of dread all day.

These dreams have occurred rarely (that I’m aware of) in my life. The one about the plane crash upset me greatly as it was detailed. When I woke that same feeling of dread weighed on me. I told my husband there was going to be a plane crash that very day...and there was.

BTW, for those who aren’t aware, everyone has dreams every night. They may not remember them, but they did dream. If deprived of dreams it can have a negative effect on us.

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[–] ShogunofYonkers (71636) 5 years ago

All good points K
The dreams seem necessary I suppose but I sort of resent them...I'd just like 6 or 7 hours a day of total silence...it's just a constant barrage of BS at all times, isn't it!?!

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[–] db20db (16204) 5 years ago

If deprived of dreams it can have a negative effect on us.

I once saw an explanation of dreams as the circuit breaker system of our brains. If we didn't have them, our minds would overload and we'd go insane.

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[–] kspkap (13025) 5 years ago

You are correct. I’ve often wondered what I dreamed after imbibing quite a few of my red Solo cups 🥤🥤🥤🥤🥤full of the good stuff! Maybe my brain was so pickled I couldn’t dream; which resulted in what I am today. My husband through the years when angry with me would use the refrain...”You are insane!” I’ve always told him the inmates are running the asylum!🤪🤪

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[–] captainbucky (15252) 5 years ago

Go to hell. I’m blocking you

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[–] ShogunofYonkers (71636) 5 years ago

Oh stop Cap, it is an interesting topic to ponder though we don't believe in it all you and I
You block posters like I do, Not At All:)

Pretty interesting thread, no?

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[–] captainbucky (15252) 5 years ago

I’ve never blocked anyone before

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[–] captainbucky (15252) 5 years ago

But I’m going to

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[–] ShogunofYonkers (71636) 5 years ago

No you wont
You are just being silly!

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[–] captainbucky (15252) 5 years ago

I will

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[–] ShogunofYonkers (71636) 5 years ago

Sshhh...you are drunk and that's OK
Just shush, you are destroying a lot of good will and love Amigo

Go To Bed;)

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[–] kspkap (13025) 5 years ago

Who are you blocking? I can’t follow this blasted format! Grr!🤬 Even after all this time. That’s why I usually address the person to whom I’m replying. (like I didn’t do this time) Oh well, just consider the source.😬

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[–] captainbucky (15252) 5 years ago

You’re the source ass hole

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[–] kspkap (13025) 5 years ago

Huh? What did I do? And why are you calling me an a** hole?

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[–] captainbucky (15252) 5 years ago

Ass

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[–] kspkap (13025) 5 years ago

You didn’t answer my question. What did I do to warrant such vitriol from you?

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[–] captainbucky (15252) 5 years ago

I’m not even going to reply

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[–] Catbookss (13664) 5 years ago

Have you been drinking or somethin', Captain? I can't figure out why you're so upset with Ksp 😳

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[–] captainbucky (15252) 5 years ago

I work at a school. There’s a dream about a school shooting

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[–] kspkap (13025) 5 years ago

OK...please do some splainin. My husband retired from a school system in Florida.

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[–] captainbucky (15252) 5 years ago

Thanks for asking friend

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[–] kspkap (13025) 5 years ago

I’m shocked! Shocked I tell you! Just shocked! The question of the night folks...throwing it out there....what did I say that pissed off CapBucky?🤷‍♀️

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[–] ShogunofYonkers (71636) 5 years ago

K was sharing an experience she had, it was interesting even if we don't all trust in dreams

Why call K an asshole?
That was harsh cap, you came off like an asshole in this exchange in this instance and I'm sorry to say that but c'mon man, it's her OP
What the hell Cap!?!
Sort yourself out man

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[–] captainbucky (15252) 5 years ago

I understand . I was harsh and I’m sorry .

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[–] kspkap (13025) 5 years ago

Where’s the apology to me? The one you upset!😢

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[–] captainbucky (15252) 5 years ago

I’m sorry if I upset you

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[–] captainbucky (15252) 5 years ago

I misunderstood what you were saying. I apologize

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[–] kspkap (13025) 5 years ago

Apology accepted.😌 Now, do you care to enlighten me how or what you misunderstood?

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[–] captainbucky (15252) 5 years ago

I just saw school shooting and just sort of crumbled . At our school we had an abduction attempt last week and I guess I’m still shaky . Thanks for accepting my apology

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[–] kspkap (13025) 5 years ago

I can well understand you being on edge. Our Florida county schools had open access schools in the past. School rooms were accessed from the outside and were one level schools. In other words when students left one room to go to another class or to use the restrooms they were exposed to the elements. There was a porch roof over them, but with the storms we had in Florida most everyday there was little protection. They were fortunate if they didn’t have to attend school in portables.

One such school in Kissimmee was located at a busy intersection, completely open to anyone who wished to walk on campus. This was an elementary school, from kindergarten to grade six. One day a little girl, can’t recall the age, was excused to use the restroom. Then the horror happened! She was raped in the restroom by a piece of 💩 who just walked onto campus! It took that event to realize “Gee, maybe our schools should have fences around them.” Ya think? Also, set in place was a buddy system. Yeah, two little kids could take on a pervert!

This was during the population boom post-Disney. Those days of safety were no more. The school system authorities still had the mindset of pre-Disney where doors weren’t locked at night, schools were safe, folks could walk freely at night without fear, etc. Crime had arrived...we were no longer safe. It’s difficult for others to believe, but we had gun clubs in high school. The guys would walk to school with their rifles on their shoulders! The farthest thing from anyone’s mind was a school shooting! Fisticuffs were the result of anger...not guns! Innocence lost forever...never to return. 😔

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